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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 10781
Location: Turris fortis mihi deus
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 Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Well,of course, people who are "superior" deserve oodles more cash. Quite right too. Gussie Fink-Nottle and I were talking about that the other day. |
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Blackbear
Joined: 20 Jan 2013
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:30 am Post subject: |
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Lurking for some time ...
All very interesting, but in KSA is there an age limit of say 60 years for new hires? |
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cmp45
Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 1262
Location: KSA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 4:45 am Post subject: |
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| Chinaski wrote: |
| Allizwell wrote: |
| I can assure you, Nomad Soul, that the 20K-salary (and above) jobs do indeed exist for teachers with regular ol' uni backgrounds and no specialized quals. My colleagues "just" have standard prep-year quals (MA, certs, uni experience) and are asked to teach mostly ESP, which involves using texts such as Tech Talk and others. Since I have these quals as well, I myself interviewed for one of these positions |
When I lived in Korea my friends and I were making 2-3 times what most teachers made. When people became aware of it they almost always said it wasn't possible or that we were full of shit...
I respect people with more Saudi experience than me, and trust them when they tell me what average salaries are. I don't, however, trust them when they tell me that I (personally) can't do better than average.
Everywhere I go I have defied the averages, and would put money down that I will do it again if I move to Saudi.
One thing that always seems to stack the deck in my favor is that I take my time about things...and never look for jobs when I need them. I always look when I have a good deal already, and then only upgrade when it suits me.
It may not work this time, but then I won't move on (if not forced to through circumstance). I don't understand why this type of thinking gets under people's skin.
I think I went about asking things in a nice way, and just said, "If I can't make this, it's not worth it for me at this time..."
Chinaski |
You started the thread requesting opinions about salary expectations. However, based upon your comments, you appear to have already known your salary expectations. It just seems that you started this post more to toot your own horn: your superior qualifications and superior current salary or perhaps you just wanted to confirm for your self that yes you are superior to most others.  You then go on to say you don't understand why it gets under people's skin...perhaps it has to do with the way you write about yourself and how you make others seem...well... just so average.. Generally speaking, your style or approach may be off putting (as you stated yourself) to others due to a lack of humility. But heh if it works for you...obviously you are everything you say you are and more We all like to believe we are the best we can be, but after reading your post I come away feeling oh so average!  |
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Chinaski
Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 38
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:34 am Post subject: |
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| Allizwell wrote: |
| You have the right attitude, and as a result will eventually go beyond "the average," I predict. We both know it can certainly be done. Good luck! |
Thank you.
Finally I feel understood. 
scot47 wrote:
| Quote: |
| Well,of course, people who are "superior" deserve oodles more cash. |
Don't be that way mr. scot; it doesn't look good on you. 
Maybe you can reply to the other thread where I clarified that I was only requesting info on what kind of salary I might expect but, as an aside, mentioned that it wouldn't be worth it at this time to go for less than 20k+ bennies.
cmp45 wrote:
| Quote: |
| You started the thread requesting opinions about salary expectations. However, based upon your comments, you appear to have already known your salary expectations. |
Everyone knows what they will accept at any given time. And that package can change in time. I wanted to know the general market and how posters felt I fit within it...and now I do. And I appreciate it.
| Quote: |
| It just seems that you started this post more to toot your own horn: your superior qualifications and superior current salary or perhaps you just wanted to confirm for your self that yes you are superior to most others. You then go on to say you don't understand why it gets under people's skin...perhaps it has to do with the way you write about yourself and how you make others seem...well... just so average.. Generally speaking, your style or approach may be off putting (as you stated yourself) to others due to a lack of humility. But heh if it works for you...obviously you are everything you say you are and more |
Posting qualifications, professional background, figures, and expectations is par for course for this thread. So is some banter regarding the aforementioned. I never dwell on such things otherwise. 
| Quote: |
| We all like to believe we are the best we can be, but after reading your post I come away feeling oh so average! |
Don't ever do that to yourself. You are good enough.
But seriously, I am sure there is nothing wrong with what you're doing, and there is certainly nothing wrong with what I'm doing.
I'm working in a job I like and exploring other options. If one of those options is "superior" then I will take it. I am looking for superior OPTIONS, not because *I* am superior, but because that's what we are supposed to do aren't we?
blackbear wrote:
| Quote: |
Lurking for some time ...
All very interesting, but in KSA is there an age limit of say 60 years for new hires? |
Thread-jacker
Chinaski |
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cmp45
Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 1262
Location: KSA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:52 am Post subject: |
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| Well you certainly are not lacking in self-confidence...kudos to you for setting the bar high and achieving the goals you set for yourself. I would say that alot of what one achieves in life is related to self confidence. Good luck in your pursuit of more $$$$ |
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Chinaski
Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 38
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:20 am Post subject: |
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| cmp45 wrote: |
| Well you certainly are not lacking in self-confidence...kudos to you for setting the bar high and achieving the goals you set for yourself. I would say that alot of what one achieves in life is related to self confidence. Good luck in your pursuit of more $$$$ |
Thank you...
And I'm happy that we can all finally unbutton out top button , enjoy some banter, and explore what's on offer together.
All the best, likewise, and see you on-board...
Chinaski |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 1689
Location: Al Mamlaka
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 7:04 am Post subject: |
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| Allizwell wrote: |
| I can assure you, Nomad Soul, that the 20K-salary (and above) jobs do indeed exist for teachers with regular ol' uni backgrounds and no specialized quals. My colleagues "just" have standard prep-year quals (MA, certs, uni experience) and are asked to teach mostly ESP, which involves using texts such as Tech Talk and others. Since I have these quals as well, I myself interviewed for one of these positions recently and can confirm the salary amounts and the quals required. |
I don't doubt such salaries exist; you'll notice in my response that I specifically mentioned ESP for teaching opportunities that pay more.
