Job Discussion Forums

[Pow3hatan]

I am an English instructor from the U.S. with a master�s degree in TESOL. I have lived and worked in Taiwan on 3 separate occasions, most recently for the past 5 years. I�ve taught in several different schools and mostly have had positive experiences wherever I�ve been. For the past 4 years I�ve been teaching at the National Taipei College of Nursing in Beitou and have enjoyed it. Nothing could have prepared me for the horror I�ve been going through the past three weeks there, however.
First, I participated in an outside school activity on June 4. A week later, one of the school staff pulled me aside and told me confidentially that a student had reported me to the school for �touching her on the waist� at the activity � with people all around us at the time mind you. To say the least I was shocked by this news since no such incident happened.
Then, a day later, another member of the college informed me confidentially that my teaching contract would not be extended another year. Shock number two! The reason I was told first by the coworker was that some students had complained to the nursing department director that my English class was too difficult (others said it was too easy) and they feared they could not pass it. In my four years at NTCN I have never been given a formal evaluation (oral or written) by any supervisor or person of authority about my teaching. In addition, on May 24 we had an English faculty meeting and I was given my approved teaching schedule for 2007-2008. How could this be?
Later, the reason changed to �as a foreign teacher, I was not able to do Chinese administrative paperwork.� Last year two of my colleagues � foreign English teachers � were let go or left NTCN and were not replaced by new foreign teachers. I had already heard they were not replaced by new native English-speaking teachers for the same reason. What kind of discrimination is this?
Several times over the course of more than two weeks I went to the personnel office to inquire about my new contract, and each time all they could tell me was �we don�t know.� A couple weeks earlier I had already given them all the necessary documents for renewing my work visa. My current contract and work visa will expire on July 31, 2007.
Finally, on June 28 I received a letter signed by the NTCN president stating that �both your employment project and the term of your contract will expire on July 31, 2007. There is no project required of your service for the 2007 academic year, and thus your employment will end as the contract indicated.� How can that be when, in fact, the project has been extended and my position is open? How can NTCN give me just 33 days notice they don�t intend to give me a new contract�and after already giving me my new teaching schedule more than a month earlier?
After I first heard of the student accusation against me, for more than two weeks I was not contacted by anyone at NTCN about the allegation and my attempts to talk to anyone of authority at the college regarding this matter were unsuccessful. However, the head of the nursing department quickly seized on the accusation against me to circulate an email naming me as the accused in order to further her efforts to keep me from getting a new contract. At a minimum, a violation of privacy laws regarding issues of Gender Equity?
Finally, on June 27 I received a phone call and email from NTCN advising me there would be a meeting of the campus Gender Equity committee to discuss the accusation. What?! Just 24 hours notice for a meeting of such importance?
To make matters worse, at the meeting the committee insisted several times on trying to ask me questions without the presence of a lawyer. They tried various ways (unsuccessfully) to convince me that a lawyer was not necessary. What?! I�ve never been accused of such a thing, never been involved in this kind of pseudo-legal process, this is not my country, my culture nor my native language, and I�m supposed to answer questions about this allegation without my lawyer present? What is going on? Is this due process in Taiwan for foreigners, including foreign professionals?

[mjh197]

I don't know much about the legal side of things but in general they can do whatever they want to you whenever they want for whatever reason they want.

Have you talked to the student that accused you? There's a big difference between touching a students hip (especially since, depending on age, she is probably very uncomfortable with her changing body and the confusion/anxiety that comes with it) and inappropriately touching her.

Of course they want to convince you that a lawyer is not necessary - they are out for them selves in any given situation. Period. They don't give a shite about who you were, who you are, or who you will be.

They don't care about your dreams, goals, integrity, ambitions. They are going to try to roast you in order to salvage their reputation with the parent body.

Can you counter-sue them on any issue - that might cool their heels. But don't tell them, just do it.

It's inevitable that a person will eventually run into a bad situation in Asia. Consider yourself lucky to have had positive experiences in the past.

And lastly, is it possible for you to simply walk away and shake the dust from your shoes, so to speak?

