Job Discussion Forums

[moosechick]

well hello there, I could do with a bit of help. Im looking at 2 job offers, 1 from language link and 1 from BKC-ih. Ive got 6 months of teaching in Africa and a CELTA. From what I've read BKC seems to be and language link . Any thourghts?

[Communist Smurf]

Actually I would say BKC is a and Language Link is a . Or was it the other way around?

[Nexus]

Smurf's right, BKC can be a little

I think a lot of people here have worked for one or the other (or know people who have). It would be good to here from s.o. who's worked at both who can give a really good comparison.

[moosechick]

in that case "hello, hello where are all you knowledgeable people?"

[waxwing]

Isn't LL a franchise system, like my organisation (English First)? If so, your experience could be drastically different in different branches, since they're run by different people.

Where, exactly, have you read that LL is and BKC is ? Where will these 2 jobs be based?

I can't answer the questions, but it might encourage people to answer if you give more details.

[Phillip Donnelly]

As DOS for BKC, I suppose I should condemn Language Link and praise BKC-IH. However, the truth of the matter is that I've never worked for Language Link, so I can't really compare them.
However, after a little digging around, we've found this article from a couple of years ago comparing BKC-IH to other schools. It was written by Guy Edwards.
A shorter summary was offered by a certain 'Grundie'. It reads as follows-

"I'm aware of your conditions and I know about your teacher retention rate
and I actually consider you as the best 'school' in Moscow, especially since you
> started to offer a multiple entry visa.
> As the first to do so you deserve praise. Language Link, on the other
hand,
> with their policy of offering entry only visas should be blacklisted.
>
> What does concern me however is the fact that you did (and maybe still do)
have
> a policy of offering different salaries to different people for the same
work.
> When you repeatedly quote 'competitive salaries' in your adverts shouldn't
you
> also quote what the salary is?
>
> regards,
>
> grundie

(Answer to above question is between 550 and 675, depending on qualifications and experience. Plus free accomodation, visa support etc)




(And now the article by Guy Edwards)

To compare BKC International House Moscow to other language schools in Moscow and the region we can look at the facilities that the schools offer, the remuneration available and support given by these organizations. Firstly the availability of contact with home through the internet is severely curtailed in terms of the number of computers available to teachers with many other schools having two computers at their central offices and BKC IH having between eight and ten. BKC IH teaching team is very strong within central Moscow, and are available for consultation to help with teaching queries and the recruitment department is there for non academic support concerning visas, housing etc. The standby hours are less at BKC IH in terms of real hours as it is only one standby per week of between 1hour 30 mins to 2 hours 15 mins. Within BKC IH you can choose to do summer camps if you wish or other work can be found for you whereas in other schools it is part of the contractual obligations. BKC IH teachers are given the option of living with another (or other) teachers or alone as they wish; this is not clear in contracts of other schools, they also state that you could be living in a hostel or dormitory which BKC IH never does. At the end of your contract more time is given by BKC IH to vacate the place where you live, so that you have the ability to your last minute sight seeing and shopping. BKC IH pays for the AIDS test that not all the schools do. The illness payment is half your salary per day at BKC IH . The holiday system is much more rigid at many language schools with set periods where holidays are to be taken however at BKC IH as long as a month�s notice is given a holiday can be accepted. The airfare compensation in many schools is less than that given at BKC IH or no subsidy at all. You can be transferred from your promised placement as part of many schools� contract. These are only some of the major differences between BKC IH and other Language Schools in Moscow and I hope that any questions concerning these will be directed to the proper sources.

[waxwing]

I think the ME visa thing is a very good idea. However, major caveat: if you're talking about the 1 year ME business visa, then the legality of your position would have to be clarified... well, I don't know the details.

As to 550 to 675, it's, I guess, just about acceptable, but you should note I'm getting effectively the top end of that scale + my own flat (no share), in a cheaper location - and I'm in my first year. In Moscow that's really a poor salary.

Now I'm going to be rather mean and attack this 'Guy' fellow. It just looks like those awful adverts 'you won't find better anywhere else!' Yeah right.

[Communist Smurf]

I think it's good that Waxwing is pointing out possible decption on the part of this article. But I want to point one thing out in case some people are taking this for granted.

Phillip Donnelley defends BKC every chance he gets. BKC isn't an easy school to defend, making him a target when he posts articles like these. Perhaps it was a mistake a post such a misleading article. Obvious Waxwing made it clear that he was only addressing what this "Guy" said. But when we see this, we can't help but think negatively about the person that posted it.

But this is what I want to point out. How many other people are actually here defending their school? It's not an easy position to take and from day one he decided which side he was on, making himself non-objective and incidentally a target. Don't take for granted that he is atleast *here*.

CS

[waxwing]

CS, I read your post twice, and I have to confess.. I have no idea what point you were trying to make.
Could you rephrase it?

By the way I shouldn't have talked about 'attacking' this Guy guy .. and I certainly didn't mean to attack Phillip. I was attacking the content, which seemed very weak and misleading.

[Communist Smurf]

CS

P.S. You *were* attacking this Guy guy. Saying you weren't attacking him is like saying "Everything you're saying is stupid, but I don't think you're stupid. Don't take it personal." Yes, you may not think he's stupid, but you're attacking him. I pointed out you weren't attacking Phillip. What's my point?

[zaneth]

I doubt Guy will suffer any lasting physical or mental harm.

Poking holes in an argument and providing counterexamples is what you're supposed to do if you want people to see deeper into information. And I think Phillip's skin is thicker than that.

The chocolate ration has been increased to half a bar.

[canucktechie]

Well here's a post from an ordinary BKC employee (not a higherup). I think it's a really good school. The senior people are very supportive, and the class sizes are small. In every respect it's better than my previous job at EF (not in Moscow).

The one big problem at BKC is that a lot of people get split shifts, which usually involves travelling during rush hour (ouch!) and wastes a lot of time. But a commercial school has to schedule classes when the students want them, not when the teachers want them.

The salary is a lot more than the average Russian makes. I have heard people compain that it is not enough to live well in Moscow and take a vacation during that 3 month break. However as far as I know this is also true for other schools in Moscow (and elsewhere in Russia).

The school does come across as a bit disorganised at times but keep in mind this is not Switzerland , and again, I don't know how other Russian schools compare.

[Nexus]

[waxwing]

I agree with Nexus wholeheartedly, and I would like to suggest visiting sites such as www.rabota.ru, if you have even a minimal level of Russian .. you will see exactly where you stand in the salary hierarchy.

[Phillip Donnelly]

In hindsight, I probably shouldn't have posted the two articles from Guy and Grundie. They are vague and do not make specific comparisons between schools. What people are looking for, I think, is sentences like �BKC-IH pays X and Language Link pay Y.
However, I honestly do not have this information, and even if I did, as DOS for BKC-IH, I probably wouldn�t be allowed to post it on the web, as I would need the permission of Language Link.
Moreover, the real salary figure is often more complicated the nominal monthly salary figure because you have to take into account flight reimbursement, end-of-contract bonus, accommodation and quality of accommodation, transport etc. Even if I had all these figures for both schools (which I don�t), you would also have to factor in hard to define qualities such as professional support, teacher development, senior staff support and so on.
Sorry if I�m not being much help with this thread, but I only see half the picture.