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NET or International schools and British QTS
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knautica



Joined: 17 Jan 2009
Posts: 51
Location: Hastings UK

PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 10:09 pm    Post subject: NET or International schools and British QTS Reply with quote

Hi - I hope you can help.

I have a TESOL diploma and MA Ed but I also have a PGCE (post 16!) and I'm currently teaching GCSE business studies at a UK independent secondary school.

So could I apply for both NET and international schools teaching British curriculum.

Is there much difference in the pay and conditions between NET jobs and international school jobs teaching GCSE business studies and possibly GCSE English?

Also, I'm thinking of adding QTS to my PGCE, next term. Costing £3000. Would it be worth it in terms of enhanced job options? I'm 50 years old .... and counting.

Thanks very much!
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Joshua2006



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 339

PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As has been said a million times on here - apply and see what happens. It is a pain in the ass to keep sending applications, but everyone wants to come and work in HK for some reason....apply to the NET, see what they say. I doubt you'll make much more in the international system to be honest - the NET scheme pays well, but it is a very different life between the two as far as teaching, standards and expectations are concerned.

Schools have so many choices now when they look for teachers - you're not guaranteed AT ALL to find anything, however much experience or however many qualifications you have.

Apply....
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knautica



Joined: 17 Jan 2009
Posts: 51
Location: Hastings UK

PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 12:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the feedback!
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kpjf



Joined: 18 Jan 2012
Posts: 171

PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joshua2006 wrote:
I doubt you'll make much more in the international system to be honest - the NET scheme pays well, but it is a very different life between the two as far as teaching, standards and expectations are concerned.


Can you expand on that? Do you mean things would be better teaching in an international school in HK compared to the SNET programme (from a non-salary related point of view)?

I'm interested because I'm planning on doing a PGCE in the UK and interested in HK, so not sure whether it's best to go down the international schools route or, in the case of HK going for the SNET programme.

Thanks.
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Joshua2006



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 339

PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Low level SNET school, of which there are many have few, little or no expectations.....and I say that from experience.

International school - parents pay so expect fluency after the first half hour lesson.

This is a common phenomenon around the world...not just HK.
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Joshua2006



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 339

PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 4:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Low level SNET school, of which there are many have few, little or no expectations.....and I say that from experience.

International school - parents pay so expect fluency after the first half hour lesson.

This is a common phenomenon around the world...not just HK.
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kpjf



Joined: 18 Jan 2012
Posts: 171

PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joshua2006 wrote:
Low level SNET school, of which there are many have few, little or no expectations.....and I say that from experience.

International school - parents pay so expect fluency after the first half hour lesson.

This is a common phenomenon around the world...not just HK.


So, you're saying a negative point about international schools is that you have to deal with demanding parents? From jobs in international schools I've seen online conditions seem pretty good (but probably hard to get into those jobs) and surely that's a small disadvantage (demanding parents) compared to the overall benefits...?
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Joshua2006



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 339

PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Demanding parents are part of the job but not necessarily a downside. It depends how user friendly you are as a person I suppose.

Financial benefits.....international school.....the majority pay less than the NET scheme.

Working with lots of other long noses.......much better than the NET scheme.

As said...apply to both and see what feedback you get, if any. Job applications are just a click of a button now to delete them and the majority of potential employers won't even bother to let you know the application has arrived, let alone thank you for it. You will more than likely send out applications every day but hear nothing from any of them. That's also not just a Hong Kong thing.

Gone are the days when teachers could choose where they wanted to work.....
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sistercream



Joined: 18 Dec 2010
Posts: 487
Location: Pearl River Delta

PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joshua2006 wrote:


International school - parents pay so expect fluency after the first half hour lesson.



There re probably some lower tier international schools in HK where this is true, but the ones with which I am familiar don't even employ TEFLers as fluent English (no matter whether the accent is Indian or Scouse rather than RP) is a sine qua non for admission as a student.