[Pow3hatan]

Strange thing about the student is she was a good student and sometimes left me messages on chat or sent by email. We even had some communication by email before the activity to coordinate things. This accusation came from way out in left field. She could have easily contacted me to clarify any misunderstanding or confusion, but since NO SUCH CONTACT occurred somehow she has dreamed up this incident. Something sinister behind her motives...

I'd love to just dust myself off and walk away from this, but I'm already caught in the Gender Equity investigation I mentioned earlier and my reputation & character have already taken an unfair beating since word got out about the student accusation. I've got to prove my innocence and clear my name or else getting another job here or anywhere else will prove real hard with a "guilty" verdict even though the accusation is less serious than sexual assault.

Plus, I'm rip-snortin' mad just being unnecessarily involved in this surreal situation. It's screwed up my life for 3 weeks already and it's not over yet. I've already got legal help and that will definitely lead to counter action against the school and the student once the lawyer says we've got enough cause and evidence.

You especially hit the mark when you said "They don't care about your dreams, goals, integrity, ambitions. They are going to try to roast you in order to salvage their reputation with the parent body."

Since I do care about these things, I'm going to do everything in my power to make them pay for their carelessness and callousness, lack of integrity, lack of morals, etc. I'm drawing the line here and no further. Time to fight the good fight and beat the odds not just for myself but maybe give some hope to others who face their own bad situations. [/color]

[Toe Save]

Dude, I hear you. I went thru the same thing at Wall Street. Even more insidious is that the "situation" was someone else's doing. Even so, it was just a misunderstanding. My co-teacher and I walked out of the school and a mousy little sudent followed us to our bikes. She asked us what we were going to do and my pally said we were going to my house for some beer.

This ditz took that as an invitation.

Here's the really bad part: Two graphite commandoes that were management at the incredibly top-heavy WSI (1 South African and 1 Yank) took this confusion on the part of the ditz and tried to drum me out of the school wth it. They were incredibly nervous of my abilities, creativity and professionalism that they feared I would surpass them on the corporate ladder. I had already refused to work on a special project with the South African jer*off, so he wanted me out. The Yank, not sure what his motives were, other than just being a pric*.

I started hearing rumblings from pals at other branches that I was about to get in trouble. So I asked the SA din*us what was going on. He came back to me later in the afternoon telling me a complaint of innappropriate behavious was being levelled at me. Well, I lost it. I mean LOST it. Started swearing at the din* from SA and slammed my locker and left the premises.

I hadn't even made it to my bike when my phone started going off. First it was the Regional Mgr. Then the owner's secretary from HQ called and asked me to come for a meeting with the owner. I said I was too furious and needed a few days to cool down. By the next week, I was still pretty irate, but I took the meeting. Expecting to be fully on the carpet, imagine my surprise when the owner of WSI told me that in is mind there was no doubt as to my innocence in this matter. He said that in situations like this there is usually a lot of grey area. This was black and white.

So, I was treated more than fairly by the Taiwnese and an attempt to lynch me was perpetrated by a cabal of foreigners.

Yes, Taiwanese usually don't give a damn about us. But. like all generalizations, there is an exception that disproves the vitriole.

As for me? I hate all South Africans now.

[Pow3hatan]

Thanks for sharing your sordid tale. Another example how easy it is to find oneself in some bizarre and stupid situations here...with the women and even with other foreigners.

Your story reminded me of something happened many years ago to me back home in the States. Had a Taiwanese girlfriend at that time. When I broke up with her, she went ballistic/mental/postal/ and for some days after she would hurl some really vengeful and bizarre threats at me, like how she was going to see to it that I could never enter Taiwan again or that she would make sure I could never work in Taiwan again. She did find some other ways to screw me, however....all in the name of hateful, selfish vengeance.

Despite all the negatives of this situation, there have also been some positives. It was a couple of concerned and sympathetic colleagues who first alerted me to these problems long before any officials at the school contacted me. Together with a couple of other supportive colleagues, they have since provided me with some indispensable advice as well as material help to defend myself and build a case against the school and the student. They also connected me with a local lawyer who is helping me.

