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Can you apply for a work permit on a tourist visa?
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Mysteriousdeltarays



Joined: 08 Feb 2003
Posts: 24

PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 11:10 pm    Post subject: Can you apply for a work permit on a tourist visa? Reply with quote

That is the question?
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deadlift



Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 251

PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes. In fact it's necessary, because you need the work permit to get a resident's card (essentially a two year visa).
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BenE



Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Posts: 271

PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think at the start of this month they changed the law to stop people from doing this. I'm not sure though how the agencies are implementing this new law though.
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TRH



Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 163
Location: HCMC

PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BenE wrote:
I think at the start of this month they changed the law to stop people from doing this. I'm not sure though how the agencies are implementing this new law though.
So if what you imply is true then one would have to be hired and have a work permit in hand before entering the country. The Catch-22, actually one of many, would be that you need a health check from within the country to get the permit and the only way to get that is to enter on a tourist visa.

In response to the OP, if you have been in the country for more than three months, another roadblock to the permit can be that the Dept of Labor wants to know how you have supported yourself and if you have been working illegally, which of course would disqualify you from having a permit. What you need then is a letter that tells a "little white lie" about living on other sources of income from your home country.

The whole process is riddled with conflicts. But of course, it's designed to be.
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skarper



Joined: 12 Oct 2006
Posts: 251

PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 10:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's a very good observation TRH.

The system can't be meant to be clear and transparent since it so easily could be. The people drafting the rules are nobody's fools. This must be what they want.
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ExpatLuke



Joined: 11 Feb 2012
Posts: 323

PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skarper wrote:
That's a very good observation TRH.

The system can't be meant to be clear and transparent since it so easily could be. The people drafting the rules are nobody's fools. This must be what they want.


I'm pretty sure they're actually just fools.
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spycatcher reincarnated



Joined: 19 May 2005
Posts: 215

PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With regards to work permit rules and labour laws regarding foreigners over the last 15 or so years, there have been countless official changes.

I believe that most of these official changes have not really been enforced, however. Many of the official changes have been stupid (from a western point of view, where one would assume that these official changes were meant to be implemented) or at the very least totally unenforcible.

It appears to me that the people making these laws make them primarily for political reasons and practical issues seem very unimportant to them. I believe that the practical issues are deemed not important as they, by and large, don't expect them to be followed.

The tougher work permit and labour laws that we are now seeing are supposed to be aimed at cheap labour mainly coming in from China, but if this were so they could make rules such as: the new tougher regulations only apply to foreigners who are earning less than 20,000,000 VND a month.
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Mysteriousdeltarays



Joined: 08 Feb 2003
Posts: 24

PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2013 3:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can still work on a business visa for three months though is that right?
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LettersAthruZ



Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 452
Location: North Viet Nam

PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2013 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NOPE!

USED to be that way (working "short-term assignments" 90 days or less without having to obtain a work permit).

That got changed January 1st, 2013!

It's rapidly turning into what I had been told Thailand had turned into in the late 90s /early 2000s: LOADS of Farong/Tây/Westerners flooding in, locals getting resentful because of over-inflated salaries (compared to their own lot in life), later, yes still more Farong/Tây/Westerners coming off of the boat, salaries/fees get driven down by extreme supply glut of English teachers, and then Government places very onerous restrictions on potential new English instructors entering and remaining inside the country for anything over one-to-three months!! Currently, it is in NO way even worth your time to think about teaching in Thailand, and a large number of them currently teaching there are pouring in over HERE because the money's better......
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LongShiKong



Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 881
Location: China

PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TRH wrote:
The Catch-22, actually one of many, would be that you need a health check from within the country to get the permit and the only way to get that is to enter on a tourist visa.


So, as of Nov 2013, to get a work visa, the process is:
1. Enter Vietnam on a tourist visa
2. Get a health check, line up work
3. Apply for work permit and res card... (from out of country?)
4. Return

Doesn't it take weeks to months to get the work permit or is this only for those without notarized degrees and police checks? RustyShackleford started work in Sept and has only received the work/res permit now (mid Dec).
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Prof.Gringo



Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 1931
Location: Paradise, Paradise, Paradise!

PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LongShiKong wrote:
TRH wrote:
The Catch-22, actually one of many, would be that you need a health check from within the country to get the permit and the only way to get that is to enter on a tourist visa.


So, as of Nov 2013, to get a work visa, the process is:
1. Enter Vietnam on a tourist visa
2. Get a health check, line up work
3. Apply for work permit and res card... (from out of country?)
4. Return

Doesn't it take weeks to months to get the work permit or is this only for those without notarized degrees and police checks? RustyShackleford started work in Sept and has only received the work/res permit now (mid Dec).


WP's have never been had by the vast majority of foreign E teachers in VN. The cost & the paperwork just are not worth it, and outside a few very large chain schools, most places won't ever bother having you get a WP.

I worked at a govt. uni on a tourist visa.
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ExpatLuke



Joined: 11 Feb 2012
Posts: 323

PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 3:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Prof.Gringo wrote:


WP's have never been had by the vast majority of foreign E teachers in VN. The cost & the paperwork just are not worth it, and outside a few very large chain schools, most places won't ever bother having you get a WP.

I worked at a govt. uni on a tourist visa.


I've heard people say that several times now, but every teacher I've ever known has a work permit. I don't think I could work here and feel secure in my job if I didn't have one. Maybe it's a southern thing? Things seem more free and lax with the law there. I've never worked in Saigon, so I'm not sure.
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BenE



Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Posts: 271

PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 5:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ExpatLuke wrote:
Prof.Gringo wrote:


WP's have never been had by the vast majority of foreign E teachers in VN. The cost & the paperwork just are not worth it, and outside a few very large chain schools, most places won't ever bother having you get a WP.

I worked at a govt. uni on a tourist visa.


I've heard people say that several times now, but every teacher I've ever known has a work permit. I don't think I could work here and feel secure in my job if I didn't have one. Maybe it's a southern thing? Things seem more free and lax with the law there. I've never worked in Saigon, so I'm not sure.


I'm not sure but without one things like a bank account and sending money become a lot easier to do. Not sure why a lot of people think it's the norm to hide their money under the sofa here.
I will admit though I've had trouble transferring my work permit from my previous job since these changes were implemented.
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Riding One



Joined: 25 Jul 2006
Posts: 56

PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 8:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BenE wrote:
I'm not sure but without one things like a bank account and sending money become a lot easier to do. Not sure why a lot of people think it's the norm to hide their money under the sofa here.


You can open a bank account in Vietnam without a work permit. I have opened 2 bank accounts.

Wiring money home requires a "work contract," whatever that means, and proof you paid tax.

Quote:
I will admit though I've had trouble transferring my work permit from my previous job since these changes were implemented.


Can you please give some details on this transferring trouble?

Thanks.
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BenE



Joined: 11 Oct 2008
Posts: 271

PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Riding One wrote:

Quote:
I will admit though I've had trouble transferring my work permit from my previous job since these changes were implemented.


Can you please give some details on this transferring trouble?

Thanks.


It's got the common Vietnamese haze surrounding it but the woman in charge of obtaining work permits basically said that the office has suspended issuing them for a while as it works out how to follow the new rules. This might also mean there's some kinda 'paper' that's not being presented from the company as well but I'm not sure.
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