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termination woes

 
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topshop



Joined: 29 Feb 2012
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:21 am    Post subject: termination woes Reply with quote

hello to those in the know in Thailand,
if you feel you are being unfairly fired is there any recourse or advice from the labour office or local lawyer or should one just grin and bear it?
many thanks for any help
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EFL Educator



Joined: 17 Jul 2013
Posts: 935
Location: Cape Town

PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you feel you are being unfairly fired or treated in the Land Of Smiles....go to the Labor Office to file a complaint, get a Thai lawyer....and expect to pay up to Baths 100,000 for your case against the school. However there is no guarantee you will get your job back if that is what your hoping for. Good luck!
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sigmoid



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 1217

PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you being fired, or is it merely case of your contract not being renewed?

There's nothing you can do about contract non-renewal. As for being presented with the sack, Most teaching contracts contain clauses allowing either party to terminate the contract at any time with 30 days notice. Check your contract.

Anyway, it sounds like you may be the victim of office politics, at a gov't uni perhaps?

What EFL Edutainer says is pretty much true. Most people don't find it worth the effort to fight the power when they can just get a new job next door, well, at least in BKK.
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plumpy nut



Joined: 12 Mar 2011
Posts: 1652

PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps if you work a little on your stand up routine. You were obviously an inadequate edutainer.
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topshop



Joined: 29 Feb 2012
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 3:28 am    Post subject: Much Appreciated Reply with quote

I will try to file a complaint at the Labour Office before the end of term, October 07 which is when they are sacking me. There is a clause in the contract which talks about performance and that a warning has to be given. However I never received a warning either verbally or in writing which makes it strange that I was called in and given a letter of termination. It is an EP program and I have a good deal of experience but probably as EFL Educator says my lack of edutaining skills let me down. I was documented correctly with regard to work permit etc, so it surprises me that they would go through the process of all that to sack me after I passed the probation period.

Thanks again
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sigmoid



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 1217

PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, the reason for termination wasn't stated in the letter?

You should file the complaint, but have no expectations and look for a uni job teaching 20-year-old kids instead of 12 year-olds, or whatever.

Also, note that AFAIK your visa and WP are cancelled upon termination but you get a grace period of 10 days or something but you may have to return the WP to the ministry. Actually, TBH I'm not sure of the current regulations as I left Thailand almost a decade ago, but you or the school have to do something when your gig is finished, so please check. You can't just continue on the same visa and WP.
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topshop



Joined: 29 Feb 2012
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2016 4:03 am    Post subject: labour office v education office Reply with quote

Thank you. Unfortunately the nice man at the Labour office told me that I cannot file a complaint there as the EP program at a government school where I work does not come under their jurisdiction even though they issue the work permit. He has told me to go to the education office which deals with contracted teachers both Thai and Foreign. So I will try at the education office then. It seems strange that the labour office would not handle it as they were responsible for issuing the work permit.

I feel that there is something fishy with regard to how the work permits are being obtained in that I am not sure if the actual degree certificates from the teachers are actually leaving the school for the Education Ministry in Bangkok. In fact, teachers here seem to be able to stay on for a long time after the four year exemption period. My copy of the Thai contract was never given to me although I submitted in Penang for the initial 3 month Non O. It appears to be so easy for the school to obtain and cancel work permits at will surely the Ministry would start asking questions?
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Willy_In_Japan



Joined: 20 Jul 2004
Posts: 329

PostPosted: Sat Sep 24, 2016 12:54 pm    Post subject: Re: labour office v education office Reply with quote

topshop wrote:
Thank you. Unfortunately the nice man at the Labour office told me that I cannot file a complaint there as the EP program at a government school where I work does not come under their jurisdiction even though they issue the work permit. He has told me to go to the education office which deals with contracted teachers both Thai and Foreign. So I will try at the education office then. It seems strange that the labour office would not handle it as they were responsible for issuing the work permit.

I feel that there is something fishy with regard to how the work permits are being obtained in that I am not sure if the actual degree certificates from the teachers are actually leaving the school for the Education Ministry in Bangkok. In fact, teachers here seem to be able to stay on for a long time after the four year exemption period. My copy of the Thai contract was never given to me although I submitted in Penang for the initial 3 month Non O. It appears to be so easy for the school to obtain and cancel work permits at will surely the Ministry would start asking questions?


If you are on an 'O' visa, and working, I assume that it is a 'marriage' visa.

I'm in the same boat. The initial work permit can be obtained no problem....but did you get your 'teacher's license'?

If you've not been given the 'teacher's license', it is POSSIBLE that your school didn't know that they needed to submit a copy of your marriage certificate with the teacher's license approval. If they did not, it would be REJECTED and then your work permit would not be able to be extended.

This happened to me at one place and they requested that I leave the country and obtain a B visa. I declined and did not do the second term last year. When a work permit is tied to a B visa, the visa ends as soon as the contract does and you have to get out of the country. I wasn't going to give up my O visa to keep working as an edutainer.

And, yes, I had a chuckle about working on your 'stand up routine'. I'd say that is spot on. I'm a very qualified and experienced English teacher, but I'm having a difficult time delivering edutainment as well. They don't really want to learn English....well, they don't want to put any effort into it at least....they think that as long as you are entertaining, that the students SEEM to be learning English, (even if they aren't) that you'll do fine.

It is possible that is the case. I know that a few teachers at my school believe that I'm not edutaining enough. I'm probably not going to sign a new contract if I don't get the sack myself by the end of October.

Personally, I'd rather get a job at a private English school than a high school, simply because they really aren't truly interested. I'd just go out and get another job and write this one off.
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Willy_In_Japan



Joined: 20 Jul 2004
Posts: 329

PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm a trained ESL teacher with a ton of experience.

I am more about actually teaching English rather than 'edutaining'.

Got the sack myself this week. I feel like a trained chef who got fired from McDonald's.

Don't really care, considering the learning environment here. When you actually let the students evaluate how well they think you are helping them actually LEARN English and base this opinion on whether they fire the teacher or not is a joke. They don't have a clue.

So, to the original poster. I feel for you. I'm in the same boat. Don't sweat it and move on.
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