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IF I had it to do over, I would not enter into ESL teaching.
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nomad soul



Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11451
Location: The real world

PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sammysez wrote:
Part-time, no benefits, no "possibility" of full-time employment, no healthcare, no sick time, no prep time etc.. and on and on the contract went.....

We got it the first, second, third, and fourth times you've voiced your complaints about this part-time job in the US.

Stop applying for adjunct ESL positions; they're not likely to become full time. TESOL jobs aren't in high demand in English-speaking countries. Plus, international student enrollment numbers are down in the US, which has impacted university IEPs.

If you've moved back to the US and need full-time employment with benefits, seek out work in other fields.
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AGoodStory



Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 738

PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

We got it the first, second, third, and fourth times you've voiced your complaints about this part-time job in the US.


Huh? I've actually been sympathizing, rather than counting. Given how many of the regular members here spend time venting, I would be surprised if more than a very few of us are unwilling to tolerate Sammy indulging in a bit himself. After all, he has made some very good points--and venting is often the first stage of being able to address a problem.

.
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maueuewome



Joined: 11 Nov 2017
Posts: 4
Location: Abroad

PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Happy Wow such a personal and family-like community ! I think my wife is going to like it here. (She joined with me.) So, is it through the PMs that everyone makes friends? I guess I need to get busy posting if I'm going to make any friends!

I'm also wondering how many professional recruiters are the among the regular members.

Cheers Smile

P.s.
A Good Story wrote:
Venting is often the first step
My wife said that's denial.
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AGoodStory



Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 738

PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

maueuewome wrote:
Very Happy

P.s.
A Good Story wrote:
Venting is often the first step
My wife said that's denial.


And your wife would be correct! My phrasing was inaccurate. Just think something along the line of "comes before." Very Happy Welcome to the forum, maueuewome!

.
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maueuewome



Joined: 11 Nov 2017
Posts: 4
Location: Abroad

PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AGoodStory wrote:
My phrasing was inaccurate. Just think something along the line of "comes before."
Nopes. I "think" the venting is a form of repeated denial and Nomad Soul (Hi!) provided information. I also think you imply Nomad Soul giving a number to repeated denials is in some way wrong while saying other things the poster says should be more important. Essentially, turning the conversation to Nomad Soul's style instead of what she said while excusing the repeated denials.

It's kind of funny you have said you made a mistake with phrasing, but not your meaning and change the stages of grief or distress to tell me what to think. I know it's just an expression, but it's old school insistence and charades as helpful suggestion and friendly acknowledgement without the help and acknowledgement.
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Mr. Kalgukshi
Mod Team
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Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Posts: 6607
Location: Need to know basis only.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If this thread is to continue, it must get back on topic beginning with the next and all subsequent postings. Off-topic/derailing postings will earn makers of same sanctions that can include permanent banning along with ISPs.
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nomad soul



Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11451
Location: The real world

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Not trying to be Debbie Downer, but if I had it to do over, I would not become an ESL teacher. Basically I'm eating my degree, because it's really not paying the bills like I thought.

Rather than dwell on the past and on the scarcity of full-time ESL jobs in the US, seriously consider options that help you move forward. If you're unsure where your skill set and experience would fit, contact your state labor department for workforce/job centers in your county, where there are employment services and specialists who can help you determine career paths that might interest you. Be sure to ask about training via the Workforce Innovation and Opportunity Act (WIOA). For your state, do a search on wioa [state name].
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GambateBingBangBOOM



Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 2:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know several people in Ontario, Canada who got into language teaching (a one-year certificate from a university / college) but didn't want to leave the country. Without a masters degree (in anything at all, really) that's not enough to teach at a university or college. (With a masters degree in anything at all, then you are able to teach at that level. More and more jobs require the masters to be in language teaching these days- unless you know someone)

So they found other ways to use their ESL postgraduate qualification.

Some of the common ways are:

1. Use it to gain entry into a k12 program and become an elementary (junior high if your state has it) or high school teacher (depending on your 'teachables') who ALSO teaches ESL. (probably the most common for these people. Some people do the one-year certificate in TESL simply to get a better chance to get into the postgraduate teacher education course).

