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Conditons in Israel
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SWF



Joined: 09 Feb 2003
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2003 12:24 pm    Post subject: Conditons in Israel Reply with quote

How are the wages and working hours & conditions in Israel now?
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12486
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2003 1:05 pm    Post subject: EFL in Israel Reply with quote

Do you plan to emigrate to Eretz Israel ? If you are Jewish that is okay.
The job situation for English teachers though, is not so bright. English is widely spoken and there are many qualified Israeli native speakers.

And if you think you might just go there as a non-Jewish visitor and pick up a job, then I am sorry to disappoint you. That is almost impossible.

Sometimes on this forum you get news you do not want to hear.
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That Lisa Girl
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 6:42 pm    Post subject: Teaching in Israel Reply with quote

What you wrote about Israel simply isn't true!!!

I lived and worked in Israel for ten months, first as an administrative assistant for a jewellery manufacturer, then for six months as an EFL teacher at the Wall Street Insitute. In Israel, I knew many fellow tourists and travellers from English speaking countries who WEREN'T JEWISH and had jobs!!! Some worked in offices, some worked in the service industry, some worked at hostels, bars and cafes. Being an English speaker gives you an advantage, regardless of your religion. Of course, many times people want to know...in Israel, asking a person's religion is like asking where you're from, there are no stigmas attached.

At the Wall Street Institute, an international private langauge school, where I taught for six months, there were many teachers who weren't Jewish either! In fact, the service manager of the main Tel Aviv branch was a protestant New Zealander.

Once you have an offer from Wall Street, or another company, you can take your letter of acceptance of employment down to the Immigration Office with your passport, and get a work visa. Rent in Tel Aviv is a little high, as is the cost of living. Teachers in Israel don't get paid very well, usually around 4200 shekels a month, which works out to about $800-$1000 US. Not bad, but again the cost of living is high. Still, you can do private tutoring, which pays much better.

Right now, with the war on Iraq, Israel probably isn't the safest place to go. I lived there during the Intifada...it wasn't as bad as CNN made it out to look, but of course, there were many risks involved. I would wait before making any decisions to move or teach there, but having said that, it is an absolutely beautiful country and an incredible place to live, rewarding on so many levels I can't even describe.

Please feel free to e-mail me at lisaontheroad1@yahoo.com if you have any questions.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12486
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 4:48 am    Post subject: Jobs in Zion Reply with quote

Okay. I stand corrected. For backpackers there may be jobs. For serious, career teachers the situation is not so good. If you are prepared to work for outfits like the one you mentioned you might pick up enough shekels to stave off starvation.

Once again I see the gulf in aspirations and expectations between people who are teachers and people who travel the world working in bars, vineyards and suspect EFL schools.

Would you want to work in Israel at the moment ?
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That Lisa Girl
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2003 3:18 am    Post subject: Israel...continued Reply with quote

To be honest, no, I wouldn't want to work in Israel at the moment, although I lived there during a fairly dangerous period (October '00 to September 01) and felt reasonably safe at the time.

I'd argue though that the school I worked at was a "serious" EFL school, the Wall Street Institute, which has schools all over Europe, South America, etc. I did know a girl though who had her TESL certificate and B.A. degree who was offered many jobs teaching in the Israeli school system.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12486
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:23 am    Post subject: "SERIOUS" SCHOOLS Reply with quote

I think our definition of what is a "serious" school might differ.
It seems too that we have different ideas about what price we would put on our labour. I would not go and work there for US$1,000 a month.
But for a backpacker that might be okay.
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That Lisa Girl
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:27 pm    Post subject: serious, schmerious Reply with quote

Well, I managed to rent a comfortable apartment, shared with one other roommate, in downtown Tel Aviv on my salary. Sure, I was on a tight budget, but the school also offered really great benefits to its teachers, which made a big difference.

I wasn't exactly backpacking, I had moved to Israel and found a variety of jobs while I was there. I had my BA in English and a variety of teaching experience, but didn't move to Israel specifically to teach English. It was sort of a beautiful case of serendipity that I found my position. It was probably one of the most valuable and rewarding experiences of my life. I learned so much, and got to know so many different kinds of people: Russians, Israelis, Arab-Israelis, South Americans, Ethiopians, Morroccans, Europeans. It was a very culturally diverse EFL atmosphere. I taught grammar, the four skill areas, pronunciation, and computer-assisted language learning, and worked with students of all levels, from those who had just learned their ABC's for the first time to university-level TOEFL students.

