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johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 13859 Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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Dear MuscatGary,
Don't get me wrong - I'm not a proselytizer for AA. Oh, when I first gave up drinking in 2002, I joined an online group, and when I got back to the States, I attended meetings for a couple of years. But then, I stopped going, and, in the almost ten years since then, I haven't imbibed.
So, maybe not everyone NEEDS AA. In fact, there are some alternatives:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tom-horvath-phd/addiction-treatment_b_1663494.html
However, in my opinion, AA can and does work for many - and it by no means has to induce any kind of "quasi-religious superstition addiction."
Oh, I imagine it CAN induce it - in some. But in all my time in AA, I can't recall a single instance of any individual who had acquired such a mental state.
You also mention "People with addictive personalities . . . " but there seems to be a growing body of opinion and research that makes a good argument that such a "personality type" doesn't really exist:
"The truth is, most of the personality traits mentioned as part of the addictive personality are human personality traits used by humans (not just addicts) when confronted either without invitation or by someone who has not established rapport. It ought to be unethical for a client to be cursed at, threatened, or manipulated in the name of addictions treatment. A client's recovery is dependent on a skilled empathic counselor."
http://www.addictioncts.com/blog/2013/05/04/The-Myth-of-the-Addictive-Personality.aspx
http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/socialscience/2013/03/addictive-personality-myth-or-reality.html
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-heart-addiction/201105/the-myth-impulsiveness-in-addiction
http://informahealthcare.com/doi/abs/10.1080/09595238480000131?journalCode=cdar
May I ask how you arrived at your conclusion?
Regards,
John |
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MuscatGary
Joined: 03 Jun 2013 Posts: 1364 Location: Flying around the ME...
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MuscatGary
Joined: 03 Jun 2013 Posts: 1364 Location: Flying around the ME...
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globebot
Joined: 20 Sep 2013 Posts: 76
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Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2014 2:35 am Post subject: Reply |
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As a young man living in the ME, I found some redeeming qualities in these denizens of the desert. When I returned in middle age, I found absolutely nothing. A culture of entitlement rife with corruption and wasta has turned them into hyenas bent on satisfying their worst carnal desires. Alcohol is the least of their problems. Drugs are pervasive throughout the ME, with much worse consequences. It's the only cure for indolent and meaningless lives. There's a good reason the region is in a state of turmoil with extremism in the ascent. Many more heads are waiting to roll I am afraid, and it will be their own. |
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1st Sgt Welsh
Joined: 13 Dec 2010 Posts: 946 Location: Bandar Seri Begawan, Brunei
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Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2014 7:50 am Post subject: Re: Curbs on alcohol |
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A Majils Al Shura member wrote: |
About whether it will have an impact on tourism, the Majlis Al Shura member feels that "there will not be any significant impact on tourism because tourists mainly come to experience the country." |
Not sure if I agree with this and that's not because I think that the tourists that come to Oman are booze hounds who need to get blitzed every night. Rather, greater restrictions or a blanket ban on alcohol, I believe, could damage Oman's reputation as a comparatively liberal, tolerant Gulf state and therefore its appeal as a tourist destination. Indeed, Saudi Arabia apparently has some superb scuba diving and beaches, but tourists aren't exactly queuing up in their droves to try and see them and I would guess that's because Saudi's reputation precedes it. Although I'm a very keen diver I have no interest in being so restricted within such an intolerant environment whilst on holidays and I'm sure a lot of people feel the same way. |
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Tazz
Joined: 26 Sep 2013 Posts: 512 Location: Jakarta
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Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2014 11:29 am Post subject: |
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There is no tourism in Saudi-other than Muslims visiting Mecca for Umroh and Haj......... |
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johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 13859 Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2014 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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Dear Muscat Gary,
"One of the problems with that, especially in the past several years, is that atheists and agnostics who need a way to recover from alcoholism either don’t join or feel excluded from local AA groups that push religion on them. (They may be unaware of secular alternatives that are out there or simply don’t have any of those groups in their areas.)"
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2013/03/21/an-increasing-number-of-atheist-and-agnostic-alcoholics-anonymous-groups-are-altering-the-twelve-steps/
http://www.sossobriety.org/home.html
http://weagnostics.com/agnostic-steps.html
It's my belief that, after the age of 7 or so, people don't change. Your "personality" or character or whatever you want to call it has little, if any, "wiggle-room."
But behavior can change. I don't that how that can be accomplished will be the same for everyone, not at all. Each addicted individual needs to find what works best for him/her.
Regards,
John |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010 Posts: 11454 Location: The real world
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Posted: Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:15 pm Post subject: Re: Curbs on alcohol |
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1st Sgt Welsh wrote: |
Although I'm a very keen diver I have no interest in being so restricted within such an intolerant environment whilst on holidays and I'm sure a lot of people feel the same way. |
Consider beautiful Socotra Island, Yemen. You'll feel like you're on another planet (http://www.210countries.com/destinations/off-the-beaten-path/socotra/). |
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1st Sgt Welsh
Joined: 13 Dec 2010 Posts: 946 Location: Bandar Seri Begawan, Brunei
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Posted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 9:10 am Post subject: |
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Many thanks nomad soul. Something to bear in mind. |
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Tazz
Joined: 26 Sep 2013 Posts: 512 Location: Jakarta
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Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 7:37 am Post subject: |
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I can just see some backpacker planks making their way to Yemen with their surf boards and diving gear.....they will most certainly feel like they are on 'another planet' once they are held captive. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010 Posts: 11454 Location: The real world
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Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 8:44 am Post subject: |
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Tazz wrote: |
I can just see some backpacker planks making their way to Yemen with their surf boards and diving gear.....they will most certainly feel like they are on 'another planet' once they are held captive. |
It's more like being "captivated" by the island's strange beauty. Seriously, if you'd done a bit of research before posting, you would have learned that Socotra is an island in the Indian Ocean, about 200 miles off the coast of Yemen. It's not touched by the socio-political issues experienced on the mainland.
Anyway, not to move away from the topic of drinking... |
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MuscatGary
Joined: 03 Jun 2013 Posts: 1364 Location: Flying around the ME...
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Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 9:15 am Post subject: |
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nomad soul wrote: |
Tazz wrote: |
I can just see some backpacker planks making their way to Yemen with their surf boards and diving gear.....they will most certainly feel like they are on 'another planet' once they are held captive. |
It's more like being "captivated" by the island's strange beauty. Seriously, if you'd done a bit of research before posting, you would have learned that Socotra is an island in the Indian Ocean, about 200 miles off the coast of Yemen. It's not touched by the socio-political issues experienced on the mainland.
Anyway, not to move away from the topic of drinking... |
Don't surf and slurp though... |
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Tazz
Joined: 26 Sep 2013 Posts: 512 Location: Jakarta
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Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 9:34 am Post subject: |
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Desolate looking place....the link contains very little information of any use 'if' anybody was planning a trip there-for example, it states that visitors need to bring some cash because there are no ATM's on the island and yet fails to state what currency is used.........anyway, back to the drinking! |
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caliph
Joined: 05 Jun 2006 Posts: 218 Location: Iceland
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CANDLES
Joined: 01 Nov 2011 Posts: 605 Location: Wandering aimlessly.....
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Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 10:53 am Post subject: |
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They can do as many pretty pictures as possible for Farasan Islands, but will not succeed. It just has not been developed enough! I mean scraggy bushes and golden sand ...???? does not make 'Paradise'.... |
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