Site Search:
 
Get TEFL Certified & Start Your Adventure Today!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Company Sends Contracts. Than Changes Contract. Advice.

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> China (Job-related Posts Only)
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
hotornot



Joined: 03 Jul 2017
Posts: 8
Location: It's beginning to look a lot like fuck this.

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:06 pm    Post subject: Company Sends Contracts. Than Changes Contract. Advice. Reply with quote

A company sent the contract to my friend, in Chinese/English. It was dutifully signed and retuned. One day before Chinese New Year they send a new contract reducing salary, holidays and terms in general.

Chinese New year is on can't reach anyone other than recruiter who says he will try to ask them to change it.



Contract was 20,000 after tax, 1/2 paid holidays.
reduced to 15,000 after tax, and 1/4 paid holidays.

um are we in the fish souq ...

Does their attitude stink ?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rioux



Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 830

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's quite a bit of a reduction. I would go through the entire contract line by line to look for any other surprises.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
T-Bone



Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 33
Location: Phnom Penh

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't work for them.

They reduced the salary 25%. Right before CNY. That is a super sneaky and shady thing to do. If they are doing this kind of crap before your friend is even working for them, they are going to do far shadier and crappier things to them when they are working.

Far shadier and crappier. Once they have your friend on site, where they have a lot less control about their situation, they are going to do all kinds of unethical and exploitative stuff. I'm sure you can find enough stories in these threads if your friend doesn't understand this.

Your friend is probably eager to get working, and to have a job after doing the annoying job process for a prolonged time period. He/she should extend that period a little longer to find a different job. There are plenty of jobs in China. They will find something.

In a way, the company did your friend a favor. Now your friend doesn't have to spend a year dealing with their awfulness. He/she knows before working there that they are going to treat her/him poorly.

Your friend should decline the position. And don't let the company guilt them into staying. It's just one of the manipulative tools in their slimy toolbox. They are totally in the wrong. They should be shamed for wasting your friend's time.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Kierana



Joined: 23 Sep 2011
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Huge red flag, I wouldn't even consider them for another minute.

(Under Chinese law they have offered you a lesser contract that you can decline without penalty)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
happeningthang



Joined: 08 Oct 2003
Posts: 117

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know why people are so horrified about this....

They TOLD YOU there were changes. It's not very professional and speaks unkindly about their organisational skills - but if they were TRYING to screw your friend over they wouldn't have said anything until s/he was on site.

To me it sounds more like the trpical Chinese school situation with things constantly in flux and changes happening all the time. It doesn't mean they are malicious.

In my experience this is a common situation for China's ESL. There's a spectrum where some are better able to explain and ameliorate changes than others (usually with western management) - but change happens here... a lot.

If this is a deal breaker I suggest Taiwan or Japan.... You work harder, but they are organised.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
cdchristy



Joined: 15 Oct 2016
Posts: 34

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From my experience, it is possible that they see you as nothing more than a hired gun. They may have found someone else who will take the job at the lower rate or simply heard of other schools paying less. They are likely looking for cheapest option to maximize their profit without any concern about finding the best teacher for their students.

I would add that I am sometimes shocked at how the bosses are oblivious to the business realities of FTs. They only see their reality and expect FTs to comply. This is likely due to their cultural norms.

All of this being said, I would appreciate their forewarning but I would look for something else.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RiverMystic



Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 1972

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2019 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Run. Run away!

Why would anybody even consider working for such an organisation? What was the fellow’s last position? A professional speed bump?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Frequency



Joined: 12 Nov 2016
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Give them the middle finger and walk away. Honestly you will get cheated at some point while living in China by any employer. No matter who you work for. You will either be cheated or you will be given vague explanations on things, last minute notices on schedule changes and other things like that.

Perhaps you should look onto YouTube and type in the search field "why foreigners are leaving china". You will eventually learn as I did a while back that we really have no future there.

