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Flotsam and Jetsam

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Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 645

PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2003 11:18 pm    Post subject: Flotsam and Jetsam Reply with quote

One of the big problems in this "field" are the numbers of unemployables,undesirables,unqualified "backpack commandos",and people generally just farting around overseas(because they see "teaching" overseas" as an easy out).

However,a lot of these people who lack any qualifications to teach try to defend their "right" to teach by laying claim to some special charm.charisma,etc.blah,blah.Or they think their good looks will get them by(and in some places, it DOES)

The other big problem: a lot of the so-called "schools" which are often ill-disguised,fly-by-night ,rip-off operations.

What a combination!!! Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Posts: 777
Location: London UK

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 12:13 am    Post subject: The "so-called" teachers Reply with quote

Bnix, obviously you have a lot of rage when it comes to this subject! Smile

But would you agree that some, if not most of the blame should not be aimed at the "teachers", rather at the people that employ them? As I said in a different post, often teachers are not really needed. If all a school wants is a pretty western face, then why not give it to them?

If a school chooses a pretty face over a qualified professional, then surely this is an indication of the school's shortcomings as opposed to the evil of people-who-say-they-are-teachers-when-they-aren't-really.

Just my 2c worth!
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Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15299

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 6:07 am    Post subject: flotsam and jetsam from the wetsren world Reply with quote

I too am horrified when I see some of the characters that get into teaching. Fortunately in the Middle East the real backpackers are missing.

But I still read the postings here from these unqualified, unsuitable psychos who should be in Bellevue ! And they have one year's experience in Korea and think that has transformed them into teachers !!!!
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Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 11:12 am    Post subject: call Jerry Springer Reply with quote

This topic is developing into a real outlandish set of circumstances that seem suitable for a movie of the week or a talk show like Oprah. What's the next loophole to justify dating a student?

1. I just want to date the hot babe in my class to make my OTHER girlfriend angry and pay more attention to me.

2. I was in the hospital with amnesia and didn't know my nurse wanted to take lessons, so after I got out, she joined my class.

3. It's ok if I date a student. I'm/She's married anyway, so this won't get serious.

4. It was only a dare from a co-worker. We'll never get serious after the first date.

5. Hey, I showed up drunk/stoned for class and really didn't mean to ask her out.

6. I'm leaving the country soon anyway, so what the heck?

7. Everyone ELSE is doing it. Uhhhh, right?

Gee, this is fun.
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Joined: 02 Feb 2003
Posts: 101

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I particullary like it when they get indignant, ie. "I don't get paid enough." "I'm a natural man, my school's lucky to have me." My personal favourite, "How come you get paid more than me you don't have an American accent?"
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Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15299

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 11:59 am    Post subject: flotsam jetsam and all the rest that rises to the top Reply with quote

I just read this over on the Teacher Training Forum :

"In Response To: Why do you teach TEFL? (edward)

I think it's the people. Not only the students - helping them get ahead, watching them learn, feeling you've provided them with something constructive etc. - but also the teachers. All TEFL teachers are, almost by definition, interested in other cultures, many or most have experienced such cultures first hand, and enjoyed the experience. Result: in the TEFL staffroom there are no bigots, petty minds, louts, ignoramuses or uncultured xenophobes. TEFL teachers are almost exclusively democratic,liberal-minded, intelligent, cultured, humanists. How many other professions can guarantee that in a working environment?"

This must be meant in irony ? Or has this guy been teaching on the Planet Tralfamador, far from the reality of life on Terra ?
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Ben Round de Bloc

Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1946

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 12:52 pm    Post subject: In my corner of the world Reply with quote

I think one of the reasons it's so easy for the unqualified to find employment teaching EFL in Mexico is that it is so common here for people to work in jobs for which they haven't been trained or certified, especially in teaching/education. Only about half of my fellow EFL teachers at the university where I work have degrees in education or certification to teach EFL. The only requirements are that they have a university degree in something/anything and supposedly have a high level of proficiency in the English language. In education in general here, lots of people who teach have no training or background in education. In many schools, they have to take and pass a proficiency exam in the subject area they want to teach, and that's the only requirement. Therefore, it doesn't seem unusual to students here if their English teachers don't have any qualifications to teach EFL. Take that to language school level, and most students view any native speaker of English as "qualified" to teach them English.
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Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 2:52 pm    Post subject: huh? Reply with quote

What the heck happened? That post of mine was NOT written in THIS forum. Somehow it skipped the subject of dating/flirting and landed here!!!!!!!!!! DAVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 645

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 11:16 pm    Post subject: Glenski,"Hot Babes",Oprah,What The???? Reply with quote

Yeah,Glenski,I did a double(maybe even a triple)take when I saw they had
stuck your post on dating in the thread on unqualified teachers.
Obviously,there are still some kinks in the new forums.I have still been unable to log onto the Korean forum,despite following all directions.

