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things you cannot get used to
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ALX



Joined: 19 Sep 2012
Posts: 36
Location: The Big Hill

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Remember that Japan was never a multi-cultural nation. It was forced to open up by Perry and his Black Ships. That event is still part of the national psyche. Japan only tolerates foreigners out of necessity. It is what it is I guess.
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Rooster_2006



Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ALX wrote:
Remember that Japan was never a multi-cultural nation. It was forced to open up by Perry and his Black Ships. That event is still part of the national psyche. Japan only tolerates foreigners out of necessity. It is what it is I guess.
Yeah, it is what it is. It's not right that Japan gives preference based on racial criteria, but that's the way it is.

However, to bring this back on topic, the title of this thread is "things you can't get used to." And apologists who defend racial discrimination (ironic since they themselves are being discriminated against) are something in Japan that I cannot get used to, which was my original point.

Even if I do not agree with a Japanese bigot, I can at least understand his viewpoint. I was a young man once, too, and had to compete with immigrants (many of which were illegal) for low-wage, low-prestige jobs. And when I finally got my first job, I was immediately taxed, and some of my taxes went to supporting those immigrants.

Did I go out and beat up an immigrant? No.

Did I vote for a far-right policitian? No.

Did I take to Washington, D.C. with a big cardboard sign and advocate a whites-only America? No.

However, I can at least understand a bigot's viewpoint even if I disagree with him. He's acting in his own interests. He just wants to survive.

Apologists, however, I simply cannot understand. They act counter to their own interests. They are the reverse of everything that Darwin and nature stand for. They are organisms that seek their own destruction.

As you said, Japan is what it is. And I am what I am a guy with a set of beliefs about racial equality and the right to complain about the lack thereof when one exists.
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ALX



Joined: 19 Sep 2012
Posts: 36
Location: The Big Hill

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Be neither neither a basher nor an apologist. Be stoic.
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Rooster_2006



Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ALX wrote:
Be neither neither a basher nor an apologist.
I can agree with this. Both extremes are bad.
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ALX



Joined: 19 Sep 2012
Posts: 36
Location: The Big Hill

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rooster_2006 wrote:
ALX wrote:
Be neither neither a basher nor an apologist.
I can agree with this. Both extremes are bad.


For real. Taking those extreme positions means that you're always angry at someone or something. Do you really want to live that way?
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hagiwaramai



Joined: 24 May 2010
Posts: 119
Location: Marines Stadium

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rooster_2006 wrote:

Apologists, however, I simply cannot understand. They act counter to their own interests. They are the reverse of everything that Darwin and nature stand for. They are organisms that seek their own destruction.

Not that it really matters, and I agree with most everything else you said,but I think you're a bit off the mark here. Apologists imagine themselves to almost be Japanese, which is one way to deal with crap when it's thrown at you and you feel too weak to respond, basically joining the bullies side and pretending, or trying to pretend, that it's not you who's being bullied. Other people maybe but not you. Kind of like the kidnapped and the kidnapper forming such a bond that the kidnapped sees the kidnapper like a friend and will actually defend them. Pretty common apparently. It may be hard to understand but it is a self-preservation technique, even though superficially it may not seem to be.
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Rooster_2006



Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hagiwaramai wrote:
Rooster_2006 wrote:

Apologists, however, I simply cannot understand. They act counter to their own interests. They are the reverse of everything that Darwin and nature stand for. They are organisms that seek their own destruction.

Not that it really matters, and I agree with most everything else you said,but I think you're a bit off the mark here. Apologists imagine themselves to almost be Japanese, which is one way to deal with crap when it's thrown at you and you feel too weak to respond, basically joining the bullies side and pretending, or trying to pretend, that it's not you who's being bullied. Other people maybe but not you. Kind of like the kidnapped and the kidnapper forming such a bond that the kidnapped sees the kidnapper like a friend and will actually defend them. Pretty common apparently. It may be hard to understand but it is a self-preservation technique, even though superficially it may not seem to be.
On careful reflection of what you just wrote, I can see what you mean and may even agree. The apologist might truly believe (or at least his subconscious might believe) that the act of becoming an apologist is the surest path to survival.

This has been seen many, many times in history when people become "collaborators" with an occupying force. And as you pointed out, it is also seen in people who are kidnapped, and in people who are bullied.

I would still consider apologism a pathology, though, kind of along the lines of Stockholm Syndrome, battered-wife syndrome, or PTSD. It's a short-term survival mechanism that arises in response to something traumatic. They might increase an organism's chance of surviving in the short run, but are not desirable in the long run.
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ALX



Joined: 19 Sep 2012
Posts: 36
Location: The Big Hill

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apologists are just constantly entranced with being in the land of anime, manga, and samurai.

Kinda like kids in Disneyland.
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Rooster_2006



Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Posts: 984

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:20 pm    Post subject: