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Newbie TEFL going to China! Potentially Racist?(Please read)
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MsBlackcurrant



Joined: 22 Aug 2012
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Denim-Maniac

You may well be right, but can you explain to me why one sees so many job adverts, on supposedly reputable websites, that say a degree isn't necessary?

I can't see why a degree in Drama wouldn't be suitable for a job teaching nursery school children! And those jobs seem to pay very well, too.
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RPMcMurphy



Joined: 22 Aug 2012
Posts: 90
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

relaxtischina wrote:
[ Always being tagged a "foreigner" even if you have been married to a local for many years can be seen as an example of this.


It gets better!
Chinese who migrate to, or are students in, Western countries call the locals "foreigners", be it in English or Chinese. I don't think their vocabulary gives them any viable alternatives.
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thatsforsure



Joined: 11 Sep 2012
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

no , they dont. you are probly thinking of the word " laowai" . that is two caracters, one for old and one for outside. that "outside' dont mean "outside the country ". it means outside the chinese race. so no matter where you are, your going to be outside the chinese race. it dont translate to foreiner the way you think of that word. it translates as "nonchinese person ,
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fred13331



Joined: 20 Feb 2012
Posts: 108
Location: Southern China

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 3:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MsBlackcurrant wrote:
Denim-Maniac

You may well be right, but can you explain to me why one sees so many job adverts, on supposedly reputable websites, that say a degree isn't necessary?

I can't see why a degree in Drama wouldn't be suitable for a job teaching nursery school children! And those jobs seem to pay very well, too.


'A degree is a government pre-requisite for a legal work visa.'

DM also said this.

Those adverts you refer to will ask you to work illegally. ""Come on a tourist / business visa and we will sort it out when you get here''

To work here legally, you need a degree.

''but can you explain to me why one sees so many job adverts, on supposedly reputable websites, that say a degree isn't necessary? ''

The explanation is simple

a) You will be illegal (see above)
b) There is no such thing as a 'reputable' website when it comes to accepting advertising $$$. Some notoriously bad schools advertise right here, but, they pays their money, so no-one cares.

There may be a website out there which vets potential advertiser schools, only accepting decent ones, but I have yet to come across it. Most websites which accepts adverts are in it for the money.


Last edited by fred13331 on Sat Sep 29, 2012 9:04 am; edited 1 time in total
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Denim-Maniac



Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1238

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MsBlackcurrant wrote:
Denim-Maniac

You may well be right, but can you explain to me why one sees so many job adverts, on supposedly reputable websites, that say a degree isn't necessary?

I can't see why a degree in Drama wouldn't be suitable for a job teaching nursery school children! And those jobs seem to pay very well, too.


See fred13331's post above. Some shady employers will ask you to work illegally. Or, they may ask you to do illegal things to secure a visa. Either way, these types of jobs are probably best avoided. If you are so desperate to come to China that you can only take these bottom-feeder, risky jobs, you're probably better not coming. Horror stories are abound.

OK, Drama?

If you view teaching as just acting and entertaining, then you could argue that a drama degree is a valid study option prior to entering TEFL. Your advice was to tell someone who had no relevant qualifications to study drama. My counter was to suggest the study of education / linguistics / TEFL would be a better idea.

There is actually a mountain of study and research into language acquisition in childhood. And if you want to teach at nursery school level knowledge of this research 'might' be useful. Study education and you may learn about childhood language acquisition. Study drama and you wont. End of.
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MsBlackcurrant



Joined: 22 Aug 2012
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My understanding was that almost any degree was sufficient to embark on a career in EFL, if you also have TEFL training. Some degrees may be more obviously relevant than others, but it seems rare for a school to expect a BA in Linguistics/TEFL. But as it happens, I have actually seen a couple of adverts for summer schools that use drama as part of their methodology, and therefore require teachers that have studied drama.
So I don't agree that Drama is a useless subject in TEFL. But if you think that's a ridiculous idea, I'm not inclined to argue with you about it.

I accept what you say about the $$$.
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Trinley



Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 144

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's been 5 years since I worked in China so things may have changed, but here's my experience. I worked for 2 schools in Nanjing -- a college and a language institute. Both were willing to hire black teachers. I do know that there is racism against blacks in China, though, so I can't say that it will be as easy for you as it is for white teachers to get hired. An African colleague told me about the racism he encountered from other schools when looking for work.

Second, you do technically need a minimum of a bachelor's degree to get a foreign expert's certificate. I only had an associate's degree (2 -year) and a TEFL certificate, but I got hired very quickly. I had no previous experience either, except a few weeks of volunteering. I later learned that my school had made a fake BA for me so they could hire me. Both of my schools had hired teachers without degrees, as had many other schools I knew of, both universities and language institutes. These are not prestigious schools or anything, but they were fine and I was treated fairly.

My opinion is that you should get a TEFL or CELTA and volunteer a bit -- not only to help you get hired but to give you some experience teaching. It's only fair to your students that you actually know what you're doing. Then look online for jobs. DEFINITELY get your WORK visa before you go to China. Don't come for work on a tourist visa. Any work contract you sign without a work visa would be void.
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choudoufu



Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 3254
Location: Mao-berry, PRC

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MsBlackcurrant wrote:
My understanding was that almost any degree was sufficient to embark on a career in EFL, if you also have TEFL training. Some degrees may be more obviously relevant than others, but it seems rare for a school to expect a BA in Linguistics/TEFL. But as it happens, I have actually seen a couple of adverts for summer schools that use drama as part of their methodology, and therefore require teachers that have studied drama.
So I don't agree that Drama is a useless subject in TEFL. But if you think that's a ridiculous idea, I'm not inclined to argue with you about it.


you would be partially correct. as we are on the china board, the
requirements to work legally in china are a 4-yr degree, 2 years of
post-graduation work experience, and 25 years of age. for the purpose
of employment in china a degree in drama is as good as a degree
in nukular physics. there is no government requirement for tefl
certification or training.

you may perhaps find some prestigious universities or international
schools that require specific degrees, training or certification. be
aware that the enforcement of the work requirements is spotty. in
some areas it is possible to get a valid work visa without a degree.

seeing a couple ads calling for drama is a nice anecdote, but
certainly is not representative of teaching in china.
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Alexus22



Joined: 19 Aug 2012
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Regarding the race issue I'm of Pakistani origin and I've gotten on average 3 job offers a week since I started applying around Asia. During a Skype interview one of them asked me:

"Your name is of different origin, what is your ethnic background?"

"My parents are from Pakistan."

"Oh Pakistan ok".

"Does it matter?"

"No it's no problem so long as you are not Asian (meaning East Asian)."

She went on to say that some parents didn't want their children to be taught English by an East Asian teacher.
Rolling Eyes

I've no idea how they would take to Somalis though.
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Pilot82



Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Posts: 150

PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I taught in China for 4 years with my TEFL and Associates.....started with an english school then I went to teach public schools....Being Black didn't affect me from being hired....They just wanted english speaking AMERICANS....QUALIFIED OR NOT!

In fact I think being Black enhanced my experiences for the better...got alot of compliments and friends....now obviously of course there was racist jerks but I didn't let them deter me of my fun...they aren't worth my time and definately not worth yours....if anyone was curious about me...

I was more than friendly for them to know me better. The better of my chinese friends had my back.... Knowing some chinese helped...I was complimented for my teaching methods and my experience was a mixed bag of everything....everybody is different in hw they handle things...but I had thick skin...and found myself to be above those of racist mindsets....how they hire and enforce laws vary from region to region....so to sum it all up for....get your credentials and go for it!
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