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Marrying Brit, Getting residency in EU
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 1613
Location: Home

PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, that’s unfortunate, but
scot47 wrote:
the Immigration officer could see no evidence that I had worked or been self employed in Bulgaria.

is the problem. It doesn’t say what evidence your friend supplied, but with six months of bank statements or pay slips, for example, the immigration officer could not have made a rejection on these grounds.
scot47 wrote:
because I am British they were able to utilize something know as the Singh case whereby I had not exercised my Treaty rights. Shocked Therefore, they used UK National Law over EU Directives to refuse my Wife 'free' access to the UK.

Sorry, that doesn’t make any sense. Surinder Singh was an Indian national with a British wife who successfully appealed to stay in England based on his wife, who had been living and working in Germany, exercising her EEA treaty rights to employment in the UK. The “Singh case” favours the applicant every time, and for “them”, presumably an immigration officer, to “utilise” the Singh case to refuse an applicant is incorrect.

Without knowing the facts, I can only guess the financial evidence was the problem, and he should re-apply. Extracts from the requirements are below. Note that some of the language in the second extract is deliberately unhelpful, because presumably the UK border agency doesn’t like free applications. However, speaking as someone who went through the process last month, don’t worry about that.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/policyandlaw/guidance/ecg/eun/eun2/#header2

EUN2.4 What are the requirements for issuing an EEA family permit?
In assessing an application from an EEA national's direct family member, the entry clearance officer(ECO) should be satisfied that:
1. the applicant is the family member of the EEA national (marriage certificate, birth certificate or other evidence of family link)
2. the EEA national is residing in the UK in accordance with the EEA Regulations (as qualified person (exercising treaty rights) if more than 3 months) and the non-EEA national is joining them; or the EEA national intends to travel to the UK within 6 months and will have a right to reside under the Regulations on arrival, and the non-EEA national will be accompanying or joining the EEA national; and
3. if applying as a spouse or civil partner, there are no grounds to consider that the marriage or civil partnership is one of convenience (see Annex ….); and

EUN2.14 Can family members of British citizens qualify for an EEA family permit? ('Surinder Singh' cases)
As a general rule, family members of British citizens do not qualify for an EEA family permit. Article 3 of the Directive essentially says that an EEA national cannot be considered as exercising freedom of movement in their own State -
This Directive shall apply to all Union citizens who move to or reside in a Member State other than that of which they are a national, and to their family members as defined in point 2 of Article 2 who accompany or join them.
However, where an EEA national has exercised a treaty right in another Member State as a worker or self-employed and they wish to return to their own State having exercised that right, certain provisions may apply in order for their non-EEA family members to qualify under the EEA Regulations.
A British national and his / her non-EEA national family members can only benefit from free movement rights if they meet the criteria established in the ECJ case of Surinder Singh. The case stated that nationals of a Member State who are exercising an economic Treaty right (that is, as a worker or self-employed person) in another Member State will, on return to their home state, be entitled to bring their non-EEA family members to join them under EC law.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15146
Location: Respice post te! Hominem te esse memento! Memento mori!

PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First rule is never trust a British "chitty-wallah" ! White man speak with forked tongue !
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15146
Location: Respice post te! Hominem te esse memento! Memento mori!

PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My English friend with wife from Muscovy has expanded --

" the reason I got refused an EEA Family permit is because I have NEVER been employed or self employed in Bulgaria and therefore the British UKBA have a valid excuse for not issuing the EEA under the Singh ruling.

I am fortunate at the moment not to need to work as we are both self sufficient in terms of money, but this fact does not seem to be included. EU Directives relating to the rights of EU Citizens and their non EU spouses say that visas (if required) should be issued for free and with expediency. This is the only point that I could argue in the short term and also stating the fact that we had NO intention of returning to the UK to live, just to visit.

The UKBA does NOT does not recognise the EU Directive that a Non EU Spouse with a Residence Card as a family member married to an EU citizen living in an EU country has the right to accompany her husband/wife into any EU country visa free or, if they demand a visa then, it should be issued for free and as quickly as possible. This is one of the areas that the EU is threatening to haul the British government through the EU courts for non compliance and why they won't take up my case as an individual at this time.

So, currently my options are; work for a while and reapply or, pay for a family visitor visa and go through the whole process via Sofia again. As I said to my Mothers MP, I respect what Mr. Singh achieved on his behalf, but I doubt he served 14 years in the British Army as I have done.

At the end of the day, I only wanted to take my Wife to the UK for a 10 day visit to see my Mother. When my Father died a year ago last July, she wasn't allowed to accompany me and I did not have time to arrange anything for her visa wise, so she had to stay behind. I am not being a skinflint, just trying to get what the EU says we are entitled to, but it is difficult to fight it from a Bulgarian village. The appeal itself costs around £200 (if I remember correctly) and there is no guarantee that I would win based on the current criteria of Singh. To set a precedent, I'd need a good immigration Lawyer or the EU behind me which is also costly compared to giving in, for now and buying a family visitors visa."

