Job Discussion Forums

squangela · Joined: 03 Feb 2003 Posts: 7

Malaga live and work situation????

squangela · Joined: 03 Feb 2003 Posts: 7

My husband and i are going to Malaga in September to look for work. Have any of you Dave's fans been there in a work sense. hablamos espanol so that is a plus but I don't know if there is any demand for teachers. What about substutuing at International schools?
gracias.
-A

Harry Swindells · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 39 Location: Warsaw,Poland

Without a passport from an EU country it is VERY difficult to find work in Spain and almost inmpossible to find legal work. It is most unlikely that you would be taken on as a substitute teacher by an international school as they would have to do all the paperwork for a visa just to allow you to step into the classroom. It's not worth them doing that for a person who is only substituting, they'll hire people with an EU passport

There is EFL work in Spain. I have several very good friends out there at the moment. But they are all qualified (BA plus CELTA or qualified school teachers), speak Spanish/Catalan, have several years experience in Spain, know the market well and they are having a difficulty finding work right now. If you are coming out and know nothing and nobody it would be VERY difficult. Add a lack of EU passport and the picture gets worse.

If you don't have an EU passport then it is possible to legally arrange work at international schools, especially the American schools. But that is almost always done from outside Spain (you need to have the work permit done in the USA). And those schools can afford to be very picky about who they take, they always have plenty of applicants.

Harry

squangela · Joined: 03 Feb 2003 Posts: 7

Thanks for all the SUPER informative information...

Maybe as a fall back we will try some winery work.

So, Harry, do you know anything about grape picking or are you just an authority on everything else in Europe? What about teaching EFL at a winery?

thx

Harry Swindells · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 39 Location: Warsaw,Poland

You don't seem to get the picture do you? If you don't have an EU passport then it is VERY difficult to get a work permit. If you can't get a work permit then you can not get jobs. Whether that is teaching English in a school or a winery, substituting at an international school or picking grapes.

I think that you don't understand the realities of working illegally. To an employer your labour is equally valuable to people from Morocco, Algeria, Belarus, Romania etc etc. You will receive the same pay as people from those countries. People from those countries have much lower expectations that citizens of the USA do. They are quite happy to live on wages that you would laugh at. Let me put it this way: would you like to go and work with the illegal immigrants in Southern California on the farms there? No? Then you shouldn't consider doing it in Spain.

It is not necessary to be any kind of an expert to know these facts. All you need to do is read up a tiny bit about Europe. Things have changed just a little bit since the glorious days of Hemmingway when everybody went and picked grapes. You seem to be quite happy to react badly towards my presenting the facts of life to you. Fine. Have it your way. Learn the hard way. I've been in teaching in Europe for more than 10 years. I've worked with and without an EU passport. Ignore what I have to say if you want to. Just don't come back here and whine about how unfortunate you are when you blow all your money and end up working as illegal farm labour for $5 a day.

Harry

squangela · Joined: 03 Feb 2003 Posts: 7

Wait a minute harry. I thought this forum was to help people. Not unload a bunch of arrogant quips in an effort to discourage people who still have a thread of optimism about their future.
If you know anything about what working in Spain great. What do you know? If you don't... quit clogging up this post.
I am not interested in hearing all the permit stuff.
I know that.. I have lived there and all over the Americas.

My question is ....Do you know the work situation in Malaga???

Deborah · Joined: 14 Feb 2003 Posts: 19

Squang, I think Harry was very patient and I don't read his reply as condescending or overly negative in any way. The EU thing is honestly a very difficult to impossible hurdle - not impossible in every case, but worth serious consideration.
I"m speaking as someone who has personally experienced the difficulties - albeit not in Spain.
I can offer a small piece of advice that might be actually helpful: check out the Spanish Embassy (Washington, DC) website. It should offer details regarding employment possibilities for US citizens in Spain.

reality · Joined: 13 Mar 2003 Posts: 105

Harry is absoutely right. I have been looking for work in the Malaga area for two months. I found that their are just too many Teachers, and not enough students.

Its amazing that you get immediate Job offerings, which offer better pay and conditions than in Spain. Yet, no one is looking for Teachers during the months of March to June ( Several Schools told me this fact). Some schools are closed during the Summer Months!.