In that regard, international schools here are rather different from ones in some other nearby jurisdictions.
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kpjf



Joined: 18 Jan 2012
Posts: 171

PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sistercream wrote:
Joshua2006 wrote:


International school - parents pay so expect fluency after the first half hour lesson.



There re probably some lower tier international schools in HK where this is true, but the ones with which I am familiar don't even employ TEFLers as fluent English (no matter whether the accent is Indian or Scouse rather than RP) is a sine qua non for admission as a student.

In that regard, international schools here are rather different from ones in some other nearby jurisdictions.



That's what I was kind of confused about, because I thought in international schools you don't teach EFL, but geography, maths, French etc in the English medium. However, maybe it's like Sistercream says: a lower tier international school.

Quote:

Financial benefits.....international school.....the majority pay less than the NET scheme.


Maybe HK is different but I would have imagined it was the opposite! Unless of course you've been there for years and have gone up the pay scale on the NET programme. But, maybe that only really applies to the lower tier international schools?


Quote:


Working with lots of other long noses.......much better than the NET scheme.


Maybe I'm naive, but why would that be better? Surely it's better to get to know locals and integrate better... Smile


Quote:
As said...apply to both and see what feedback you get, if any...



I can't apply now, just looking for information for future reference! Thanks.
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Spelunker



Joined: 03 Nov 2013
Posts: 91

PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 3:25 am    Post subject: re: qts? Reply with quote

So you need to be QTS qualified to teach in Hong Kong if you are british national? Somewhat confused now Rolling Eyes Cool Confused Shocked
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sistercream



Joined: 18 Dec 2010
Posts: 487
Location: Pearl River Delta

PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, my fingers re too jolly cold tonight for me to try and get all the quotes and unquotes in order, but a few more observations:

It's correct that in most cases the NET scheme pays better than international schools - the government here is still coining it in, and not shy about spending it. You have to right to the top of the tree int. schools (HKIS, GSIS, maybe a couple of others) to see similar money, although a lot of other international schools also offer perks like free use of their swimming pools, tennis courts and so on, private medical insurance, and special teachers' bus service.

Mixing it with the local staff in NET positions is easier said than done, as most of them are as comfortable speaking English as most of us are with speaking our second or third languages. But if you put in the effort to start learning Cantonese, the picture changes dramatically, most locals will bend over backwards to help and encourage you, introduce you around.

@Spelunker - a Brit who trained in the UK would probably be be asked to "show cause" if they didn't hold QTS and wanted to get a job in an ESF or international school. I don't know about the NET scheme.
As Joshua implied in an earlier post, the bar is getting higher all the time.
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kpjf



Joined: 18 Jan 2012
Posts: 171

PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the input! And, sorry if it seems I'm hijacking your thread knautica. I guess if you apply and get in, it's all good, no? £3,000 seems a lot just to get QTS.

Sistercream, I'm sure if I moved to HK and decided to stay there for a while I'd at least try to reach a certain level in Cantonese. I like learning languages actually. Sounds like a real cliché but quoting Nelson Mandela "If you talk to a man in a language he understands, that goes to his head. If you talk to him in his language, that goes to his heart" - that certainly seems to apply here from what you say!

I wasn't aware of that about the salary for the NET. You see I'm going to be doing a PGCE and wondered would I be better post-PGCE getting experience teaching EFL or sticking to my specialised subjects (Spanish and French), so wondered about international schools as people say salaries there can be high (but of course I don't have to specifically go to HK to do that).

I guess the best thing about the NET programme is once you're in the salary keeps on rising and rising each year (up to a point of course)!
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Joshua2006



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 339

PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kpjf wrote:
you're
Nice....

Quote:
in the salary keeps on rising and rising each year (up to a point of course)!
No....with almost annual civil servant increases, that point is never reached...
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Honky Nick



Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 111
Location: Hong Kong

PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2014 3:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joshua, do you know if there's likely to be one on the cards for the next academic year? That would be very handy.
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