In addition,I lost my password(for the regular forum), applied for another,hit that activation string they give you and was informed the activation stream was"not in the databank".Huh?Although I eventually got back in(the regular forum...I still have not managed to lock into the Korean forum...despite following all of their suggestions).

Anyway,Glenski,your post was a good one,even though it did get misdirected! Smile
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Joined: 08 Feb 2003
Posts: 364

PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2003 12:50 pm    Post subject: glenski's misdirected post Reply with quote


Your post was misdirected probably by malicious gremlins. BUT for what it is worth I agree with you. In my eyes teachers are authority figures who have some moral obligations. One of these obligation is not to get sexually involved with their students.

But this is connected with the thread where your message got posted.
As long as this "profession" attracts beachbums who have neither training nor ethics we should expect this kind of behaviour.
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Joined: 04 Mar 2003
Posts: 46

PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 10:35 am    Post subject: Why so much Flotsam and Jetsam? Reply with quote

...because the oceans are so darn big.

Seriously. There are not enough teachers to teach in the US. There are teacher shortages all over the world. More students, not enough schools and etc.

I know that in China the forecast is really bad. By 2005? If I remember correctly,there will not be enough schools for the up and coming students who are already IN school. There will also not be enough teachers.

I believe any teacher, no matter how much they lack in qualification, experience, and the like will be better for students who would otherwise have no teachers at all.

Even though I work and live in a large metropolis in China, I constantly get calls and Emails from schools who ask me if I know of any available teachers. This happens weekly to me, and I also receive calls and IMs from a few teachers asking the same.

Unqualified, inexperienced teachers or not, the world needs people. If they can be good mentors and educators given time then so be it. If not, at least they hopefully helped out someone, a few someones along the way.

Will things get better? I would like to think so. Will there always be unqualified teachers in the mix? Of course, it's just the natural way of things. Too many students, too many bad schools, and too many chiefs and not enough indians to keep things straight.

I see posts and messages at various places, including here, that lamblast so many aspects of the animal ESL, you would think the beast couldn't crawl, much less survive in such a robust manner as it does, enough to circumnavigate the entire planet!

Do you have a degree? Does that make you more qualified than someone who doesn't? Are you as good a teacher as each and every teacher you had in middle school, highschool, Univ. and so on? Do you remember the bad teachers in your life? Are you making a difference, regardless of qualifications? Are you just skimming through a country for the money rather then for social development, friendships, relationships, and betterment of a the local culture? [the above questions are retorical, and not directed at the author of original post]

I think a lot of the trouble that is created within these forums at eslcafe has more to do with generalizations of forums, and the extreme variations of teacher qualifications and experience.

Ideally there should be one board for each of the following:

Teachers here to make a difference within the society they occupy

Teachers out to make money

Teachers who wish to raise the pole of qualifications and professionalism

Teachers/people just passing by for a summer job/quick experience of the world

Newbies who need advice from qualified board admins.

But that is not likely to happen,so we should "grin and bare it" as far as those posts which tend to rub the skin on your brain, ego, and personna.

Opinions abound here, but so do personalities. Also, some within these forums tend to think of this as actual discussion; this is always a mistake--an illusion. It's more like one sided conversations a person has with grafitti on the train station wall. Or even bumper stickers that say:




...enjoy my bumpersticker

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Bindair Dundat

Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Posts: 1123

PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have seen this concern raised quite regularly and by quite a few people for as long as Sperling's board has been in operation.

It's never been a problem for me. I have had my share of colleagues who I didn't *like*, but they've always been qualified. I think I have avoided the worst of the worst by being well-qualified myself and by going after only the better jobs. Poorly qualified people just don't get the better jobs, so I haven't had to rub shoulders with them.

I've had some employers who I didn't like, but they weren't fly-by-night. Fly-by-night operators don't run universities or government-sponsored language schools (military or otherwise), and those are the only places where I work. You can find some extremely irritating administrators almost anywhere, but I've never been cheated out of my pay, beaten up, fired without cause, etc.

I have had quite a few students who I thought were less serious than I was, but very few of them were there purely for entertainment; you'll find a certain percentage of ANY student population who are there because their parents want them to be, etc.; that just comes with the territory.

I think there's a certain wisdom and fairness in unqualified teachers matching up with irresponsible operators and with students who don't care about much of anything but social opportunities. Underachievers, scammers, and good-timers seek their own level. I'd say if *YOU* are not happy with your niche, maybe it's time for you to move upscale.
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