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Thanks Speak Up, London
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the_thinker



Joined: 24 Nov 2009
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2013 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you'll find that the universities that are paying what look like very poor hourly rates actually base that figure on a 37 hour week or similar. That doesn't mean that you teach 37 hours, just that you are a full-time employee so technically that's what you're doing (including prep, marking, meetings etc.). So the hourly rate for teaching, which is what we as teachers are used to thinking in terms of, will be much higher.
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Stuka



Joined: 27 Aug 2012
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the_thinker wrote:
I think you'll find that the universities that are paying what look like very poor hourly rates actually base that figure on a 37 hour week or similar. That doesn't mean that you teach 37 hours, just that you are a full-time employee so technically that's what you're doing (including prep, marking, meetings etc.). So the hourly rate for teaching, which is what we as teachers are used to thinking in terms of, will be much higher.


Sorry, I don't get your argument. Whether you're teaching or just on-site doing prep or attending meetings or writing materials, you're still there and giving your time. If you were paid hourly, you could leave the school and teach elsewhere to bump up your income but most corporate run schools will not allow this, forcing you to stay on site and sacrifice all your valuable time and give it to the Corporation.
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the_thinker



Joined: 24 Nov 2009
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't really have an argument I'm just trying explain why the hourly rates sometimes look very low.

What I'm saying is that one university might offer, let's say, 40 per teaching hour and 20 teaching hours a week, which would be a decent wage. Another might have an advert that says 21 an hour, but this wouldn't be a rate based on teaching hours, but a 37-hour working week (containing 20 hours of teaching). So you would do the same amount of work in each, and get the same amount of money, it's just that the hourly rate is expressed differently.
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Stuka



Joined: 27 Aug 2012
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2013 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the_thinker wrote:
What I'm saying is that one university might offer, let's say, 40 per teaching hour and 20 teaching hours a week, which would be a decent wage.


This job pays well and the employer is very transparent about hourly rates and hours.

Quote:
Another might have an advert that says 21 an hour, but this wouldn't be a rate based on teaching hours, but a 37-hour working week (containing 20 hours of teaching). So you would do the same amount of work in each, and get the same amount of money, it's just that the hourly rate is expressed differently.


Here the hours are long and the hourly rate is appallingly low and the ad is opaque. Because many private corporations have taken over our beloved universities and want to exploit teachers without them realising it, the tendency these days is to write ads in this way.

Please dear TEFL teachers ensure that you read the ads carefully and all small print and don't sign anything until you know exactly how much you'll get for each hour of work done. Don't be a chump for these exploitative companies.
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the_thinker



Joined: 24 Nov 2009
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Here the hours are long and the hourly rate is appallingly low and the ad is opaque. Because many private corporations have taken over our beloved universities and want to exploit teachers without them realising it, the tendency these days is to write ads in this way.


No, I'm trying to say the job would be identical to the one offering 40 per teaching hour! Identical in terms of both the working hours and the pay! As teachers we're used to seeing pay rates per hour of teaching. But of course we do more than just the teaching hours we also prepare and do marking (and maybe other things too). Maybe these things would add up to 37 hours if you teach 20 hours a week. That's why sometimes the adverts express the pay rate based on a 37-hour working week.

So the job with an hourly pay rate based on 37 hours would be absolutely identical to one with an hourly pay rate based on 20 teaching hours.

I don't agree adverts like this are opaque. It's just many teachers aren't used to seeing hourly rates expressed this way.
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NilSatis82



Joined: 03 May 2009
Posts: 85

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even if adverts like this are opaque, it doesn't actually do the recruiter any favours. So if a teacher sees 21 an hour and assumes that is for a teaching hour, then they are going to believe the pay is lower than what it actually is. Not a very good trick on behalf of the employers if they are trying to cunningly mislead potential teachers!
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Stuka



Joined: 27 Aug 2012
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the_thinker wrote:
So the job with an hourly pay rate based on 37 hours would be absolutely identical to one with an hourly pay rate based on 20 teaching hours.


But they're not the absolutely identical. A job that pays hourly is far more attractive to me because I can just work for the hour and then leave and work elsewhere or have the time for myself. I'm an experienced teacher, so I don't need to prepare much, I just simply look through my old lessons or collection of ESL books and find something suitable for the class I'm teaching. Working in a corporate setting is exploitative in that it forces your hourly rate down by forcing you to be onsite for 40+ hours a week.
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Sublime



Joined: 23 Apr 2011
Posts: 90

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think I might apply Embarassed
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NilSatis82



Joined: 03 May 2009
Posts: 85

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 12:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stuka wrote:
the_thinker wrote:
So the job with an hourly pay rate based on 37 hours would be absolutely identical to one with an hourly pay rate based on 20 teaching hours.


But they're not the absolutely identical. A job that pays hourly is far more attractive to me because I can just work for the hour and then leave and work elsewhere or have the time for myself. I'm an experienced teacher, so I don't need to prepare much, I just simply look through my old lessons or collection of ESL books and find something suitable for the class I'm teaching. Working in a corporate setting is exploitative in that it forces your hourly rate down by forcing you to be onsite for 40+ hours a week.


