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Why English teachers in Japan feel like frauds and what to d
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rxk22



Joined: 19 May 2010
Posts: 1629

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yanklonigan wrote:
Some of the teachers I witnessed struggling the most with the 'realities" of English teaching" in Japan were the better qualified ones. Some of them were shocked with the unprofessionalism of their fellow teachers and the sketchy nature of the schools they worked for. Unmotivated students, lousy materials and clownish colleagues were enough to unnerve the bravest teachers with the noblest of intentions. A teacher needed to adapt themselves to the classrooms of Japan while retaining their professional standards.

Back in my day (89-94), most English teachers were one-year wonders. The ones who stayed on longer were the ones who worked harder to develop their skills. However, I did see first hand many good teachers throw up their hands and move on very rapidly because they saw all efforts as being futile.


There still is a lot of this. I feel that many teachers here are here for 2-3 years usually. Finish college, take a break, explore Japan and some of Asia, save up a few pennies, and head back.

I wonder which made or corrupted which first. Were the programs here always so bad? Or were they decent and the teachers coming made it so that you just couldn't have high standards?
I too for a long time wished to get out of teaching, as you really don't have serious students, and many of the co teachers are wild or weird. But I have made peace with it, as there aren't a lot of options to make decent money here, esp since most places won't hire anyone over 29
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kzjohn



Joined: 30 Apr 2014
Posts: 277

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 7:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a multi-quote.

rxk22 wrote:
...
I have yet to meet a bilingual half kid who didn't go to international school.


Anyhow for 99% of us here, most of our kids are monolingual. There are a few rare cases, but they're mostly the high class kids, and in Lizs case kids who do have the opportunity to go to a higher end private school, they have better outcomes.


Many of us can't teach English in any meaningful way, so many if our kids can't speak English as a result. (?????)


There may and probably are cases of success, but from people I've met, which are mostly alts, eikaiwa employees, and IT people, they just can't seem to be able to get their kids to be bilingual.


I wonder which made or corrupted which first. Were the programs here always so bad? Or were they decent and the teachers coming made it so that you just couldn't have high standards?


I too for a long time wished to get out of teaching, as you really don't have serious students, and many of the co teachers are wild or weird.


there aren't a lot of options to make decent money here, esp since most places won't hire anyone over 29
...


I could go back further, but the negativity that you project in these comments really gives me pause.

Do we really live and work in the same country? (the same reality?!?)

It doesn't seem like it.

**

Tho you'll probably come back with why it's impossible to do so, I'd really suggest that you consider both a career change, and a change of venue. (another country)

Without that, I wonder if you might still be here on the forum 15-20 years from now, still expressing the same unfortunate outlook that you do now.

**

Teachers can and do succeed here in teaching English to students who learn it and then go on to other things.

It would be nice to have an environment that supports and encourages that.
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TokyoLiz



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1548
Location: Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kzjohn wrote

Quote:
Teachers can and do succeed here in teaching English to students who learn it and then go on to other things.


I’ve taught so many domestic students who went on to English-medium universities here and abroad. They were hard working young people who have dreams and motivation.

The bilingual-bicultural kids I know have supportive families. Those kids were in public schools until they finished their junior high third year. They didn’t get any accelerated or special English programs.

Dozens of my junior high students are passing the Eiken Pre-2, and many of my seniors are passing Eiken 2 and Pre-1. Eiken isn’t the world’s best measure of English proficiency, but the students’ efforts are showing in their performance on tests, and they are gaining confidence through the process.

I don’t expect my students to gain near-native proficiency. I just want them to leave school with a positive experience of learning an additional language, not fearing communication with non-Japanese people, and with a sense of accomplishment. If they exceed our expectations (we want all our students to pass the Eiken 2), then we celebrate them.

If you’re willing to learn how to help kids pull up, you’re part of the solution. I have spent 25 years of my life building a knowledge base and honing techniques to help learners. I’m not the world’s best teacher, but I just keep working at it.

When my students continue to improve their scores, ignore the chime at the end of class and keep practicing or writing, or look disappointed when the term is coming to an end, I must be doing something right.
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fluffytwo



Joined: 24 Sep 2016
Posts: 139

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think rxk22 is just telling it like it is in public schools and eikaiwa. It's a rarity to meet kids in either who have much fluency at all (adults or going on adults, there may be some fairly fluent ones in eikaiwa at least, but then, they're motivated enough to pay and attend even if it's likely just icing on a cake of reasonably concerted self-study).

