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Marrying Brit, Getting residency in EU
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uspech



Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 4:29 pm    Post subject: Marrying Brit, Getting residency in EU Reply with quote

Hey I'm wondering what getting a residence permit is like if I have an EU spouse.
We mainly want to know if we need to commit to a long lease before heading there, just so I have a resident to list on my app rather than maybe staying on a sublet for a while while we job search.
We don't want to commit to a long lease especially without having a job lined up. We hoped we could sublet for a short while while job searching (either Berlin or Frankfurt), but can I apply for a residence permit w/o a "permanent" residence?

It feels like a catch 22. Will employers want to hire me before I have the permit and how could I plan to find permanent housing without an income...?

Help? Smile

Btw I have 3 years EFL experience, TrinityCERT TEFL. He is British and has about 2 years experience.

Thanks for any advice.
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9450
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The process is different in different countries and I haven't tried this in Germany. In the Netherlands, having an EU spouse allowed me to get a residency permit - but NOT a work permit Razz .

Work permit requirements are more lenient in Germany - I'm not implying that you won't be able to work!!

I suggest you might start by ascertaining what the laws in Germany are on this score - the information is likely available on an Embassy website. If it's the same in Germany as in the Netherlands, this may solve your problem, as you'll be automatically entitled to residency so long as your husband is living/working in Germany.
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uspech



Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

it says that the residence permit will be issued unconditionally within six months for any spouse of an EU citizen who is living in germany, guaranteeing them the right to work as long as their spouse is in the country. six months is a long time though. will i be able to work whilst my application is being processed? would anyone hire me just on the promise that my residence permit was pending? would i even be allowed to stay in the country since i am going to be entering on a 90 day tourist visa?
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9450
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really doubt that anyone can answer this unequivocably. One of the most consistent aspects of German bureocracy is its inconsistency Shocked
The answers really may depend on exactly where and to whom you apply.

I think if you are married and go over together, it should be fairly safe, so long as you find someone who wants to hire you.

It would possibly be wise to give your British husband first dibs on any jobs you find, though Very Happy
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BenE



Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Posts: 277

PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Me and my wife (a Belarusian) went through the system. I'm a British national so she gets right of residency.

My wife has the right to live and work for 5 years PROVIDED I have a job and she has adequate health insurance (that's where things can get complicated if the EU national is not employed full time)

After recieving that my wife has full work rights and subsidised German lessons as well has support in getting work in Germany. Pretty good eh?
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 918
Location: Home

PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BenE wrote:
Me and my wife (a Belarusian) went through the system. I'm a British national so she gets right of residency.

My wife has the right to live and work for 5 years PROVIDED I have a job and she has adequate health insurance (that's where things can get complicated if the EU national is not employed full time)

After recieving that my wife has full work rights and subsidised German lessons as well has support in getting work in Germany. Pretty good eh?


Sounds identical to my situation. I'm British; my wife is non EU.

My wife too got the renewable five-year permit, but a few others I know, including those with German partners, got three, two or even one-year renewable permits. I wouldn’t see this a major problem, because German bureaucracy isn’t that bad. My wife’s permit took about 45 minutes.

Medical insurance is complex right now. The gist is that insurance must be with a German provider, i.e. not travel insurance, but you need to get real advice.

Not sure if my employment status is an issue. I had to show my work contract, but if I become unemployed during my wife’s current five-year permit, how would anyone know?
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uspech



Joined: 25 Nov 2010
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for your advice. this sounds encouraging! so you went there with your work contract and they gave your wife a work permit in 45 minutes? wow.

i was under the impression i would only have to show that i was married to an EU citizen, but that i would have to wait anywhere up to six months for my permit to arrive.
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 918
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 14, 2011 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think if you've got the right paperwork and bring along a German speaker, it shouldn't take more than a few hours.

