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What do we say, when our students ask our opinion about Iraq
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Should we discuss the Iraq situation with Students
Yes
68%
 68%  [ 11 ]
No
31%
 31%  [ 5 ]
Total Votes : 16

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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12877
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2003 3:34 am    Post subject: Raising consciousness versus raising heck Reply with quote

Dear dan,
" living there must, in a word, suck." In a word, yes - if you want to call it " living ". We're here - most of us - for strictly mercenary reasons; in a word: money. But there are subtler ways to " raise consciousness " than engaging in the discussion of " forbidden topics "; one of them is simply by example. And, rightly or wrongly, I like to think that I've " raised a few consciousnesses " ( just made up that word ) in my time here.
Regards,
John
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richard ame



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 319
Location: Republic of Turkey

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2003 7:42 am    Post subject: The war in Iraq Reply with quote

The students that I teach in a University in Izmir Turkey are aware of the conflict in Iraq and although they are of course 100% Muslim they seem to me to be indifferent to the war very few have asked questions about it and even fewer have asked my opinion about it,without getting embroiled in a heavy debate on the right and wrongs of the ıssue I have at least used it too good advantage as a precurser for further debate on other topics and even as a Brit they don't see me as a war monger so maybe I have a better rapport with them than I realise . I think that unless Turkey gets sucked into a power vacumn created by the Kurds and maybe Iran then it will stay that way .
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dan



Joined: 20 Mar 2003
Posts: 247
Location: shanghai

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2003 7:53 pm    Post subject: middle east Reply with quote

john
sorry to have used such strong language, john but it was the only word that came to mind ("suck"). yea, the leading by example is gold - probably the best way one can make any sort of meaningful change in the long run. as we are currently witnessing (again), imposing ideas on a group of people seldom works, not to mention the hypocrasy in regards to the conflict in iraq. if only american leaders had any sense of self-irony b/c then they would realize an attitude of "i'll pound freedom and equality into you and, damn it, if you dont like it, that's too bad!" is doomed to fail, and fail miserably. yes, i dont think i could imagine living there. im curious, though: is the situation as such that sticking around for mercenary reasons is worth your while, $-wise? what could a teacher with an MA in linguistics and several years experience expect to make, just out of curiosity...
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12877
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2003 3:37 am    Post subject: Some info Reply with quote

Dear dan,
Well, it'd be hard to find a more fitting word, although I must admit, the lack of " social diversions " doesn't bother me much. Besides, I'll be taking an " exit only " in about another 80 days or so. To answer your question, well, it depends on whether the " several years experience " is in teaching abroad or not. Most places here won't count the years - which make up the add-on increments to the basic salary - unless they're EFL ones, not ESL. Doesn't make sense to me, but then so much else here doesn't, either. At the IPA, an MA with NO experience would start off at only about 7,500 SR, which is around $2,000 a month. Each year of EFL experience adds another 350 SR a month to the salary. I'm making 12, 150 SR a month, not counting the overtime, which adds on about another $8,000 to $10,000 a year. So, my annual total is about $45,000 to $47,000. No taxes, of course, and not much to spend it on over here - unless you like to travel. So a lot of that can be saved. On another subject, I see the Iraqis are catching on fast to the " advantages of democracy ". Here's a page 4 headline from yesterday's Arab News:

" IRAQIS STAGE FIRST ANTI-US PROTEST RALLY "

and a bit of the story:

" Demonstrators, holding up signs saying ' Bush Saddam
', chanted: ' There is only one God and America is the
enemy of God. We will sacrifice our souls and our
blood for Iraq. ' "

All the time, of course, they were being guarded by U.S. Marines. I love it. What I also love is that nowhere, but nowhere, in the article did the reporter mention that such a demonstration against Saddam would
have been unthinkable a week ago. Every participant would have been tortured and killed ( and probably all his family, as well ). Also, naturally, nowhere was it mentioned that such a demonstation held in Riyadh
against, say, the House of Saud would also land all the particpants in jail ( or worse ). The irony of it is so beautiful.
Regards,
John
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12397
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2003 3:10 pm    Post subject: iraq Reply with quote

What I liked in the reports of the last couple of days in the local press is the widely-reported belief that the "looters" in Baghdad and Basra are "not local Iraqis but mercenaries bussed in by the Americans".

But the whole thing is just beginning oif you ask me !
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12877
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2003 3:39 pm    Post subject: Worms galore Reply with quote

Dear scot47,
Regarding " post-war Iraq ", the phrase " can of worms " seems woefully inadequate. How about " shipping container of worms "? Lordy, I pity poor old Jay Garner - he's embarking on what must be the worst job in the world, and a no-win situation, to boot. Fasten your seat belts, boys and girls; it's going to be a VERY bumpy ride,
Regards,
John
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richard ame



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 319
Location: Republic of Turkey

PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2003 7:58 am    Post subject: the war in Iraq Reply with quote

Hi
One of the more interesting questions that has being asked lately goes something like this If the war was about W.M.D and their percieved threat to the free world and in particular the good old usof a ,where are they?
Bearing in mind none were used during the conflict and none have being found so far!!!!
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travellingscot



Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Posts: 64
Location: UK/Eastern Europe

PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2003 10:58 am    Post subject: Question for itslatedoors Reply with quote

In your posting earlier in this thread your refer to giving someone a beasting--was this a typo?
Here in the UK amongst the prison population the term beast is applied to those segregated on rule 43 for their own protection because of the nature of their crimes,usually of a sexual nature.
I do not wish to offend anyone with particular religious or moral views so i will not elaborate on a possible interpretation of your posting if acted upon,but i'm sure you get my meaning.
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itslatedoors



Joined: 17 Feb 2003
Posts: 97

PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2003 1:15 pm    Post subject: reply to travellingscot Reply with quote

a beasting is something that is done to you in her majesty's royal marines when you mess up.It usually involves extreme physical exercise for a long time.It is not a pleasant experience.
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