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Why only Vietnam & Thailand offer the DELTA in Asia?
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Sashadroogie



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 8607
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise

PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LongShiKong wrote:


Then I surmised that perhaps the western-based, student-centered pedagogical qual's such as the Delta might not appeal to so-called Confucian sensibilities despite how westernized they may be in their thinking, particularly when the western model appears so 'left behind'


Tend to agree this discussion is pointless. But with lines of argument such as the above, there isn't a lot of scope for fruitful exchanges.
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vabeckele



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 439

PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sashadroogie wrote:
LongShiKong wrote:


Then I surmised that perhaps the western-based, student-centered pedagogical qual's such as the Delta might not appeal to so-called Confucian sensibilities despite how westernized they may be in their thinking, particularly when the western model appears so 'left behind'


Tend to agree this discussion is pointless. But with lines of argument such as the above, there isn't a lot of scope for fruitful exchanges.


Are you fruity too, Sash? Wink
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Sashadroogie



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 8607
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise

PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps more of a fruitcake, or nutcase. At least, that is what many would say due to my holding that EFL teachers should get basic training, such as Celta. Maybe even Delta later on, especially if you want that plum job with the BC. Yes, basic training, even for EFL classes in the Far East, where I'm told schools don't give a fig about such matters. But saying that seems to upset the apple cart. Discussions such as this thread rarely bear fruit, as many contributions are really just trying to compare apples and oranges, and cherry-picking various bits of data from irrelevant reports.

Still, those who have said quals know that the fruit of their labour tastes so much sweeter than the lemons that are always proffered in their stead by bad apples.

Eat from the tree of knowledge, comrades! You won't be cast out of paradise: you gain admittance to it. Join us : )
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vabeckele



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 439

PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 8:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sashadroogie wrote:
Perhaps more of a fruitcake, or nutcase. At least, that is what many would say due to my holding that EFL teachers should get basic training, such as Celta. Maybe even Delta later on, especially if you want that plum job with the BC. Yes, basic training, even for EFL classes in the Far East, where I'm told schools don't give a fig about such matters. But saying that seems to upset the apple cart. Discussions such as this thread rarely bear fruit, as many contributions are really just trying to compare apples and oranges, and cherry-picking various bits of data from irrelevant reports.

Still, those who have said quals know that the fruit of their labour tastes so much sweeter than the lemons that are always proffered in their stead by bad apples.

Eat from the tree of knowledge, comrades! You won't be cast out of paradise: you gain admittance to it. Join us : )


Jeez, talk about stepping on a snakes tail... Smile

I haven't forgotten I owe you one.
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Sashadroogie



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 8607
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise

PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Favour? I can't recall what favours I may have done to bring about being owed one, or anything else. My memory's rotten to the core. Of course, it is highly possible that I was highly intoxicated at the time. I'm extremely generous and expansive then, hic! So was my father, and his before him. The apple never falls far from the tree. Otherwise, I am just as sour as a bunch of grapes. At least until teacher's pet puts an apple on my desk, to keep the doctor away.
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LongShiKong



Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 881
Location: China

PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sashadroogie wrote:
Tend to agree this discussion is pointless. But with lines of argument such as the above, there isn't a lot of scope for fruitful exchanges.


Well, at least you responded to the topic. Your question about the size of the small-class market in China got me thinking about the relative demand for higher qual'd teachers. If this is anything to go by, a search for the string "CELTA or equivalent" on the Korean Job Postings netted 91 hits, 236 for International and only 5 for China. My guess is the presence alone of IH Bangkok and ILA in HCMC appear to be raising the standards bar among their competition. That's not to say it can't happen in China.
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Sashadroogie



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 8607
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise

PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always respond to the topic, provided I know what the topic is.

As to other reasons for the lack of Delta training in China and elsewhere in the region, there is also the factor of level. Successful completion of the Delta will require lesson observations of lessons in classes of at least two clearly distinct levels, say, elementary and intermediate. I can only guess here that perhaps Delta isn't available on account of this being a problematic requirement for the majority of language schools in the region. Could be wrong about that, but it seems to be a regular refrain on the boards.

Similarly, teachers need to work in language schools that uphold basic standards related to group size, correct placement of learners into stable groups, commitment to professional development, and also commitment to communicative language lessons. Over-sized classes where all and any student gets bundled in for 'oral English' with the foreign teacher, and where grammar is taken care of by the local teacher through translation are never going to be accepted as a suitable working environment for Delta course trainees. Mainly on account of it not being readily conducive to real language learning.

Nothing to do with Confucius : )
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