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More CELTA help, please?
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12348
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where caution is especially needed is when the gerund/gerund phrase is used as a complement:

His hobby is collecting stamps.

It looks so darn similar to the continuous/progressive tenses.

Regards,
John
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9372
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I could ask my students to draw a picture of a 'hobby.'
I personally picture it as a wooden horse on rockers - any other interpretations?



Hmmm. I'm possibly living in a different dimension tonight - or maybe I would just like to be!
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fluffyhamster



Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 2665
Location: UK > China > Japan > UK again

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Johnslat wrote:
Where caution is especially needed is when the gerund/gerund phrase is used as a complement:

His hobby is collecting stamps.

It looks so darn similar to the continuous/progressive tenses.

Well, how often do hobbies collect stamps? Surprised Laughing Wink Very Happy

Edit: This has reminded me of a bit in Chalker & Weiner's Oxford Dictionary of English Grammar (that I think nicely complements Smile what I've been trying to say in all the above):
Quote:
complement 1 One of the five elements of clause structure, along with S, V, O and A. Typical complements of this type 'complete' the verb be or another linking verb, and are either adjectives or noun phrases, blah blah blah...

2 More widely, any element needed to 'complete' an adjective, preposition, verb, or noun; an example of COMPLEMENTATION.

(Chalker and Weiner then give a few examples of complements of adjectives and prepositions before moving on to those of verbs).

The complement of a verb, in this wider sense, is a very unspecific term, and can include not only complements in sense 1, but also adverbials, objects, non-finite verbs, and entire sentence predicates apart from the verb itself.

1961 R. B. Long* His sister is buying antiques will always be understood to have is buying as predicator and antiques as complement; His hobby is buying antiques...to have is as predicator and buying antiques as complement.


*Long, R. B. (1961). The sentence and its parts: a grammar of contemporary English. Chicago: The University of Chicago Press.


Last edited by fluffyhamster on Thu May 20, 2010 7:30 pm; edited 2 times in total
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9372
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

By the way, one of my colleagues (a reserved Scottish chap) called something 'poxy' in the hearing of a Dutch colleague who also teaches English. Not being familiar with the term, she had the impression that it was a positive adjective - it sounds 'cute,' in fact.

We had to explain the origins of the word.....




but we've decided to officially christen the scruffy street cat that frequents our Language Centre courtyard 'Poxy.'


Sorry, OP, back to CELTA questions (and off of another curious topic, which seems to be English words that are very much open to curious interpretations).
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12348
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear fluffyhamster,

OK, then - "His hobby is not collecting stamps." Very Happy

Regards,
John
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fluffyhamster



Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 2665
Location: UK > China > Japan > UK again

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear John,

My instinct is not to reply (or, to not reply) regarding negation.Smile

But I'm definitely one of those who's counted not collecting stamps among my (non-)hobbies! Very Happy
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Sashadroogie



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 9018
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spiral, are these all cries for help? If so can I recommend the following advice? Убийте ги всички!


PS That's Bulgarian, not Russian, wink wink nod nod.
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12348
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Sashadroggie,

Didn't you forget to add this:

Нека Бог я сортирате

Regards,
John
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Sashadroogie



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 9018
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But I find this to be much more Christian: '...Бог ще разпознае собствената си'.
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
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Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Sashadroogie,

Well, it might be more Christian, but there are an awful lot of others who think that THEY are "God's own."

Regards,
John
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BrentBlack



Joined: 11 Apr 2010
Posts: 96
Location: Quan 3, Saigon

PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I recently finished last part of the grammar section. I feel like it is all wrong/I have not put enough in the answers. Any help would be appreciated. This is what I have so far:


(a) I have 25 years.
The part of the sentence that is wrong is HAVE. One should properly use the verb to be and say, I am 25.

(b) Borrow me your pen, will you?
The part of the sentence that is wrong is BORROW. One may ask to borrow a pen, but in this case, one would say, lend me your pen, will you?

(c) I like my coffee too hot.
The mistake in the sentence is TOO. One would properly say, I like my coffee very hot, in order to express their desired temperature.

(d) Can you remember me to go to the bank?
The mistake in the sentence is REMEMBER. It is better to say, Can you remind me to go to the bank.

(e) Ive lived there 5 years ago.
The mistake in the sentence is IVE. The verb to have is not necessary. One would properly say, I lived there 5 years ago.

(f) I am absolutely agree with you.
The mistake in the sentence is AM. The verb to be is not needed, as one would say, I absolutely agree with you. One could also change the structure of the sentence entirely and say, I am in absolute agreement with you.