The fact that the esl job environment isn't meant to be a life long thing for us and the fact that you aren't in a professional atmosphere, I just can't see what anybody can see in it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Simon in Suzhou



Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 387
Location: GZ

PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frequency wrote:
Give them the middle finger and walk away. Honestly you will get cheated at some point while living in China by any employer. No matter who you work for. You will either be cheated or you will be given vague explanations on things, last minute notices on schedule changes and other things like that.

Perhaps you should look onto YouTube and type in the search field "why foreigners are leaving china". You will eventually learn as I did a while back that we really have no future there.

The fact that the esl job environment isn't meant to be a life long thing for us and the fact that you aren't in a professional atmosphere, I just can't see what anybody can see in it.


Amazingly, this person's bad experience does not sum up the totality of the ESL industry, teaching in China, living in China, or successful and happy career choices for everyone. Even if he can't see it.

Like EVERYWHERE, there are bad employers and good employers. There are professional workplaces and unprofessional ones. When you see red flags like you've seen in this hiring process, take notice of them and go elsewhere. ESL is not for everyone. China is not for everyone. Being a lawyer is not for everyone, nor is being a policemen, or being an accountant (For the life of me I can't see what anyone sees in that!). New York is not for everyone. Fargo is not for everyone.

There are many people who love teaching, have made themselves professionals in the industry through credentials/hard work/appearance/mannerisms/cultural sensitivity/acquiring a 2nd language (like we expect our students to)...who have found a very good, happy life AND CAREER in China. Professionalism also works both ways.

The point is, yes there are bad jobs out there and you need to be careful. Even if you are careful, you might get unlucky. But there are many good jobs. If you want to give China a try, don't be dissuaded by the bitter people who lurk here. They are not objectively warning you. They are just trashing a place that doesn't suit them. What I can't imagine is hanging out on message boards trashing a place and profession I hate. Life is too short. Find what works for you and quit assuming everyone is the same as you.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
getbehindthemule



Joined: 15 Oct 2015
Posts: 702
Location: Shanghai

PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Simon in Suzhou wrote:
Frequency wrote:
Give them the middle finger and walk away. Honestly you will get cheated at some point while living in China by any employer. No matter who you work for. You will either be cheated or you will be given vague explanations on things, last minute notices on schedule changes and other things like that.

Perhaps you should look onto YouTube and type in the search field "why foreigners are leaving china". You will eventually learn as I did a while back that we really have no future there.

The fact that the esl job environment isn't meant to be a life long thing for us and the fact that you aren't in a professional atmosphere, I just can't see what anybody can see in it.


Amazingly, this person's bad experience does not sum up the totality of the ESL industry, teaching in China, living in China, or successful and happy career choices for everyone. Even if he can't see it.

Like EVERYWHERE, there are bad employers and good employers. There are professional workplaces and unprofessional ones. When you see red flags like you've seen in this hiring process, take notice of them and go elsewhere. ESL is not for everyone. China is not for everyone. Being a lawyer is not for everyone, nor is being a policemen, or being an accountant (For the life of me I can't see what anyone sees in that!). New York is not for everyone. Fargo is not for everyone.

There are many people who love teaching, have made themselves professionals in the industry through credentials/hard work/appearance/mannerisms/cultural sensitivity/acquiring a 2nd language (like we expect our students to)...who have found a very good, happy life AND CAREER in China. Professionalism also works both ways.

The point is, yes there are bad jobs out there and you need to be careful. Even if you are careful, you might get unlucky. But there are many good jobs. If you want to give China a try, don't be dissuaded by the bitter people who lurk here. They are not objectively warning you. They are just trashing a place that doesn't suit them. What I can't imagine is hanging out on message boards trashing a place and profession I hate. Life is too short. Find what works for you and quit assuming everyone is the same as you.


+1
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> China (Job-related Posts Only) All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

Teaching Jobs in China
Teaching Jobs in China