| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
RedLightning
Joined: 08 Aug 2015
Posts: 137
Location: United States
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
plumpy nut
Joined: 12 Mar 2011
Posts: 1652
|
 Posted: Mon May 30, 2016 7:48 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| The US has a teacher shortage, at least for sciences and elementary school. I don't know if that is what her field is going to be. Given the fact that she is needed I don't see anything wrong with that even given that she is an undocumented foreigner. Let's hope we don't end up with an ultra-liberal teacher, although regardless the way it works in the US, she has the right to belong to any political group she wants. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wolfsong
Joined: 16 Jul 2016
Posts: 76
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 5:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The article seems deliberately confusing. On the one hand she is classed as an undocumented migrant but on the other she is allowed to graduate from high school and admits to being lots of help to get her associate degree. Plus she will get extra help for her teacher training. With all of this, she's hardly a migrant at all.  I wonder if such help was given to American students fro equally poor backgrounds they wouldn't do equally well? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 2:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
It is in New Mexico. 
Regards,
John |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 4:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Wolfsong wrote: |
| The article seems deliberately confusing. On the one hand she is classed as an undocumented migrant but on the other she is allowed to graduate from high school and admits to being lots of help to get her associate degree. Plus she will get extra help for her teacher training. With all of this, she's hardly a migrant at all. I wonder if such help was given to American students fro equally poor backgrounds they wouldn't do equally well? |
Don't get confused between immigration status and economics. For starters, the federal 2012 Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) program provides people "brought to the US unlawfully as children with temporary work permits as long as they meet certain requirements." It doesn't guarantee citizenship but is intended to allow undocumented immigrants, like the young woman in the article, to legally work in the US without fear of deportation. In other words, it gives her and others with similar status the ability to contribute fully and equally to US society regardless of which occupation they pursue. Moreover, DACA is not a financial aid program; that assistance is coming through the TechTeach program, which doesn't consider immigration status in terms of educating prospective k-12 teachers to address the country's teacher-shortage issue. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wangdaning
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 3154
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 5:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
The federal government is refusing to control immigration. An immigrant, if they came as a child can illegally compete in the state because the DHS (Dept of Homeland Security) said so. The DACA is not a law, it is a policy of the federal government. If a local area decides to deny it they will lose all funding for their schools.
I would call it blackmail personally. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 11:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
| wangdaning wrote: |
| The DACA is not a law, it is a policy of the federal government. If a local area decides to deny it they will lose all funding for their schools. |
What's your source for this info? This is an issue of public higher ed institutions charging resident undocumented students pricey out-of-state tuition as opposed to in-state rates.
The 1996 Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act (IIRIRA) maintains that undocumented immigrants cannot receive in-state tuition based on state residence unless US citizens from any state could also receive the benefit (https://www.newamerica.org/education-policy/edcentral/college-tuition-dreamer/). In response, some state governments saw a loophole in IIRIRA; they advocate that in-state tuition be offered to DREAMers who attended and graduated from high school in the same state. However, tuition equity isn't supported in a handful of other states that now have laws to disqualify these students for the lower rates. Regardless, this is at the state level rather than with the feds. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 12:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think it is a policy implemented by the Obama Administration
| Quote: |
What DACA Is Not
This is not a new law. It is only an executive action being taken by the President. As such, it can be terminated by the President and is likely to be terminated by Mitt Romney, if he becomes President in January 2013, as evidenced by his opposition to the DREAM Act, his statement that "the president's action makes reaching a long-term solution more difficult," and that it is "a short-term matter and can be reversed by subsequent presidents," and his selection of his running mate.
In fact, President Obama himself has stated that "This is not amnesty. This is not immunity. This is not a path to citizenship. It's not a permanent fix."
Deferred Action does not provide a path to the green card or to citizenship.
Deferred Action only means that while it is in force, the government will not seek to deport the people who qualify for it.
Deferred Action does not excuse unlawful presence accrued before it is granted, nor unlawful presence accrued after it expires. |
https://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/deferred-action-for-childhood-arrivals-obamas-dreamer-action |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 12:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
We've already established what DACA is. I'm questioning the basis for wangdaning's following statement: "If a local area decides to deny it they will lose all funding for their schools."  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wangdaning
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 3154
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 3:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| So federal funding flows freely even if you deny their policy? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Dear wangdaning,
Um, DACA is the law. It''s an Executive Order, and they "have the force of law."
