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Denim-Maniac
Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1238
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 Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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| ecubyrd wrote: |
He's a legend in the kimchi forums that shoots $hit straight. Not sure where he is now, as he bounces around (Korea, Philippines, Thailand, blah blah). He will be the first to tell you and anyone willing to listen that $2000usd is possible anywhere in Asia.
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I dont doubt its possible. But the suggestion that EVERYONE including people new to TEFL / new to China (or anyone else) should expect it as a minimum is misleading at best or plain false at worst. Its roughly 12,500 RMB according to the currency calculator I just used. Sure, many people may earn that (and more) in China and other countries but its certainly not a benchmark.
This forum tends to be the same old faces hanging around like us ... and the newcomers who pop in looking for guidance for that all-important first job. When we disgree on qualifications its always in good spirit, no absolutes are made and it provides two sides to a story which may prove useful to someone. Plus its good sport for us 
When people throw around figures as a absolute minimum like this one, it doesnt do anyone any good IMHO. I remember being a newbie here and to EFL and some of the forum nonsense kinda soured my first China experience. With (Im guessing) thousands of university EFL jobs paying in the 6000 - 8500 range, using 12,500 as any sort of guide is just off to me. |
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DirtGuy
Joined: 28 Dec 2004
Posts: 529
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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ecubyrd,
Can't help but wonder how a pay structure like this affects how Chinese view FTs. Are people jealous of us for how much we make relative to the amount of work we do? Do they even have any idea what we get paid?
Just curious.
DG |
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rogerwilco
Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 1549
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:30 pm Post subject: |
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| DirtGuy wrote: |
ecubyrd,
Can't help but wonder how a pay structure like this affects how Chinese view FTs. Are people jealous of us for how much we make relative to the amount of work we do? Do they even have any idea what we get paid?
Just curious.
DG |
Most of my Chinese friends think that I earn about double my true salary.
They are very surprised when I tell them how much my college pays me.
So, they are not jealous, some of them think that I am very foolish for earning only 5000 a month. |
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Denim-Maniac
Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1238
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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I've seen and heard resentment and/or dissatisfaction over salary differences. (from other Chinese teachers ... not sure the above example is from Chinese teachers?)
They often have to have a related major and a specific teaching qualification. We can come here with no teaching qualification of any sort and an undergraduate degree totally unrelated to our job.
They have to have a sound working knowledge of the IPA, grammar and language awareness. We can come here as native speakers often quite clueless about the language we speak from birth.
Experience often shows them this too. Who hasnt had a Chinese teacher ask them to explain a rule about present simple and will + infinitive usage?
Throw in the fact there living quarters may be worse than ours and the utilities may have harsher limits, they have to clock in and out, attend more meetings, teach more hours and all for a lesser salary. Of course they dont always like it. Thats before you get to the teachers who have hangovers / sleep with students / just play games / never plan lessons. |
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rogerwilco
Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 1549
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Denim-Maniac wrote: |
I've seen and heard resentment and/or dissatisfaction over salary differences. (from other Chinese teachers ... not sure the above example is from Chinese teachers?)
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The friends that I was referring to above are not CT's, they are a variety of professionals living in Jiangsu and Shanghai.
I have no problem with CT's earning more than us since we do not typically put in as many hours as them.
But, we do not have access to the many benefits and sources of grey money that they have.
Last year I taught classes to about 30 CT's, and they also thought that I earn 10 to 15,000 a month. They did not tell me that I am foolish, but they did express surprise that I am only earning 5,000 a month. |
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Denim-Maniac
Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1238
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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| I also find people outside of education think I should be earning much more. In the private sector the CT's dont earn anywhere near as much as us FTs. Dont think there is much in the way of 'grey' money either. Just my experience though ... places and experiences can and do differ! |
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rogerwilco
Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 1549
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Denim-Maniac wrote: |
| I also find people outside of education think I should be earning much more. In the private sector the CT's dont earn anywhere near as much as us FTs. Dont think there is much in the way of 'grey' money either. Just my experience though ... places and experiences can and do differ! |
I have worked at two public high schools in China.
The CT's have all sorts of ways of making grey money.
Some of them would give classes in their homes charging 40 students 50RMb a piece, and some of them would just collect the money and not give the classes.
For a year I taught adult classes in Shanghai, and my students frequently complained about having to bribe or give gifts to their children's teachers. |
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Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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'Now this site is mostly made up of recruiters'
About the most nonsensical post I've ever seen on Dave's. |
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fat_chris
Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3198
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Non Sequitur wrote: |
'Now this site is mostly made up of recruiters'
About the most nonsensical post I've ever seen on Dave's. |
Everyone on here who's a recruiter, raise your hands.
You? You? You?
[crickets chirping]
Warm regards,
fat_chris |
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Javelin of Radiance
Joined: 01 Jul 2009
Posts: 1187
Location: The West
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| Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Non Sequitur wrote: |
'Now this site is mostly made up of recruiters'
About the most nonsensical post I've ever seen on Dave's. |
Like almost everything else Lancybloom has said on here. |
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Lancy Bloom
Joined: 23 Nov 2012
Posts: 126
Location: Hong Kong
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| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:55 am Post subject: |
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| Why have all the post about teaching vanished? Everything posted is about people causing their own problems. |
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johntpartee
Joined: 02 Mar 2010
Posts: 3258
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| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 5:41 am Post subject: |
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| Wanna know what I hate? Getting a notification that there's a post on a topic I'm watching and it's total nonsense. |
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NoBillyNO
Joined: 11 Jun 2012
Posts: 1762
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| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:52 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Why have all the post about teaching vanished? Everything posted is about people causing their own problems. |
There is irony lurking about! |
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fat_chris
Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3198
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:30 am Post subject: |
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| NoBillyNO wrote: |
| There is irony lurking about! |
Well done, NoBillyNO. +1
Warm regards,
fat_chris |
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The Great Wall of Whiner
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Posts: 4946
Location: Blabbing
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| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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| MisterButtkins wrote: |
| I will never understand these people who think that we are supposed to get paid more just because the boss obviously makes a lot of money. You might as well say that Wal-Mart greeters should get paid more because Christie Walton is one of the richest women in the world. Or that nurses are underpaid because doctors are so rich. Or that limo drivers are underpaid because of how much money the people riding in their cars have. It makes absolutely no sense and is not, nor has it ever been, the way businesses are organized. |
Never heard of the NBA or NFL or NHL then?
Wal-Mart greeters are a dime a dozen. Anyone can be a greeter.
Not so for foreigners 'teaching' in China. That's why recruiters even exist in the first place.
I made piles of money towards the end of my stay in China because I learned the game.
It's a secret no one wants you to know.... Too much money in other peoples hands and they don't like sharing. |
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