Of course, a halfway decent teacher shouldn't stay too long in situations that are clearly inimical to functional communication and genuine learning, but the majority of the set-ups here are unfortunately that way and hardly the foreign hand's fault, so don't shoot the messenger. That there were good schools all round eh! And even the supposedly good schools, that should be a "step up", can be bad.

For example, I once endured a term at a private J-SHS that could barely disguise its contempt for its foreign staff (in fact all its staff, but most of all the foreigners). It didn't help that the other fresh foreigner didn't knock out much more than hangman, but the teaching, planning~liaising, and especially the (hitherto undisclosed) material-writing duties were very onerous, in fact ridiculous, so what should've been a step-up career-wise was anything but (it made the worst eikaiwa or dispatcher look positively unexploitative LOL).

It's great though if one ends up "lucking out" and working somewhere tolerable or even fairly nice and professionally rewarding, but those tales seem more the exception than the norm in Japan or indeed the ELT world in general, where it's usually a case of constant "problem solving" at the very least. Or am I too missing something?
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TokyoLiz



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1548
Location: Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
where it's usually a case of constant "problem solving" at the very least. Or am I too missing something?


You’re missing something, yes.

Number One Rule of Teaching - identify problems and solve them. Students not gaining? Identify where the problem lies, research and implement a plan, and then evaluate. Revise as necessary.
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fluffytwo



Joined: 24 Sep 2016
Posts: 139

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps we should all simply conclude 'It really is your fault if you remain in comparatively bad jobs'?

Not that all those stuck in eikaiwa or dispatch AETing or whatever scabby constrained positions (i.e. the focus of the original article) are even with the "necessary" or "proper" qualifications going to suddenly find better (appreciably better) jobs galore, if only because "there isn't the money" to pay 'em all much more. And what about those we'd "leave behind" or have to "shake down" even further (the struggling students, poor stood-up bosses etc).

Tl:dr is that we're only as good as the position, yet can try at least privately to keep professionally developing (thought is free etc) in spite of whatever problems (tho some people may admittedly not quite rise to even that!). That these problems have more or less ceased to be an issue for some is besides (or as I say, perhaps should be or IS, albeit uncomfortingly to those "lower down" in the food chain) the point ultimately LOL.
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rxk22



Joined: 19 May 2010
Posts: 1629

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 5:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kzjohn wrote:
This is a multi-quote.



I could go back further, but the negativity that you project in these comments really gives me pause.

Do we really live and work in the same country? (the same reality?!?)

It doesn't seem like it.

**

Tho you'll probably come back with why it's impossible to do so, I'd really suggest that you consider both a career change, and a change of venue. (another country)

Without that, I wonder if you might still be here on the forum 15-20 years from now, still expressing the same unfortunate outlook that you do now.

**

Teachers can and do succeed here in teaching English to students who learn it and then go on to other things.

It would be nice to have an environment that supports and encourages that.


I do wonder if we are in the same reality. Japan despite dumping huge amounts of private and public money into English, they are still near the bottom in ways of English proficiency.
You may see some that succeed, and there are people who do gain fluency, but for everyone that does, there are many who never gain even a basic understanding.
You are in Chiba, I have meet and interacted with many students from Little Garden, Kid's Garden and Rabby International. None of them were able to gain any real proficiency despite going to those programs for 30 hours a week for 2-4 years.

I a not saying it is impossible, I am just saying it's very rare, and you for some reason are taking personal offense to that.
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rxk22



Joined: 19 May 2010
Posts: 1629

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fluffytwo wrote:
I think rxk22 is just telling it like it is in public schools and eikaiwa. It's a rarity to meet kids in either who have much fluency at all (adults or going on adults, there may be some fairly fluent ones in eikaiwa at least, but then, they're motivated enough to pay and attend even if it's likely just icing on a cake of reasonably concerted self-study).

Of course, a halfway decent teacher shouldn't stay too long in situations that are clearly inimical to functional communication and genuine learning, but the majority of the set-ups here are unfortunately that way and hardly the foreign hand's fault, so don't shoot the messenger. That there were good schools all round eh! And even the supposedly good schools, that should be a "step up", can be bad.