2. Get training in publishing (another year-long certificate), and use the ESL certificate to get yourself into educational publishing. It's one of the few areas of publishing that is still an area people actually get jobs in. The OP doesn't actually say what level this degree that he / she is eating is (masters?) but if it's actually in language teaching, then it should have taught them grammar. Editing jobs require that.
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GambateBingBangBOOM



Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 3:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

3. Get training in being a library technician (one year certificate, I think). Have a 'slash' career. A lot of ESL teaching seems to be done at libraries (for free). If you are a library worker, you can market yourself as being able to start up that kind of program for the library. If you decide that libraries are for you, get a masters degree in library science. (Libraries are also being shut down, so that is something to consider, but people who do degrees in library science don't always work in libraries, many of them are database administrators). (You might be able to start doing this without actually getting a library technician diploma)

4. Nonprofit companies (immigration and refugee related). (I've only met one person who did it this way, and I only met them briefly) Depending on the size, people take on a number of roles, and writing public relations materials as well as teaching ESL could be an option. From there, other nonprofit work (like in the arts, if you have interests that way) could be possible, or (probably with a one-year certificate in public relations) working in a public relations agency.

In any case, most people basically needed to go back to school (but in Ontario, Canada that seems to often be the requirement).

What you do, I think, also depends on how you envision language teaching.
-Is it primarily about education?
-Or is it primarily about communications?
-Or is it primarily about community development?

How you see language teaching may change over the course of your career.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15330

PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even in my early days EFLing (1960s and 1970s) there were few jobs in English-speaking countries in this field. Now it is even more desperate !

Last edited by scot47 on Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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bograt



Joined: 12 Nov 2014
Posts: 331

PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Plenty of good adult teaching jobs around if you count university students as adults.
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Mr. Kalgukshi
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Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Posts: 6607
Location: Need to know basis only.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 2:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two more off-topic/derailing comments have just been deleted.

Those that wish to have an unpaid permanent vacation from here will have their wish come true with the next such inappropriate posting.
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goodEnglishes



Joined: 19 May 2016
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 3:24 pm    Post subject: Some more 2 cents for your collection Reply with quote

Hello! I too have had my ambivalent feelings toward my choice down the Peace Corps, MA TESOL, life teaching at universities abroad career path I chose for myself moons ago, perhaps in part by majoring in English Literature in the first place. This forum should be required reading for anyone considering jumping in. Someone saying they could write off years of their life abroad is worth listening to, even if they should have shared much more wisdom and detail to back up their regret.

A major reason I'm writing is to let you know you are not alone! Several students in my MATESOL program got their degrees with the intention of staying in the US and are now regretting that decision partly because they're confined to part-time, underpaid positions. I don't know, and I told them this, why any sane person would get an MATESOL with the plan to teach in the US other than already certified K-12 teachers. It's a degree for teaching abroad. Go abroad! I don't regret a second of it. I'm still young, but I don't appreciate expressing the same regret as others here years from now. If you're unwise in the US or abroad, you'll wind up with regret. It's not about location. It's about you. That said, if you believe it's a coincidence you were born in one neighborhood and not another, say a shanty town outside of Rio, then you can live better, smarter by moving. It's an extreme privilege. Be grateful. I was reading about a poet the other day (not reading is where people often first go wrong) whose name escapes me but her words, what will you do with this one wild and precious life you have, resonate deeply with me still.
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sammysez



Joined: 20 Nov 2016
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bograt wrote:
Plenty of good adult teaching jobs around if you count university students as adults.


Please, let us know where these "full-time" jobs are. I haven't found them, at least not in the U.S.

And, yes, I count adults as students.
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sammysez



Joined: 20 Nov 2016
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Some more 2 cents for your collection Reply with quote

[quote="goodEnglishes"]Hello! I too have had my ambivalent feelings toward my choice down the Peace Corps, MA TESOL, life teaching at universities abroad career path I chose for myself moons ago, perhaps in part by majoring in English Literature in the first place. This forum should be required reading for anyone considering jumping in. Someone saying they could write off years of their life abroad is worth listening to, even if they should have shared much more wisdom and detail to back up their regret.

A major reason I'm writing is to let you know you are not alone!


GREAT COMMENTS!! Hopefully my post landed on a few ears. I wasn't trying to bring anyone down, but trying to "head the herd off at the pass" before they full commit.

My advice to anyone that just wants to travel would get a certificate not an Master's degree and safe yourself thousands of dollars on an Master's that qualifies you for a "part-time" teaching position at most colleges and community colleges in the U.S.

AND, I'm not positive you really need a "certificate" since your English is so superior to theirs.


Yes, there are positions overseas, but the salaries in the Middle East have greatly fallen. I had friends in the 80s making $90 per year----tax free, including housing. But those days in the Middle East seem to be gone.

And yes, it's fun to travel, but as someone said above: "Someone saying they could write off years of their life abroad is worth listening to,...."
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