I WILL NOT GO QUIETLY!

[forest1979]

If you want to go quietely or not, you'll have to go. Legally you have nothing to stand on. Welcome to the working world of Taiwan and the reality of being a non-Taiwanese in it!! I'm sorry to hear of your story but I'd seriously consider finding a new job and just making sure you get a damn good reference letter from them. Despite your lack of guilt due to doing nothing wrong is inconsequential to the powers that be. The best you can do is keep your chin up and find a new place to work - and to make sure that you don't get blacklisted at any new place you work at. Reputation and face is everything in Taiwan and I'm sorry to say that you're firing is an imperative to maintain the reputation of the school's administrators. The fact that you have done nothing wrong means zilch.

[mep3]

I'm sorry to hear about your experience too. It sounds very unpleasant. Hopefully soon it will all be in the past though. One thing about it that confuses me; on the one hand I've seen the stories like this, and on the other I've heard that after a few years it's hard for schools to get rid of a teacher. How do the two fit together? mep

[clark.w.griswald]

[forest1979]

My point is as a foreigner you are subject to one procedure - and that's getting fired/not having a contract renewed. You have no rights to any other process. If you try and stand up for your rights it will just end up with you getting blacklisted.

[mep3]

[quote="clark.w.griswald"][quote="forest1979"]Welcome to the working world of Taiwan and the reality of being a non-Taiwanese in it!! [/quote]

How does ones nationality have anything to do with this situation? This could happen to a local Taiwanese just as easily as it could to a foreigner. In both cases it would be difficult to resolve as it is a case of �he says, she says�.

The same situation back home would likely be greeted with the same procedures that are being conducted here.

I am not saying that it is fair particularly if the OP is innocent, but I don�t agree that this is a foreigner/Taiwanese issue!

[quote="mep3"] One thing about it that confuses me; on the one hand I've seen the stories like this, and on the other I've heard that after a few years it's hard for schools to get rid of a teacher. How do the two fit together? [/quote]


An employment contract can be discontinued by either party with 30 days notice. Then in accordance with clauses in the contract and legal responsibilities to long term workers there may be money payable by the party that chooses to discontinue the contract.

In the case outlined above I believe that the teacher could be fired on the spot for unbecoming conduct. He would then have to appeal to the Labor Board and prove that he did not partake in this conduct which would be almost impossible to do. This is of course all very unfair to someone who is innocent but it seems to me that exactly the same thing could happen back home. I can understand an employer erring on the side of caution and removing a teacher accused of something untoward as the implications of failing to act could be far worse than those of acting. Of course if there is proof from either party then this can help determine the reasonable outcome but in most cases a lack of proof in these types of cases means that someone needs to make a decision based upon the claims at hand.

There is not much that can be done to avoid the above situation as a teacher by their very nature needs to be close to his or her students. But it is wise to protect oneself by ensuring that there is no grey areas that could lead to confusion and no situations where the teacher and the student are alone together.[/quote]

..



In the U.S., isn't the standard in a court of law that one is innocent until proven guilty? So the burden of proof falls on the accusor rather than the defendant?

How does the law work in the U.S. if a teacher is fired "on the spot for unbecoming conduct" by a university with insufficient evidence and then appeals the firing in a court of law? Does a university need evidence of "unbecoming conduct" or "sexual harassment" in the U.S. to fire a teacher for such a reason? I would think they do but I could be wrong.

Mep


Thx .... mep

[mep3]

Well, as you can see my quote function still isn't working..

[clark.w.griswald]

[forest1979]

Clark - I agree with many of your points but let me briefly elaborate my view. As a foreigner in Taiwan should you ever been accused of anything inappropriate it is exceptionally difficult to prove yourself innocent. Ok, you're correct to state how a lawyer can provide assistance but so what? How long does the matter take to resolve? I can guarantee you it's longer than someone with a few months left on the their ARC! Also, if someone is coming to the end of their contract, is accused of something heinous and then threatened with blacklisting how do people react? Basically they become very worried! So, I would like to hear if you or anyone else has stories of people (TEFL people) who have taken up the Taiwanese legal system to protect themselves against accusations and won. I do however fear that most people accused of things instead left the country out of fear. Hence my original point that as a foreigner you have few options, and a damn sight less than the locals have (especially if you're not fluent in Mandarin!). It is any wonder therefore that for example in the university system teachers get given strict guidelines about what kind of behavior is and is not appropriate - it bypasses this issue of lack of footing foreigners have.