For example, I once endured a term at a private J-SHS that could barely disguise its contempt for its foreign staff (in fact all its staff, but most of all the foreigners). It didn't help that the other fresh foreigner didn't knock out much more than hangman, but the teaching, planning~liaising, and especially the (hitherto undisclosed) material-writing duties were very onerous, in fact ridiculous, so what should've been a step-up career-wise was anything but (it made the worst eikaiwa or dispatcher look positively unexploitative LOL).

It's great though if one ends up "lucking out" and working somewhere tolerable or even fairly nice and professionally rewarding, but those tales seem more the exception than the norm in Japan or indeed the ELT world in general, where it's usually a case of constant "problem solving" at the very least. Or am I too missing something?


Thank you, outside of adults, I have met only a few youngsters who have real English skills, they are by far the exception.

There are good jobs here, but you really need credentials as well as connections. I turned down a job at a technical school, as honestly it didn't pay that much, esp for all the work it involves.
I ended up starting my ow company, which is great, as I teach how I want, and it does work. But without my wife I couldn't make contracts in Japanese, and wouldn't be able to be where I am.
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Mr. Kalgukshi
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Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Posts: 6613
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suggest everyone stay on topic, avoid the personal sniping and asides. Three such postings have just been deleted. Future ones will result in bans along with ISPs.
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Yanklonigan



Joined: 23 Jan 2017
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The turnover rate for teachers in the USA is excessively high, so perhaps many American teachers leave because they feel like frauds. Many students majoring in education never even go into teaching after a small dose of student teaching. Some figures indicate that 50% of people who teach leave the field within five years.

Teachers leave for many, many reasons. However, I strongly suspect that the primary reason is that they weren't really cut out for it in the first. Second, we teachers are very imaginative folks overall and many of us just get bored with the structures and routines of teaching.

after five years of teaching in Japan (university, business college, English schools, juku and privates), I was bored to the marrow of my bones with Japan, the Japanese and teaching in Japan.
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yurii



Joined: 12 Jan 2017
Posts: 106

PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yanklonigan wrote:
The turnover rate for teachers in the USA is excessively high, so perhaps many American teachers leave because they feel like frauds. Many students majoring in education never even go into teaching after a small dose of student teaching. Some figures indicate that 50% of people who teach leave the field within five years.

Teachers leave for many, many reasons. However, I strongly suspect that the primary reason is that they weren't really cut out for it in the first.


I disagree with your comment that many US teachers are leaving because they're not cut out for teaching. In the UK at least I think this is the number 1 reason: https://www.theguardian.com/education/2018/apr/10/lesson-battle-why-teachers-lining-up-leave and would imagine the US is similar.
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Yanklonigan



Joined: 23 Jan 2017
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent article. I stand corrected.
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fluffytwo



Joined: 24 Sep 2016
Posts: 139

PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
“Be assertive with your line manager. Don’t be afraid to say no,” she advises. “The word ‘reasonable’ is very powerful, as in ‘what you’re asking me to do isn’t reasonable’.”

Education=Business corporation
.
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Maitoshi



Joined: 04 May 2014
Posts: 718
Location: 何処でも

PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just a personal observation, here: my kids are fluent speakers of English and Japanese, but remain silent in their once-every-so-often English classes at kinder and elementary school. They are embarrassed by what’s being asked of them and it’s quite possible their English teachers are completely unaware that they can speak English. Sample size is far too small to make generalizations, just thought I’d offer an alternative explanation. One more: some of the other bilingual kids are fluent in languages other than English. One is trilingual (French, Italian, and Japanese). That kid is going places!
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Yanklonigan



Joined: 23 Jan 2017
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sometimes the children who can speak English fluently hold their tongues in the classroom because they don't want their fellow classmates to lose face. Also, some Japanese enjoy playing the game "I dare sensei to get me to talk." The Japanese are a hard-working nation, but they expect English to be taught to them Or learned by them) is the same fashion as mathematical calculations or chemical formulas. One learns English by speaking it when one is given the opportunity.


Maybe many English teachers begin to feel like frauds due to the relentless silence they encounter, as well as the poor levels of English they find in the classrooms regardless of the level of education. Nobody will ever mistake the Japanese with the Irish, Arabs, Americans or any other race that loves to chatter. My daughter is partially Japanese, and I love the people and their land, but they aren't stimulating conversationalists.
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