From memory, that paperwork was:

My contract of employment
My bank statements - they didn't ask to see them
My Freizügigkeitsbescheinigung, which is a piece of paper to say I am an EU citizen who can work anywhere in the EU
The usual passports, proof of address, etc

The biggie for many is health insurance. The rules for everyone residing in Germany changed on 01.01.2009. You now need health insurance from a company approved to operate in Germany. My wife initially tried to apply with some foreign insurance, but this was rejected. Expert advice is needed. Bear in mind, going to a broker to get insurance and advice costs no more than doing it yourself. Get a broker first.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12246
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marriage to a UK national does NOT guarantee right of residence in the UK. So how can it for the wider EU ?
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sparks



Joined: 20 Feb 2008
Posts: 505

PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Marriage to a UK national does NOT guarantee right of residence in the UK. So how can it for the wider EU


From the (sometimes) rather complicated processes which people have been describing it doesn't seem that residence is a GUARANTEE anywhere. You might be denied, for example, if you wrote "terrorist" under "occupation" on the form Smile
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
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Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have heard first hand from others that residence has been refused in the Uk even after residence has been acquired in another EU State. The Ukanian Home Office is anti-EU.
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 918
Location: Home

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An EEA citizen living and working in another EEA state, e.g. Germany, Spain, France, UK, etc, can "exercise their treaty right" to move and live and work in another EEA country, e.g. UK, etc. They can also bring their spouse, whether the spouse is an EEA citizen or not.

If you google "Surinder Singh", which is the name of an Indian national who was living in Germany with a British wife and won a famous court case in 1992. I could copy and paste further, but you can google it yourself, and see the salient points as per my paragraph above.

Basically, within reason, an EU citizen with a non-EU spouse can move from one EU state to another and bring their spouse. The UK, being part of the EU, cannot stop this, as the aforementioned Surinder Singh case has proved. The application process is as per the usual UK spouse visa, but it's free and far simpler.

Certain people can write they have heard "first hand", but see above. The UK border agency’s website doesn’t make it obvious that this route exists, but it’s there.

The EEA option aka Surinder Singh route is a separate issue altogether from the stringent and costly UK spouse visa, which recently changed rules and now requires minimum salaries amongst other things.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12246
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure that the "Surinder Singh" route is foolproof. I know of one UK national married to a Russian, living and working in Bulgaria whose wife was refused by the UK Home Office.
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 918
Location: Home

PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not too sure what can be more foolproof than law. The Surinder Singh verdict, as is the case with British law, created a ruling. The UK Border Agency may not like it, but there's nothing they can do. OK, if applicants bend the rules, for example, by entering the EU for a very short time before applying, having no money at all and/or being dependent on benefits, then an application would likely fail, but a genuine applicant will get a UK visa via this route within a matter of weeks.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12246
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From my cyebrbuddy who is British married to a Rusian living in a EU state

"I recently applied for a UK EEA Family Permit for my Russian Wife who has a Bulgarian residency card as a family member to accompnay me to the UK for a short visit and also, because the EEA family permit is issued for free. Free does not include the required visit to Sofia for an interview and the procedure of having your passport scanned and being provided with some digital ID. At no time did the Interviewer give my Wife any reason to suspect that the application might be turned down and I had made is quite clear in the application and the covering letter that we simply wanted to visit my Mother. The whole application is then sent off to Warsaw for processing.

A couple of weeks later, we get back a REFUSAL because the Immigration officer could see no evidence that I had worked or been self employed in Bulgaria. I was stunned to say the least as we have always been self-sufficient, but because I am British they were able to utilize something know as the Singh case whereby I had not exercised my Treaty rights. Shocked Therefore, they used UK National Law over EU Directives to refuse my Wife 'free' access to the UK.

In the rest of the EU, I am legally entitled to travel visa free as long as my Wife is accompanying me or coming to join me, but not in the UK it seems. Yes, she can apply for a visitors visa and pay around £80 for it; I can also appeal the refusal at around £200. "
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