Do not gamble on finding work in this area. Expatriate salaries are already the lowest in the EEC. Renting a place is expensive because
landlords charge Tourist rates.

Non-EU passport holders can be hired, due to some loophole in the local employment Laws. Yet, they earn even less than expatriates here. So, don�t come, unless you have savings, and want to play roulette looking for a job.

reality · Joined: 13 Mar 2003 Posts: 105

Regarding Malaga. Rather you than me. I just want to ask one question, Why do so many thitry-something English Women like Spain?.

fatgirl · Joined: 22 May 2003 Posts: 12

Work for Non-europeans is available if you are prepared to put up with a lot of hassle. It sounds like you�re going to come anyway so here�s some info.
Some of the more shadey schools will employ you. Normally you will be paid in cash. As you speak Spanish you can also give private classes at $10-15 hour and you need to put an ad in "el anuciador" which is a newpaper you can buy anywhere. Put your ad in early September.

Some American people I met last year were earning as little as $600 30hours pw including Saturdays.

If you have some money behind you you�ll probably live at lot better, it�s a great place but it�s a b**ch when you�re poor.

As for why lots of 30+ year old women want to work in Malaga have you never seen Shirley Valentine?

Yellowseaman · Joined: 03 Jun 2003 Posts: 6

I juggled for a year in Spain it was great but when I landed in Malaga they threw me in Jail for vagrancy.I was released the next day and enjoyed the rest of my time there.My advice is learn to spell because you cannot just expect to find work substutuing at an international school.Juggling is an option but even working in street entertainment there is a lot of competition.

Sev · Joined: 27 May 2003 Posts: 3

Having spent almost three years teaching English in Spain (illegally for the first six months), I would like to add some additional information to the debate.

Teaching English in Madrid without an EU passport, a TEFL qualification and a university degree is NOT impossible. In fact, many language schools in Madrid rely on illegal American teachers (qualified or not) for their workforces simply because they understand how cumbersome, picky, lengthy and annoying the work paper process is. True, they could be fined up to a E100,000 -- if anyone were looking for illegal teachers. But in my time here, I have NEVER heard of a school getting busted for hiring teachers under the table. The schools simply refuse to lose business because of a risk that never seems to come to pass. Furthermore, I have American and Australian friends who have been here for longer than I have and who refuse to go the legal route, simply because doing so would incur costs and paperwork that may not lead to anything except deportation.

Remember that Madrid, a city of around five million inhabitants, has an estimated 300,000 illegal workers from Morocco, China, Pakistan, South America and eastern Europe. An English teacher of any colour without an EU passport is SO far down on their list of priorities that it�s not worth worrying about.

Best,

Sev

selmo · Joined: 12 Jun 2003 Posts: 47 Location: China

Hi I lived in Spain from 96 to 998 and I thought it was great. As for not having an EU passport you can find work but as one guy said don't romanticise it like Hemming way. I am currently living in China and have been in Asia for 4 years . Spain is the only country in Europe I would consider living in . The people are nice and the culture is great. I think the people who dont like it are the people who just want Sun and thier own culture. I will be hopefully going there in August to have a good smoke and eat some good food . My tip for Spain is stay away from the Costas

scot47 · Joined: 10 Jan 2003 Posts: 15343

I see this has resurfaced again with the requests from non-EU citizens who want to experience life as illegals in Spain.

How romantic !

rogan · Joined: 03 Mar 2003 Posts: 416 Location: at home, in France

Some people just don't listen to the advice they ask for. Exclamation

You should know that the 4 largest Teaching franchise chains have gone bust and closed down so opportunities are fewer than they were previously.

Hearsay evidence from 4 or 5 or 6 years ago is useless.

Come to Europe.
Work illegally.
Get busted.
Get thrown out.

Maybe write to your Representative and have the Govmt change your entry laws and work permit situation and maybe Europe would open up for people from N.America.

On another board I suggested that illegal teachers should be reported to the authorities. Shocked

People screamed, insulted me and generally went berserk Razz

The odd thing was that most of the people who didn't like my comments were people complaining about the "unfair" recruiting policies in Europe. Confused