.
.
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 1613
Location: Home

PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
EUN2.14 Can family members of British citizens qualify for an EEA family permit? ('Surinder Singh' cases)
… where an EEA national has exercised a treaty right in another Member State as a worker or self-employed and they wish to return to their own State having exercised that right, certain provisions may apply in order for their non-EEA family members to qualify under the EEA Regulations.


scot47 wrote:

" the reason I got refused an EEA Family permit is because I have NEVER been employed or self employed in Bulgaria

Exactly.

scot47 wrote:
my options are; work for a while and reapply

Ditto. If he works for six months and provides proof of this, his wife’s EEA family permit will be a formality.

However,

scot47 wrote:
This is the only point that I could argue in the short term and also stating the fact that we had NO intention of returning to the UK to live, just to visit.


If he says that last point, his wife won't get any EEA visa at all. This visa is for people returning to the UK with the intention of staying there. It is not a holiday visa.

-----------------

This thread seems to now be discussing the unsuccessful application of one person, who is communicating on here by having his e-mails copied and pasted by Scot47. That probably won't help future applicants a great deal.

Another applicant is me, or rather my wife, and as it was a successful and easy process, I can tell you that if you:

1. Read the link I provided
2. Intend to return to the UK or have some sort of evidence, e.g. a job, to show this
3. Have proof that you have worked in the EU for the previous six months. Note, there is no minimum salary requirement with the EEA option.
4. Can prove you are genuinely married, e.g. correspondence going to the same address

then you will almost certainly be approved.

Scot47's friend, from what information is provided, is doing these things wrong:

1. He doesn't intend to return to the UK to live and work
2. He wants to "just visit", which is a big no no for an EEA option application
3. He has no proof that he was working for the previous six months
4. He hasn't mentioned any sort of job offer. Again, there is no minimum salary requirement, so if this job will provide enough to live on, that's fine.
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scot47



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Location: Respice post te! Hominem te esse memento! Memento mori!

PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right. Thanks for the clarification.
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BenE



Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Posts: 321

PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 7:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to an immigration officer friend this isn't the case. An EEA family permit is simply for non EU nationals to use to benefit from the EU freedom of movement rights. Whether they want to work, visit family or go shopping there doesn't matter. All that matters is that the non EU national and the EU national travel together. Under Surrinder Singh cases the UK national MUST be working and returning to the UK and must prove that he is using his EU right to work there. This means registering in the EU country at a local council office and submitting the document as evidence as well as possibly a working contract.

If you can do all that then UK immigration should have no choice but to give an EEA family permit (which of course the current government is trying to prevent from happening no doubt)
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There could be good news for wannabe UK residents.

No, it's not my availability for marriage, even if I am good catch.

Oops, I was just about to copy the link when the news story changed.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39050664

I have to say, though, £18,600 is a pittance for living in the UK and anyone earning below that - extenuating circumstances aside - would be irresponsible to bring a partner here.
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 1613
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There could be good news for wannabe UK residents.

No, it's not my availability for marriage, even if I am good catch.

Oops, I was just about to copy the link when the news story changed.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39050664

I have to say, though, £18,600 is a pittance for living in the UK and anyone earning below that - extenuating circumstances aside - would be irresponsible to bring a partner here.
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indoboy17



Joined: 22 Jul 2017
Posts: 38

PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hod wrote:
There could be good news for wannabe UK residents.

No, it's not my availability for marriage, even if I am good catch.

Oops, I was just about to copy the link when the news story changed.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39050664

I have to say, though, £18,600 is a pittance for living in the UK and anyone earning below that - extenuating circumstances aside - would be irresponsible to bring a partner here.
RUBBISH! I had a phone convo last week with a UK immigration lawyer and the 18 600 is just to get the spouse visa of a non-EU partner the first time........but once she has the visa, she can ALSO work in the UK....ie she could ALSO earn 12k or so per year (assumung a minimum wage job) so your total salary together would be £30, 600.....Then when the visa is up for renewal, it is not only YOU, the UK citizen who can earn 18 600 per year , it is BOTH you and your spouse's combined income which counts towards the 18 600. And if you are not working, so long as she is earning 18 600, that is fine! Or if you both earn 9, 300 each minimum, that's fine too.

And as a british citizen you are still entitled to benefits although she is not....although the lawyer stated you have to be careful when claiming to say she is not entitled or something so whether they would "know" if you never told them she was from outside the EU, maybe you could get a couple's benefits....although it's a risk.....has anyone claimed for their wife if she was outside the EU I wonder?

So you are talking rubbish that 18600 is a pittance......actually it is not a pittance since the minimum wage is £8 per hour or soor £320 a week £1280 a month, which is less than 18 600 a year. But since BOTH can work once the visa has been issued, there shouldn't be any problem even if you can both get minimum wage jobs.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
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Location: Respice post te! Hominem te esse memento! Memento mori!

PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In polite discourse we do not accuse others of "talking rubbish".
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