So, Mr. Serious EFL Teacher, what exactly does your vision of a Serious Language School entail? Is everyone Serious all the time?
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That Lisa Girl
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:29 pm    Post subject: P.S. Reply with quote

Not that I actually need to defend the reputation of the school I worked at. This is stupid.
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Stephen Jones



Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124

PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One definition of a serious language school Dear Liza would be "not Wall Street or Berlitz".

Wall Street is a franchise operation so you may have struck lucky with your particular branch but Wall Street has a reputation of selling a completely flawed concept to clueless franchisees who then go bust (as happened in Spain) while Wall Street goes on to grab money in other immature markets such as China.

A serious language school is one that you would be prepared to consider working the rest of your life in, and which will nurture a student's language level from beginners through to TOEFL. There aren't many of either, and Wall Street certainly doesn't have that reputation.
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That Lisa Girl
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2003 1:56 am    Post subject: Wall Street, Berlitz, etc. Reply with quote

I have to admit, there were a lot of flaws in the Wall Street system that made the teacher turnover rate ridiculously high. I'm not surprised to hear that they went bust in Spain.

I'm curious, because I'm applying for a job at one of the GEOS language schools right now, do they have a similar reputation as Wall Street and Berlitz? What about EF? Any insight would be helpful.

Thanks.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12486
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2003 6:47 am    Post subject: career teachers Reply with quote

A career teacher would not even consider those franchise operations. And those of us who have families to support could not afford to ! And certainly could not share accommodation as "that Lisa girl" seems to think is okay. I did that as a 20-year-old student. I will not do it it as an adult.
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That Lisa Girl
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2003 3:08 pm    Post subject: Hrm. Reply with quote

Scot47- I can't understand why you're acting like such a snobby jerk, unless you are one. As far as "sharing accomodation" is concerned, I hate to break it to you, but most single people in major cities cannot afford their own apartments. My situation in Tel Aviv was no different from that in Toronto, I lived in a two-bedroom apartment, and split the rent with one other person. It was quite a nice place, actually, and I lived very comfortably.

I have a lot of working professional friends here in Canada in their late 20's to 30's who are *gasp* SERIOUS ESL PROFESSIONALS who have roommates, too. If you have a family to support, that's another story, of course, but why get so uppity about it? I mean, the majority of EFL teachers who teach abroad are single or couples. Not many people with children are willing move from country to country.

All I ask if for you to lose the attitude and get off your high horse. That's not what this forum is all about. I'm not here to get into an argument with anyone, just clarify some general misconceptions about Israel. Your tone is inexplicably hostile. I want to connect with my fellow teachers, not argue with them.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12486
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2003 7:33 am    Post subject: who's uppity Reply with quote

I expect that many people in the West now consider it normal to share accommodation, remain unmarried and live the solitary life. I do not.

If you think life is like what you see in "Friends" (American comedy series on TV) then we think very differently. As for working in Israel, leave that to the Israelis and Palestinan Arabs.
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That Lisa Girl
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2003 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's funny how quickly a stranger can assess and judge another person's life so harshly, unfairly, and rudely. It's a pity that you seem to think that your existence is the only one that can possibly be rewarding and happy. It's a pity you haven't taken the time to consider that independence and solitude are two very different things and all too often confused. Living within a traditional family structure is not necessarily the key to happiness; each person must follow their own path at their own pace, thus living in a way that is true to their own spirit.

I have found that path, it is through teaching, helping students communicate their thoughts and feelings and dreams, empowering them to use the tools of language to reach out and connect with other human beings. It is through love, spending time with my boyfriend and family and friends, volunteering in my community, dancing, practising yoga, writing fiction and poetry.

I am therefore sending you mehta (universal positive energy) so that one day you may open your eyes and shift your worldview to a more tolerant and open-minded, rather than exclusionary and bitter one. I am sending you love, so that this bickering may actually be transformational, rather than destructive and cruel.

"Only Israelis and Palestinians should live in Israel," you say. Does that mean that only Americans should live in America? Only the British should live in Britain? Are we as humans yoked with chains to the countries of our birth? Living in Israel was one of the most rewarding, fulfilling experiences of my life. I'm sorry that yours was lacking in that respect. Nothing that you say will have the ability to take away what I learned and experienced there.

I look forward to your reply.

Kindest regards,
Lisa.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12486
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2003 5:19 am    Post subject: working outside your own territory Reply with quote

I said that you should leave the "work" in Israel to Israelis and Palestinian Arabs. If you want to live there fine, but what gives you the right to employment there ? Every State on Planet Terra exercises controls on foreigners going to workl there.

As for the "single" existence I stand by my belief that humans are supposed to live in long-term relationships.

You seem touchier on this subject than I am. I wonder why ?
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