"Executive orders are Presidential directives with the force of law, and do not require the approval of Congress to take effect. All modern Presidents have made heavy use of the Executive Order as a policy tool to circumvent Congress."
Can you cite even one instance of "a local area (deciding) to deny it?"
In technical terms, that's called breaking the law.
Awaiting your example(s).
Regards,
John |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wangdaning
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 3154
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 11:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The Bundys denied FED law, what happened there?
In Waco they denied FED law, what happened there?
JFK made the EO to end the Federal Reserve, what happened there?
Schools do not, with the exception of some religious sects (mormon, quaker, and amish communities for example), deny, mostly because they want the money.
Heavy use of EOs is only with the most recent 3-4 presidents. An executive order is not a law, it is an order. They have the "force" of law, but that does not make them law. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 1:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| JFK made the EO to end the Federal Reserve |
I find this interesting as 'made +noun+ to do' is a common English error made by speakers of slavic languages.
Curious if wangdaning is actually personally directly knowledgeable regarding US law, politics, or history??   |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 2:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
| spiral78 wrote: |
I find this interesting as 'made +noun+ to do' is a common English error made by speakers of slavic languages.
Curious if wangdaning is actually personally directly knowledgeable regarding US law, politics, or history?? |
Apparently not.
| wangdaning wrote: |
| So federal funding flows freely even if you deny their policy? |
Whose policy is denied? And by whom? You continue to be vague, and thus, make no sense.
Again... In the US, universities and colleges have never been concerned about the student's immigrant/citizen status, espeically given that institutions of higher ed compete against each other for students who have the ability to successfully manage and complete university studies.
Undocumented immigrants have had to look over their shoulder for fear of being deported, regardless if they're in school or not. Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) addresses that specific concern by giving temporary work authorization to those who qualify, which keeps them from being prosecuted and kicked out of the US. DACA is is not a path to citizenship.
With their fear of being deported out of the way temporarily, their next big issue is about tuition costs --- whether the undocumented student is allowed to pay the university's in-state tuition (in the state they reside in) or if the only option are out-of-state costs because of the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act (IIRIRA) from 1996. Some states have found a way to skirt IIRIRA by including the requirement that the student attended and graduated from high school in that particular state. For example, an undocumented DREAMer attends k-12 grades in California. He/she is eligible for the in-state tuition rate at X university in California. However, several states follow IIRIRA to a tee. In this scenario, a DREAMer has resided in Arizona for most of his/her life and completed high school there. The student can enroll in an Arizona university but will be required to pay the higher out-of-state tuition similar to what a US citizen who recently moved to Arizona would pay as a student.
It's not rocket science. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wangdaning
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 3154
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 3:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| nomad soul wrote: |
| spiral78 wrote: |
I find this interesting as 'made +noun+ to do' is a common English error made by speakers of slavic languages.
Curious if wangdaning is actually personally directly knowledgeable regarding US law, politics, or history?? |
Apparently not.
| wangdaning wrote: |
| So federal funding flows freely even if you deny their policy? |
Whose policy is denied? And by whom? You continue to be vague, and thus, make no sense.
Again... In the US, universities and colleges have never been concerned about the student's immigrant/citizen status, espeically given that institutions of higher ed compete against each other for students who have the ability to successfully manage and complete university studies.
Undocumented immigrants have had to look over their shoulder for fear of being deported, regardless if they're in school or not. Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) addresses that specific concern by giving temporary work authorization to those who qualify, which keeps them from being prosecuted and kicked out of the US. DACA is is not a path to citizenship.
With their fear of being deported out of the way temporarily, their next big issue is about tuition costs --- whether the undocumented student is allowed to pay the university's in-state tuition (in the state they reside in) or if the only option are out-of-state costs because of the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act (IIRIRA) from 1996. Some states have found a way to skirt IIRIRA by including the requirement that the student attended and graduated from high school in that particular state. For example, an undocumented DREAMer attends k-12 grades in California. He/she is eligible for the in-state tuition rate at X university in California. However, several states follow IIRIRA to a tee. In this scenario, a DREAMer has resided in Arizona for most of his/her life and completed high school there. The student can enroll in an Arizona university but will be required to pay the higher out-of-state tuition similar to what a US citizen who recently moved to Arizona would pay as a student.
It's not rocket science. |
You make it sound as if I should ditch passport and move my family illegally. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
