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Is this common for EFL jobs in Indo?
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MadRiley



Joined: 11 Jun 2013
Posts: 18
Location: Saigon, Vietnam

PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or EF could possibly take out an insurance policy so their teachers weren't faced with huge medical fees or worse if something went wrong but I wouldn't hold your breath for that one. A number of TEFL teachers do die each year in Indonesia from everything from heartaches to motor bike accidents to cheap cocktails in Bali. EF started asking for next of kin info from teachers a few years ago for a reason. Do not even consider going to Indonesia without coverage. Young people feel immortal but they aren't.
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p1randal



Joined: 23 Jun 2008
Posts: 64

PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having never worked there, I don't have any first hand knowledge of the company. I do have a couple questions that might make these statements relevant.

1. Does EF have a blanket policy in terms of healthy care? In that I mean does the location in Karawacci have the same one as Bekasi and so on?

2. Is the applicant told that they won't have insurance and if they are given insurance what it will cover?

3. If the person takes the job and get hurt and they know they don't have insurance how is that the company's fault?

Things like this make me glad they are raising the requirements to work and live here. If someone has taken the time to get a good amount of education (Delta, Celta, MA) they won't take these jobs and if they will, they will know what they are getting themselves into.
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jef dam



Joined: 27 Apr 2010
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

p1randal wrote:
Having never worked there, I don't have any first hand knowledge of the company. I do have a couple questions that might make these statements relevant.

1. Does EF have a blanket policy in terms of healthy care? In that I mean does the location in Karawacci have the same one as Bekasi and so on?

2. Is the applicant told that they won't have insurance and if they are given insurance what it will cover?

3. If the person takes the job and get hurt and they know they don't have insurance how is that the company's fault?


AFAIK they have to provide insurance for ex-pat employees. I'm open to correction on that.

The EF I worked for had nominal cover. I think it was about 1 million for out-patient costs for the year and up to 80% for in-patient costs. I don't know how much or even if it's changed as it's over 4 years since I worked there.

If you don't have enough common sense to take out insurance before going abroad it's nobody's fault but your own if you find yourself landed with hospital bills you can't pay.
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chezal



Joined: 25 Feb 2009
Posts: 146

PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 7:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The EF I worked at back in 2004 had similar coverage to what Jef dam described. Through I never had to use it.

I took out travel insurance before I left as I know the type of activities I like to do which aren't always covered on normal health insurance. Also I planned to travel once I had finished working at EF (didn't happen as I ended up staying in Indonesia) so I would have needed the coverage then.

Even at the International school I'm at now I don't feel that the coverage is sufficient so I have taken out additional insurance for myself and my husband. At the end of the day people need to be protecting themselves when overseas as you have chosen to leave the safety net in your home countries. Nobody else will look out for you so you need to look after yourself. This either means finding a job with what you consider sufficient coverage for yourself and family or doing what others do and taking out additional coverage.
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MadRiley



Joined: 11 Jun 2013
Posts: 18
Location: Saigon, Vietnam

PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

plumpy nut wrote:
Anybody have any what this nutcake's problem is?

OK, so nutcake, back to the original subject, does an EF teacher pay for the travel insurance with the nice EF salary they're being paid?


A lot of middle aged long term expats in Indonesia get sensitive when you question the sense of working there for small salaries as they have made a life out of it. There's often ego involved. Tread carefully.

I think EF pays some ridculous amount like $100 for doctor's vists a year. When I worked there someone had a motorbike accident and was $3000 out of pocket for surgery. You'd be mad to think EF will pick up the tab.
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jef dam



Joined: 27 Apr 2010
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MadRiley wrote:


A lot of teachers in Vietnam couldn't make it off the bottom rung in Indonesia and feel it necessary to derail threads with moaning about working for a company they willingly signed up with. There's often a badly bruised ego involved. Tread carefully.



I took the liberty of fixing your post for you. FYI, I'm neither middle-aged, nor do I work for EF. Long term ex-pat is a matter of opinion.

Flaming is counter productive, especially when you've not contributed anything in the way of useful information to the forum.
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chezal



Joined: 25 Feb 2009
Posts: 146

PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not quite sure why people are so stuck on EF. There are plenty of other schools to work at in Indonesia if you are properly qualified according to Indonesian law.

If you don't have the requirements they are asking for then you either don't work in Indonesia or if you do want to get a decent job here you do what many who wish to stay have done and up your qualifications. Easy really. You don't have to be stuck at the bottom rung forever if you pull your finger out.
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bradleycooper



Joined: 12 Apr 2013
Posts: 206

PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As for qualifications, the DIKNAS hurdle is too high for most people to consider leaping. A CELTA / Trinity certificate is a reasonable investment in time and energy but I can't see many people doing a MA in TESOL or a Degree in English just to get to work in Indonesia. People with with an MA can get $4000 - $5000 a month tax-free in Saudi or Qatar and walk away with a nest egg. I'm sure that most teachers concur as most I have spoken to find these new regulations baffling. They are probably the toughest in Asia by a long stretch.

In reality I think that these language schools in Indonesia need expats more than expat teachers need to work in Indonesia (they can always try China or Thailand). People with a TEFL certificate and a degree have a wide array of other options.


Last edited by bradleycooper on Sun Jun 15, 2014 6:58 am; edited 1 time in total
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jef dam



Joined: 27 Apr 2010
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RE: EF

There is plenty of information about EF on plenty of forums around the web. A Google search will give prospective employees all the information they need so they can adjust their expectations accordingly. Fore warned is fore armed, and there is absolutely no reason for anyone to not be fore warned.

There's also a lot of naivety involved on the part of employees, and truth be told I was guilty of that myself. Any job on the other side of the world that will hire you unseen (and most likely with the bear minimum experience) on the basis of a ten minute phone interview in which you demonstrated that you are in fact able to speak English is not going to be a job to set the world alight. It wouldn't be in your home country, it most certainly isn't going to be in a developing country in South East Asia.

E.F. Pro Tip #45822: It's an easy job that will put you in another country with enough money to survive on and give you an opportunity to learn a new skill that will open doors for you all over the world. Have a laugh for the year, take the bullshit on the chin (because they're certainly not going to change the way they do things no matter how many strops you throw, and ultimately you'll only end up being miserable for the year), and if you really hated it chalk it down to a learning experience and move on to another school or another country and put the skills you learned at E.F. to good use.
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SiThep



Joined: 30 May 2013
Posts: 32
Location: Thailand

PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about a 6 month moratorium on new EF Indonesia threads? Sounds like a good idea to me.
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Voyager2



Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 34
Location: S.E Asia

PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An update to a dormant thread. EF provides outpatient coverage for 3 million per contract at the time of writing. Further, I spent three days as an inpatient some months ago, wherein the insurance policy is termed 'VIP' coverage according to hospital finance department upon admission, covering a private room, meals and doctor visits. This wasnt BIMC, which is terribly overpriced, but still a major hospital in a larger provincial town. Contract health care cover has been quite good IMHO. Hope this assists. Regards

(of course I haven't ventured into heavy EF workloads but that's for another thead).
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