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Disillusioned with ESL
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grahamb



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 1441

PostPosted: Fri Apr 11, 2014 4:31 pm    Post subject: Lusions (ctd) Reply with quote

Sasha, do immodest Russians have Ilyushins of grandeur?
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fat_chris



Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3135

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scot47 wrote:
I reached the same state of disillusion about 1978. Alas, it was too late for me to change course and so my ship sailed on. I now have found a safe haven in retiremenet and have no more daily concerns about EFLing students or colleagues.


And in September independence will be declared!

Warm regards,
fat_chris
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grahamb



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 1441

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 12:14 pm    Post subject: Independence for all! Reply with quote

And in October Vlad will "liberate" us! Very Happy
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fat_chris



Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3135

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And in November America will…

Warm regards,
fat_chri
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12856
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Who

"We'll be fighting in the streets
With our children at our feet
And the morals that they worship will be gone
And the men who spurred us on
Sit in judgment of all wrong
They decide and the shotgun sings the song

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again

Change it had to come
We knew it all along
We were liberated from the fall that's all
But the world looks just the same
And history ain't changed
'Cause the banners, they all flown in the last war

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
No, no!

I'll move myself and my family aside
If we happen to be left half alive
I'll get all my papers and smile at the sky
For I know that the hypnotized never lie

Do ya?


There's nothing in the street
Looks any different to me
And the slogans are replaced, by-the-bye
And the parting on the left
Is now the parting on the right
And the beards have all grown longer overnight

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

Meet the new boss
Same as the old boss"

Regards,
John
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grahamb



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 1441

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:59 pm    Post subject: Who are you? Reply with quote

A man of taste! Cool
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12856
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear grahamb,

Yup, and it's all bad.

John walks into a bar and asks for ten shots of the establishments finest single malt scotch. The bartender sets him up, and John takes the first shot in the row and pours it on the floor. He then takes the last one in the and does the same. The bartender asks him, "Why did you do that?" And John replies, " Well the first shot always tastes like crap, and the last one always makes me sick!"

Regards,
John
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LongShiKong



Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 939
Location: China

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

naturegirl321 wrote:
LongShiKong wrote:
mitsui wrote:
For Korea you have to have a MA.
In Korea there is competition for the good jobs. The days where you could get a job at a university with just a BA are probably over.
In Japan it looks like merely a MA is not enough.


Mind posting a link to such job ads?


it seems like more and more employers want an MA.


'Want' meaning 'prefer' or 'require', and is what they're offering comparable to salaries for equivalent positions in the M.E.? I have not seen such ads.
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naturegirl321



Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9010
Location: home sweet home

PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LongShiKong wrote:
naturegirl321 wrote:
LongShiKong wrote:
mitsui wrote:
For Korea you have to have a MA.
In Korea there is competition for the good jobs. The days where you could get a job at a university with just a BA are probably over.
In Japan it looks like merely a MA is not enough.


Mind posting a link to such job ads?


it seems like more and more employers want an MA.


'Want' meaning 'prefer' or 'require', and is what they're offering comparable to salaries for equivalent positions in the M.E.? I have not seen such ads.


I'll PM you since my info is about Korea.
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fat_chris



Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3135

PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's always a good thread when a Who reference is made.

Or is that: "…when The Who reference is made"?

Or: "…when a The Who reference is made"?

Ah! Articles!

Horton hears a who!

Indeed! Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss.

Who's the boss? Bruce Springsteen? Tony Danza?

Warm regards,
fat_chris
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grahamb



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 1441

PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 11:04 am    Post subject: Who? Reply with quote

Don't be so passive, Chris. Just say "When someone refers to the Who." Wink
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fat_chris



Joined: 10 Sep 2003
Posts: 3135

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 6:06 am    Post subject: Re: Who? Reply with quote

grahamb wrote:
Don't be so passive, Chris. Just say "When someone refers to the Who." Wink


Ah! Now that's a way to be active!

Warm regards,
fat_chris
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Madame J



Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 239
Location: Oxford, United Kingdom

PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about moving into TESOL rather than TEFL, or Basic Literacy (for British adults)? That's what I'm trying to get into at the moment.
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ttxor1



Joined: 04 Jan 2014
Posts: 63

PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fat_chris wrote:
ttxor1 wrote:
at some points during this marathon Saudi visa process, i got discouraged and wanted to bail out. i looked for options teaching Stateside, and applied to the NYC Teaching Fellows program, but didn't get in. Could you give me any insights as to why this might have been? I saw that they don't review applicants who have done graduate work, but on another page they presented various statistics about those who made it in, some of whom did have graduate degrees...Am I missing something here? I looked at other options for teaching ESL in NYC, and saw that obtaining a teaching license is the only other way to go. but there seemed to be at least 5 or 6 different routes to certification in NY.

Why was teaching in NYC the toughest thing you've ever done?


That was way back from 2004 to 2007 when the NYCDOE was hiring more people. I am not sure how it is now, but I suspect that they are hiring less now. I believe they were even in a "hiring freeze" a few years ago. They may simply be taking less people than they took before, making the application process even more competitive.

I worked on a Transitional B certificate which was eventually converted to an Initial teaching certificate once I nailed down requirements. I was not in the NYC Teaching Fellows but I was in a different teaching fellowship program.

I was teaching ESL to fourth graders in a NYCDOE elementary school in Washington Heights in northern Manhattan. It was tough! Many of the kids had loads of issues and brought those issues into the classroom. I love teaching and I will spend loads of time preparing for my lessons, but some days teaching was the last thing that got done, because I had to attend to students' needs and defuse a crisis situation. That frustrated me incredibly.

Good luck with it all! Teaching in the NYCDOE really depends on the school and the administration at the school.

Warm regards,
fat_chris


thank you!
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SledgeCleaver



Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 125

PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ttxor1 wrote:
i looked for options teaching Stateside, and applied to the NYC Teaching Fellows program, but didn't get in. Could you give me any insights as to why this might have been?


I think TESOL is not the most high-needs area. I was a teaching fellow, but even though I studied economics, they recruited me for math. This happened to basically anyone who had a semi-technical degree. One of my fellow math fellows was a former lawyer, for example. In any case, don't feel too bad, because despite the fact that teaching in NYC is extremely extremely tough, the program is quite competitive. This is triply so if you didn't study a math- or science-related field.

This also relates to the OP. There are lots of other subjects out there besides TESOL, however you need to have studied something as an undergrad that is reasonably in-demand. Even if you were an English major, you can get an English/Comm Arts license, then you can teach literature in public schools in UK or international schools eventually. If you did science or business (or other areas, even art and music) then there are definitely good opportunities available. For English and TESOL, I'm afraid there are a lot of people with these qualifications, so it's just a bit harder. The more rare your qualifications, generally, the more you will personally be in-demand.

I can also ditto what someone said about masters degrees in instructional design or educational technology. Research more about those, because they can lead places, both at home and abroad. Something like this could definitely differentiate you, or lead you down a different path.
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