[clark.w.griswald]

forest1979 it seems that you acknowledge that we do have rights here. Further it seems that your concerns are two fold:

1. that some foreigners may not realize that they can fight;

2. that it it takes time to fight, time that individuals may not have

I am not sure how to respond to that. The law is not there for our personal convenience but is there to protect us as a society. If someone does not understand the law or if someone chooses not to pursue their rights under the law then that is their right. But this in no way invalidates the fact that these rights exist.

Specific answers to some of your points:

a) there are plenty of cases of foreigners exercising their rights against employers ranging from people having tax issues resolved, people having deposits refunded, and people having deportation orders reviewed.

b) you don't need a lawyer and in fact in many cases I personally think you can do better without a lawyer, but getting a lawyer if you don't speak Chinese is an option available to you

c) the time that it takes to resolve an issue will depend upon what the issue is. As I mentioned this is not established for ones convenience so if you personally can't await an decision then that is unfortunate but not the fault of the law

d) in relation to the above you can apply for and receive an extension of your visa to pursue your rights as stated above. There are cases on record in which foreigners have done this.

Once again you make mention of 'blacklisting' for being troublesome. What blacklisting are you referring to here?

So I don't agree with your earlier point that foreigners have less options than locals in this regard, nor that foreigners are deliverately disadvantaged by the system here.

Would it be more difficult due to the language barrier? Yes in many cases it would. Is that due to you being a foreigner? No, it is due to the fact that you are unable to communicate effectively in the language of the country that you have chosen to live in - fortunately there is help available in those cases!

[forest1979]

Clark - Thanks for your lengthy reply to my earlier comments. However let me please make further remarks about my original statement.

Foreigners will always be at a disadvantage in Taiwan. Firstly, contracts are limited to finite periods of time so they do not have the time to legally challenge libellous remarks as to their behavior or otherwise. Secondly, being in any country that is foreign to oyur own means you are at liberty to find out exactly the workings of any employment system. In Taiwan this situation is compounded by language issues (English-Mandarin obviously being so different) which means any threat to be blacklisted immediately creates panic in people who are not in the complete know. This is what I mean by blacklisting - the threat of, in as much as any existing government list. Thirdly, Taiwan is a top-down society where the elites set complicated and extensive rules that people follow for the 'good' of society. Heavy bureaucracy is created and again any challenge to this system, be it legal or otherwise, takes long amounts of time and large amounts of money - neither an average TEFLer has. Hence to best get by in such a society both local and foreigners get their head down, bother no one and work like dogs to fight their way from the bottom up to a more comfortable position. For TEFLers in bushibans or unis on their one-year contracts they are the lowest of the low - the foreigners perceived as unable to get jobs 'back home', here to play around with the low women, get drunk and fly off elsewhere at the first chance. Hence locals will easily throw accusations at each other and foreigners, accusations most foreigners aren't aware of due to cultural and language differences.

I agree with your comments about in theory things can be worked out but in practice I doubt this happens. Ok, you mention the tax office. Well, they do process things relatively quickly but we're not talking about tax rebates coming back after one week! Again, like other bureaucracies in Taiwan, they work slowly. As a final point a major problem for foreigners in Taiwan because of their lack of knowledge of bureuacracy is their reliance on administrators. From my experience many administrators in Taiwan are woefully unprofessional, don't know the rules and say anything merely as a way to not lose face. When push comes to shove, administrators rarely know what the rules are. Again, as a stranger in a strange land this makes the situation precarious once problems emerge.

So, to put my last two cents in I concur that it's not so much the law per se that is the problem in Taiwan. Its the people and system dealing with it! Believe me or not, foreigners in Taiwan do have less options as I have just outlined.