Why is being present at your workplace 40 hours a week exploitative? That's normal for most jobs. Anyway, if you're earning 40 a teaching hour for 20 odd hours a week teaching on a pre-sessional course, then you're looking at working a similar amount of time in total anyway. There will be plenty of other things to do besides teaching and there certainly won't be much time to go and teach elsewhere.
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the_thinker



Joined: 24 Nov 2009
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Stuka"][quote="the_thinker"]So the job with an hourly pay rate based on 37 hours would be [b]absolutely identical[/b] to one with an hourly pay rate based on 20 teaching hours.[/quote]

But they're not the absolutely identical. A job that pays hourly is far more attractive to me because I can just work for the hour and then leave and work elsewhere or have the time for myself. I'm an experienced teacher, so I don't need to prepare much, I just simply look through my old lessons or collection of ESL books and find something suitable for the class I'm teaching. Working in a corporate setting is exploitative in that it forces your hourly rate down by forcing you to be onsite for 40+ hours a week.[/quote]

OK now I see your point. I really don't think they would insist you stay on site. I should imagine you'd just have to be there for teaching and meetings, but I've never worked for a university that describes its hourly rate in this way so I could be wrong.

But if you're going to teach an EAP course then the university might well have their own programme and materials so you might not just be able to dig out your old materials and reuse them.
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alphabetjim7



Joined: 21 Sep 2013
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is my intention to clarify a few issues relating to an English Academy known as Speak Up London, as a young enthusiastic teacher working through the ranks in order to fulfill my life long ambition to become a teacher I was presented with the opportunity to put my skills to the test by accepting an offer from Speak Up London, clearly a well structured professional, ambitious academy. I very much needed the experience which was fair to the wage I was offered for a NQT, I note with interest comments relating to the hourly rate considering many other such academies a fair and respectable wage. I soon proved myself and was then offered a much higher rate. I would like to thank SUL for their professionalism and quality which they provide students throughout Europe., perhaps the debate to focus on the quality of teachers rather than hourly rates paid by academies. There are so many "cowboy" academies in London at the moment who I would rather not work for even if they offered me double to what Speak Up London had offered me. So a big thank you to Speak Up London for continually improving the standards in the EFL sector and for giving a chance to someone like me who was rejected on so many occasions due to a saturated market of CELTA qualified teachers.
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alphabetjim7



Joined: 21 Sep 2013
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 10:48 am    Post subject: Re: Thanks Speak Up, London Reply with quote

It is my intention to clarify a few issues relating to an English Academy known as Speak Up London, as a young enthusiastic teacher working through the ranks in order to fulfill my life long ambition to become a teacher I was presented with the opportunity to put my skills to the test by accepting an offer from Speak Up London, clearly a well structured professional, ambitious academy. I very much needed the experience which was fair to the wage I was offered for a NQT, I note with interest comments relating to the hourly rate considering many other such academies a fair and respectable wage. I soon proved myself and was then offered a much higher rate. I would like to thank SUL for their professionalism and quality which they provide students throughout Europe., perhaps the debate to focus on the quality of teachers rather than hourly rates paid by academies. There are so many "cowboy" academies in London at the moment who I would rather not work for even if they offered me double to what Speak Up London had offered me. So a big thank you to Speak Up London for continually improving the standards in the EFL sector and for giving a chance to someone like me who was rejected on so many occasions due to a saturated market of CELTA qualified teachers.

john123 wrote:
http://www.tefl.com/jobs/job.html?jo_id=56277

CENTRAL LONDON - 9 POUNDS AN HOUR - I LOVE THE OH-SO KILLER LINE IN THE ADVERT:

'If this is not a rate you cannot accept, DO NOT APPLY'

Welcome to TEFL UK.

Thanks Speak UP, London

Regards
John
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Xie Lin



Joined: 21 Oct 2011
Posts: 288

PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

. I would like to thank SUL for their professionalism and quality which they provide students throughout Europe.,



Shocked Shocked Shocked

.
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Perilla



Joined: 09 Jul 2010
Posts: 773
Location: Hong Kong

PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

alphabetjim7 wrote:
It is my intention to clarify a few issues relating to an English Academy known as Speak Up London, as a young enthusiastic teacher working through the ranks in order to fulfill my life long ambition to become a teacher I was presented with the opportunity to put my skills to the test by accepting an offer from Speak Up London, clearly a well structured professional, ambitious academy. I very much needed the experience which was fair to the wage I was offered for a NQT, I note with interest comments relating to the hourly rate considering many other such academies a fair and respectable wage. I soon proved myself and was then offered a much higher rate. I would like to thank SUL for their professionalism and quality which they provide students throughout Europe., perhaps the debate to focus on the quality of teachers rather than hourly rates paid by academies. There are so many "cowboy" academies in London at the moment who I would rather not work for even if they offered me double to what Speak Up London had offered me. So a big thank you to Speak Up London for continually improving the standards in the EFL sector and for giving a chance to someone like me who was rejected on so many occasions due to a saturated market of CELTA qualified teachers.


This, quite obviously, is a crock. Or should that be crook?
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Captain Coddo



Joined: 04 Feb 2012
Posts: 22
Location: East Coast

PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:21 pm    Post subject: speak up Reply with quote

Thanks for the great laugh, Speak Up! Clearly the piece above was NOT written by an English teacher, as the punctuation is SO bad!

It probably came for one of the under-educated Asian owners, what with its sub-GCSE grammar and clearly management-influenced vocabulary.

I guess they must be having problems recruiting teachers to work for their awful wages!
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