Job Discussion Forums

[panatelladavid]

If I got a 15 hour a week High School job, could I request that my contract state I can work externally? E.g. evenings at a training centre.

Thus making it legal if I declare my taxes?

[teenoso]

It's a visa issue not a tax issue - the work visa is only for your employer (school, agent, company) so they can't give you a contract with such a clause

[panatelladavid]

many thanks.

how real is this 'crack down' on people working outside of their visa? i hear lots of stories on both sides

[teenoso]

This forum seems to be slowly dying with many of the regulars gone and not so many new joiners. I suspect , without any evidence , that a lot of the old-timers were 'riding the rails' here and had dodgy qualifications and not so clean criminal records, so generally the authorities have tightened up the enforcement of visa rules , and changed those rules.

Whether this affects people doing outside work , I don't know.

If you're discreet and low-key I don't think you will be found out. If you sign up with the local training school for regular classes and are used by them for publicity and demo teaching , then yes someone is probably going to be alerted and check your credentials.

[doogsville]

Not so sure the missing old timers were a bunch of criminals hiding out in China due to a lack of checks. I'm an old timer myself, joined here in 2009 originally got bored with the negativity and came back to the boards later. Anyway, I think it's more likely people just left to go to countries where, if they make you jump through the hoops China now does, at least there are benefits when you've finished jumping. China for me was always a fine balance between the ease and relatively inexpensive process of being here versus the crap I've had to put up with in the 8 1/2 years I've been here.

In that 8 1/2 years salaries have risen at about a tenth the rate that prices have risen. Buses are still overcrowded. Pollution has stayed the same. Xenophobia has stayed the same but now I'm supposed to shell out around 5k RMB for the privilege of taking a job with a company that sees me as a piece of meat to be exploited to the maximum and discarded as soon as my value to them diminishes.

Edited to address the OP. You probably run less risk if you work for cash or Wechat transfer and don't pay the taxes, thus not bringing yourself to the attention of the authorities. Probably best to set at least 10% of it aside though so if you do get caught you can pay the back taxes, and use your savings to pay for the fine and cost of deportation. That being said, in my 8 1/2 years I've yet to hear a credible account of anyone actually being caught.

[The bear]

[Simon in Suzhou]

One can work a second job legally IF their employer signs off on it and paperwork is filed with the government. The govt wants their tax money. I looked into this awhile ago. But basically no employer is going to go through the hassle to do this with no benefit for themselves.

I think a few criminals/fake doc holders have exited China, but I suspect more people got tired of the continually increasing (and constantly changing) paperwork and bureaucracy, as Doogs pointed out.

I do disagree, however, about salaries. In the last 2-3 years salaries have taken about a 50% jump in the private sector, public middle/primary schools/ as well as many universities. If you're still making essentially the same as you made 5 years ago, you need to get out and look at other options.

[teenoso]

My Uni salary in 2007 was only a bit less than my present salary , and I haven't seen a general increase, at least not in the public sector. I'm working in small city and a 3y college so a low salary is off-set by a reasonable cost of living , and very limited opportunities to splurge. .
My chinese colleagues here are young and seem to be doing very well , with many living off campus and driving cars, which always baffles me given teachers' salaries are supposed to be modest .

[jknops2]

I am working at XJTLU in Suzhou. We have gotten a clear message for foreigners, no outside work is allowed. Your visa is restricted to only work at XJTLU. We actually just fired a staff member about this. He had been doing this for years, but times have changed. It is my perception that employers need to enforce this, if they find out you have any side jobs. Since my place is a joint UK/Chinese University, they are more sensitive and follow the rules more. Also these rules might vary from among provinces. But the message here is clear, outside work is not acceptable and will get you fired.

And yes, I agree, visa rules have gotten much stricter lately, at least here in Jiangsu.

[getbehindthemule]

It's not rocket science, have your head screwed on and you have zero chance of having trouble doing outside work:
1. Get paid in cash or by Wechat for privates and use a discreet location if possible. Private home or office is best, restaurant or quiet coffee shop also works.
2. If you want to work for another company, work for a company that pays you into your overseas bank account. (there are several that do this here)
3. Keep a low profile. I've heard of naive teachers bragging about it to their Chinese work colleagues during their day job!
4. Don't approcah your boss/manager/principal/head teacher about it as you're putting them in a very arkward position.

[Kalkstein]

[getbehindthemule]

[nimadecaomei]

Another thing to consider is that Chinese public school teachers get a nice match to their real estate purchases. They often work with their family to flip the real estate, thus purchasing several properties, which are match at a percent by the government, for a nice windfall return. I have heard they get as much as a 50/50 match by the government. In that case, an 800k home could get them 400k take home within months. I am not sure about all of the ins and outs, but their are many things people can do like this to make up for a low looking salary.

[Simon in Suzhou]

A few things about Chinese salaries and what you "hear" Chinese teachers make. About 50% of total income in China is "Gray Money" (cash under the table) which the govt is trying to crack down on and get their tax cut. This gray money is flowing BIG TIME to Chinese teachers. Many of them of tutoring on the side, running overpriced test prep classes on the side for students (for example, before the national accounting and teaching exams). It's not illegal for them. Many also take HUGE bribes from students for grades. As well, Chinese teachers get a New Year's bonus in a red envelope which doesn't count as salary (unreported and untaxed) that can often equal 3-6 months of salary. Foreigners NEVER see this kind of perk. I currently teach at a private high school and they have a program that will pay 50,000 yuan towards a car purchase!

None of these things will you ever hear about when the Chinese teachers gripe about their paltry salary compared to yours, before heading out of the parking lot in their BMW.

[getbehindthemule]

^this

The CNY bonus is pretty standard and pretty huge for teachers here. I know teachers on 5-6k monthy salaries that get 30k for CNY in cash working public school positions!
When I negotiated my latest contract I asked for this bonus and got it, not as big as the Chinese teacher's bonus but got it nonetheless