Job Discussion Forums

[Dream_Seller]

I plan on getting a CELTA but is that enough?

Should I get a Masters before?

Experience will teach me?

I don't want to be a clown for kids. I want to have a day job while building my reputation so I can have a decent side hustle (tutoring, teaching groups, etc).

I am more entrepreneurial oriented than academic minded, I'll leave those plush jobs for someone else. But I can't tutor if I only know how to read a lesson plan and only offer the fact I am a native born English speaker (BA+CELTA). To make money you have to offer value. You can scam someone once or twice but eventually it won't last.

[mark_in_saigon]

[Dream_Seller]

BA Business (major Entrepreneurship)
CELTA-- I plan on getting that in Vietnam

So pretty much I will need experience to be an effective teacher and to tutor on side.

Thanks I appreciate your time.

[mark_in_saigon]

Business is good, in my opinion it can help you a lot with understanding how to deal with life generally. If you also have a lot of related work experience, there are teaching jobs that pay more than average for business trainers. Not saying your expectation should be to land one of those immediately, just saying that your qualifications should be quite acceptable. I do not think a Masters or even a PhD gives you a lot of extra improvement in ability for doing this particular work. In some cases, it could get you noticed for a job. In other cases, it could cause employers to not want to hire you, thinking you would never be satisfied with what they have to offer. Anyway, (in my opinion only) pursuing a Masters for the purpose of understanding how teach English in Vietnam is not a very good use of time and money, though it may certainly be of great value in many other ways, especially if you do go back, as most do.

Lessons from the west are about the west, the VN system is very different. In fact, one of the great problems of teaching here is all the material has all this background information that relates to the west, and so they are not just learning the vocabulary, they are fighting through these constant references to places they will never go, names they will never hear, ideas they will never use, dialects they will never come in contact with, what have you. It is overwhelming and makes it very difficult for them.

You failed to mention your country of origin. That is quite important. I forget the exact layout of the list, it is distasteful and insulting to folks, as it probably should be. But Asian employers have preferences, so a native speaker from the Philippines with a PhD is probably less employable than a native speaker from the U.S. with a bachelors. They may be factoring in the standards of education there too, or they may just be blatantly discriminating. The worst is how they will discount a VN who was born and raised in the U.S., who also can speak VN. So here is a guy who speaks both languages, grew up with the most favored dialect, yet is discounted because he does not look like an English teacher. Appearance matters A LOT here.

Well, Tet vacation is almost over. Hope everyone had a lot of fun. Back to work we go!

[ExpatLuke]

Business is a great secondary degree to hold in ESL. Many companies want their teachers to have a background in business to teach the business English classes. It may open up more opportunities for you.

[PC Parrot]

Pursuing a masters would be something to consider if you intended on staying in the field. But it's probably better to give the classroom a go first.

Regarding a comment above, a masters in TESOL is not necessarily a western based approach to teaching. Much of the literature on pedagogy stresses the importance of factoring in local-learning styles. Anyway, it is not only Westerners who take these degrees and who contribute to the field with research papers and articles. It is an international effort. I would imagine Vietnam has it's own TESOL organisation that runs conferences and workshops throughout the year. Cambodia does.

What would a masters give you? Well, it would help you to:

Better understand your students needs - as speakers, listeners, readers & writers
Better understand your students weaknesses & strengths
Better understand the range of theories about Second Language Acquisition

Better understand the principles behind good course & materials design
Better understand the principles behind good examining & testing

Better understand the English language - from a linguistic perspective: think systemic functional grammar, think text and discourse analysis, think lexical chunking, and think lexico-grammar

Better understand the English language - from a socio-linguistic perspective: think illocutionary force, think speech acts, and think politeness systems

And if you like the humanities, and I guess that's why you are running away from your cubicle, you might just like what you find.

Having said that, it would be a much more appealing career if, when you were ready to return to the west, it afforded you a home & retirement in the west. All too many people find that, after a life-time of TEFLing, they simply cannot afford to return to their home country.

Where I work, in the Gulf, many people wish they had found a different way of living overseas in their youth that hadn't later necessitated their toiling for a decade in the Gulf to put their finances in order.

Of course, some people make money through businesses they start up or through other ventures, but be warned, many of the people I work with today have gone down such roads.

[Tigerstyleone]

Yeah man, you better go on and get a Master's in TESOL before coming over.

[Dream_Seller]

[I'm With Stupid]

Personally, I'd get a masters after teaching for a while, rather than before. In fact, a lot of masters require at least 2 years teaching experience beforehand, and I imagine these are the ones that have most practical relevance to the classroom. Either way, I suspect you're going to better understand a lot of the concepts if you've spend some time in the classroom before doing it. For a start, you might do a masters, and then realise you hate teaching within a few months.

[VietCanada]

Yeah. Do something cheap with actual teaching hours built in. Linguistics is fun to study but teaching is a different animal.

[Dream_Seller]

Thanks for all the comments. I appreciate it. I think I will just invest in a CELTA first. I'm sure the first year in Vietnam I will be bombarded with plenty. I will have to learn alot quickly. How to drive in that madness on a motorbike is one thing for sure. Thanks again for all the helpful responses.