I've also taught ESP for previous employers who recognized I had the skillset and work experience in the domain they were targeting for the students. I ended up being the only teacher qualified and willing to teach the class. My colleagues with 5+ years of typical university TEFL experience wouldn't touch it because they felt uncomfortable teaching English within a subject they had no basic knowledge of or interest in. And recently, my present employer mentioned my prior TESP experience for upcoming ESP classes.
Anyway, my point was that teaching subject English isn't for everyone. Employers willing to pay big money prefer language teachers who have at least some fundamental knowledge of the subject (or a willingness to receive in-service training on it), an understanding of TESP, and more importantly, the aptitude and confidence to teach it.
I hope you get the position and that it works out for you. And perhaps Chinaski will be joining you there someday. |
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Blackbear
Joined: 20 Jan 2013
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 7:17 am Post subject: |
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| Chinaski wrote: |
blackbear wrote:
| Quote: |
Lurking for some time ...
All very interesting, but in KSA is there an age limit of say 60 years for new hires? |
Thread-jacker
Chinaski |
Having a bad hair day Chinaski, or are you always like this?
It seems I cannot ask an honest question from "experienced" folks like yourself without getting a swat.
Some welcome to this forum  |
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Chinaski
Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 38
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:00 am Post subject: |
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| Blackbear wrote: |
| Chinaski wrote: |
blackbear wrote:
| Quote: |
Lurking for some time ...
All very interesting, but in KSA is there an age limit of say 60 years for new hires? |
Thread-jacker
Chinaski |
Having a bad hair day Chinaski, or are you always like this?
It seems I cannot ask an honest question from "experienced" folks like yourself without getting a swat.
Some welcome to this forum |
Undo that top button, my friend. I'm just having fun.
I think you should post the question in a new thread. It will probably get more exposure, and therefore more responses.
nomad soul wrote:
| Quote: |
| Anyway, my point was that teaching subject English isn't for everyone. Employers willing to pay big money prefer language teachers who have at least some fundamental knowledge of the subject (or a willingness to receive in-service training on it), an understanding of TESP, and more importantly, the aptitude and confidence to teach it. |
I totally agree.
Many "ESL" teachers (myself included for many years) try to coast on their native knowledge of English and don't endeavor to develop their skills further. They "hate" teaching writing, learning grammar, or learning and/or utilizing new technologies.
Those that do the latter can't exactly "write their ticket", but are a much rarer (and therefore more expensive) commodity.
| Quote: |
| I hope you get the position and that it works out for you. And perhaps Chinaski will be joining you there someday. |
Well, I do like making like-minded friends and networking.
Chinaski |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 10781
Location: Turris fortis mihi deus
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:30 am Post subject: |
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| Oh Lord, it's hard to be humble ! |
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Chinaski
Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 38
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:34 am Post subject: |
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^
Hi mr. scot.
It's chilly out. Don't forget your sweater. |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 14853
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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Never mind Scot47... he's taken on the role of board curmudgeon and has been doing a great job for many many years here. 
And Blackbear... it is nearly impossible for someone 60 or more to get a first job in the Gulf. Unless you have a specific skill-set that they are seeking, and/or have been teaching Arabic speakers for many years. Getting hired starts to get tough after 55 for the tolerable employers...
VS |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 10781
Location: Turris fortis mihi deus
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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VS
Curmudgeoning is a hard job but someone has to do it ! |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 1689
Location: Al Mamlaka
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Chinaski wrote: |
Many "ESL" teachers (myself included for many years) try to coast on their native knowledge of English and don't endeavor to develop their skills further. They "hate" teaching writing, learning grammar, or learning and/or utilizing new technologies.
Those that do the latter can't exactly "write their ticket", but are a much rarer (and therefore more expensive) commodity. |
We can all agree experience teaching conversation classes is not going to move one up the TEFL ladder in terms of pay or getting the better teacher jobs; yet, it's not just about knowing how to use technology in the classroom either. Continuing education and professional development are key, which means gaining knowledge or having experience in areas such as curriculum design; language test construction; academic writing (which you say you have); instructional technology and e-learning; teacher training; teaching IELTS/TOEFL/SAT test preparation; teaching ESP (e.g., English for academic purposes, medical English, aviation English, business English, legal English, English for tourism...); and so on. (Whew!) That's how teachers become more marketable and sought after. |
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Chinaski
Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 38
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 7:57 pm Post subject: |
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| scot47 wrote: |
VS
Curmudgeoning is a hard job but someone has to do it ! |
Yer doing a great job at it, and don't let anyone tell you any different.
nomad soul:
| Quote: |
| We can all agree experience teaching conversation classes is not going to move one up the TEFL ladder in terms of pay or getting the better teacher jobs; yet, it's not just about knowing how to use technology in the classroom either. Continuing education and professional development are key, which means gaining knowledge or having experience in areas such as curriculum design; language test construction; academic writing (which you say you have); instructional technology and e-learning; teacher training; teaching IELTS/TOEFL/SAT test preparation; teaching ESP (e.g., English for academic purposes, medical English, aviation English, business English, legal English, English for tourism...); and so on. (Whew!) That's how teachers become more marketable and sought after. |
I agree 100%, and if I can let the booze speak for me at this moment, it is about *passion*. I finally have a passion for teaching and learning and if it doesn't directly translate into money for me I am fine with that.
But if an employer wants my skills...they still have to pay for them.
Chinaski
ps. Currently I am getting into technology in the classroom; mindomo, moodle, jing, etc. Exciting stuff! |
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