Job Discussion Forums

dragonpiwo · Joined: 04 Mar 2013 Posts: 1650 Location: Berlin

Panstwowa Inspekcja Pracy is a government office. Find out where it is and go there with a Polish friend who can help you.

Just the threat of going to see these people will be enough. If your school is up to no good, they won't want a 'control'. You'll get paid.

billbob · Joined: 19 Nov 2009 Posts: 55

Does this government inspectorate look out for all people who work in all places under any circumstances, or is it just for those on a full employment contract (i.e. 0 people teaching English in private schools)?

dragonpiwo · Joined: 04 Mar 2013 Posts: 1650 Location: Berlin

Looks out for everyone. Language schools are terrified of them because generally, they treat native speakers like shit.

delphian-domine · Joined: 11 Mar 2011 Posts: 674

Janek · Joined: 25 Sep 2006 Posts: 79 Location: Krakow, Poland

Janek · Joined: 25 Sep 2006 Posts: 79 Location: Krakow, Poland

simon_porter00 · Joined: 09 Nov 2005 Posts: 505 Location: Warsaw, Poland

Just out of interest, what's this concept of 'fake self-employed'?

If someone is self-employed, i.e. is a registered entrepreneur and is paying taxes/zus etc and offers their services to a school on a freelance basis and the school agrees to work with someone on that basis, what's the problem?

Aside from the negotiated terms which should run alongside such agreement - pay, holiday leave, non-compete, reporting etc which could be negotiated in a really bad way, i don't see why this should be stopped.

Or am i missing something?

dragonpiwo · Joined: 04 Mar 2013 Posts: 1650 Location: Berlin

I think that's one for Delph Simon.

I think they have to offer you a proper contract if you are actually working full-time for them like a normal employed person.

All I know is this. I threatened the school for which I've been working part-time for a couple of months (also CCd it to the Warsaw office) and hey presto, I got paid after 3 days. The school said I was being 'unfair'. I pointed out that I'd worked for 73 days and not been paid 1 cent. There's other shit too in these agreements like you have to give 28 days notice but they can get rid of you in a heartbeat. These schools want it both ways. It really is dreadful.

I'm all for proper contracts Delph, so I tip my hat if that's what you offer.

I've actually learned (re-affirmed) a lot by working here for 2 months. You need to be mobile, have an office and work long hours. If I hadn't had a car, it would have been awful getting to the clients. The other thing I've learned from the students themselves is that the market is flooded with poor teachers. The only way is to go it alone like Janek. The language schools are worse than they have ever been.

I'll do it to keep me busy at some point in the distant future. Meanwhile, I'm off to the UAE with the missus. Contract signed. What I earned gross for working 40 hours here, I'll make in 1 day there. Not bragging-it's just a fact and I want to pay off the mortgage in under 2 years.

delphian-domine · Joined: 11 Mar 2011 Posts: 674

simon_porter00 · Joined: 09 Nov 2005 Posts: 505 Location: Warsaw, Poland

I'm not sure i get it still.
A school (a legal entity) enters into a contract with a teacher (another legal entity)

The contract has provisions which details the working relationship.

If a teacher only works for this one school, this is then seen as fake self-employment?

This kind of relationship exists across many markets/industries. I can't see how they can go just after language schools arbitrarily as one industry out of many that practices this (well, yes i can, this is Poland after all).

If, for example, the contract doesn't allow for accepted employment regulations e.g.holiday leave i.e. the school simply abuses the freelancer then yes, but even then if this is agreed between the parties i still think it'll be messy litigation.

If this is chased up, which is no skin off my nose, it'll end up shutting most language schools down or really mean teachers are paid peanuts.

delphian-domine · Joined: 11 Mar 2011 Posts: 674

This is my understanding of it - might be wrong, but this should be pretty accurate. In order to work as a genuinely freelance teacher, you need to show that you're operating a genuine business. A genuine business would be unlikely to be solely working with one company - and is usually a tell-tale sign that the company wants to avoid paying ZUS/other employment liabilities. It's not legal to avoid ZUS payments (hence why umowa o dzieło has been more or less eliminated as an option for teachers) - but obviously schools don't want to pay 20% ZUS contributions on top of the gross salary. This leaves forcing teachers into self employment so that schools/companies can avoid paying ZUS - but there's no way you can be self employed if your work is fully directed and that you have no option of refusing work (which a genuine business owner could). Nothing is being chased up now, but it may come. But - of course - the genuinely freelance teacher is unaffected by this.

dragonpiwo · Joined: 04 Mar 2013 Posts: 1650 Location: Berlin

Empik has another thing called Twoj Start Up and involves a CRM system (whatever that is). They charge you for it.

Master Shake · Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1202 Location: Colorado, USA

dragonpiwo · Joined: 04 Mar 2013 Posts: 1650 Location: Berlin

I think the 'safest' kind of work here is with a uni.

Empik even asked me to fill in a 'substitution form' after I'd quit. Clearly up to no good.

dragonpiwo · Joined: 04 Mar 2013 Posts: 1650 Location: Berlin

The sad truth is that most EFL teachers here in Poland are on or near the bread line, so just want the work and don't care about their type of contract. Schools know this. They also know that many native speakers don't think about such things and newbies especially are prone to trust their employers. Schools take full advantage of this.

Who would want to be starting out in Poland these days?

The boat here sailed long ago.