(g) You must to decide on your destination
The mistake in the sentence is TO DECIDE. The infinitive to decide is not needed. One would drop the to and properly say, You must decide on your destination.

(h) She remarked the beautiful scenery.
The mistake in the sentence is REMARKED. One would properly say, She noticed the beautiful scenery. Another way to correctly say this sentence, which has another meaning all together is, She remarked upon the beautiful scenery."

(i) Its not sure itll rain today
The mistake in the sentence is SURE. One would properly use the word certain and say, Its not certain itll rain today.

(j) Im boring with this exercise
The mistake in the sentence is BORING. One would change its form to bored and properly say, Im bored with this exercise.

Thanks.
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9372
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

all together

one word: altogether

Are you only supposed to identify and correct the error? Or say how you would communicate the correction and the 'rule' to a student?


All of these are common errors, though they represent the most common errors of speakers of different language groups. It's stuff you are likely to encounter in teaching.
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Insubordination



Joined: 07 Nov 2007
Posts: 387
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would add a bit here and there. Some of your explanations could be given by any native speaker but maybe that's the point. Do they want you to explain it to potential students? If so, here's my take on a handful of the errors. Of course, this comes from years of reading too many Headway/Cutting Edge coursebooks.


(b) Borrow me your pen, will you?
The part of the sentence that is wrong is BORROW. One may ask to borrow a pen, but in this case, one would say, lend me your pen, will you? I would also contrast the meaning of borrow/lend.

(c) I like my coffee too hot.
The mistake in the sentence is TOO. I might say that too is an adverb and very is an One would properly say, I like my coffee very hot, in order to express their desired temperature. I might point out that 'too' has a negative meaning.



(e) Ive lived there 5 years ago.
The mistake in the sentence is IVE. The verb to have is not necessary. One would properly say, I lived there 5 years ago. 'Ago' could also be wrong. I'd stick to your explanation and add that simple past is used for a finished action.



(g) You must to decide on your destination
The mistake in the sentence is TO DECIDE. The infinitive to decide is not needed. One would drop the to and properly say, You must decide on your destination. Would add that modal verbs like 'must' should be followed by the bare infinitive (without 'to').

(h) She remarked the beautiful scenery.
The mistake in the sentence is REMARKED. One would properly say, She noticed the beautiful scenery. Another way to correctly say this sentence, which has another meaning all together is, She remarked upon the beautiful scenery." Like your second explanation more verb + preposition (also remark on).


(j) Im boring with this exercise
The mistake in the sentence is BORING. One would change its form to bored and properly say, Im bored with this exercise. Add that -ed ending should be used when describing how a person feels.
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fluffyhamster



Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 2665
Location: UK > China > Japan > UK again

PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just a few thoughts (not sure they are all suitable as answers for a CELTA task though!).

(a) I have 25 years.
We all know what the context is "meant" to be, but I do sometimes wonder if too much "negative evidence" would prevent students even everso slightly from producing somewhat more extensive (and thus acceptable) context-chains like "I have 25 years' experience" or "I have '25 years' as the answer to question 11".

(b) Borrow me your pen, will you?
I'm not sure that even the corrected imperative + tag ('Lend me you pen, will you?') is the best way to express requests - I'd probably prefer to use modals from the start before even contemplating showing how one modal but not really the other might be cut. Anyway, I've added a colon in the following examples to help indicate the objects that are the focus of the requests or imperatives:

Can I borrow: your pen?
[?(Can I) borrow: your pen? (Crazy bonus thought: This can't be interpreted as an imperative because you can't command somebody to borrow their own pen from themselves)].

Can you lend: me your pen?
[(Can you) lend: me your pen?]

By the way, don't (if you were thinking of doing so) stress the 'I borrow' versus 'You lend' here too much because it might make students leery of perfectly acceptable examples such as 'I lent him my car' and 'You borrowed his car?'; the main point is that 'borrow' is monotransitive, and 'lend' usually ditransitive.

(c) I like my coffee too hot.
What if the person were a masochist, mumbling the line through burnt swollen lips? ('You may not like your coffee "too hot", but me, I really like it! <GLUG> Aargh!'). But actually, no, don't burden your students or even your trainers with this one! Laughing

(d): This is a bit like (b) above, but with only the 'somebody' a "real" object.
Remember: something.
Remind: somebody: to do something; or: (of) something. (Latter: 'Remind me (that) that letter needs posting').

(e): [Echoing my silly comments at (a) above]: 'I('ve) lived there - five years ago, in fact!'

(h) and (i): There were similar examples in a thread a few years ago, started IIRC by a 'Teejay', and also about CELTA tasks.

I've lost the will to muck around with the rest, and Insubordination's got 'em nicely covered anyhow! Smile
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