Job Discussion Forums

[ContemporaryDog]

From what I've heard, Shanghai accommodation is still amazingly cheap compared to the west. Still, I wouldn't work there for less than about 12,000.
Shanghai is more and more of an international city these days. I've heard going out there can be more expensive than London. Someone I know who lived there said just going out for a few beers at an average bar you could get through a couple of thousand yuan in a night.

[millie]

Hello ContemporaryDog,

(Just keeping the topic on the relativities within mainland China below)

I dunno about a couple thousand a night – that’s a long night or a whale of thirst

There may well be places where beer is the price of liquid gold but most of the gin mills that cater for foreigners charge up to 50RMB for a small beer.

As I said, it is up to the individual and how they choose to spend their lucre.
However, there are plenty of places to sit down and have a large beer for 5 RMB or so and you’ll be the the only non-local there.

That may not be to your liking of course.
Nor should it justify low wages.
Cheers
M

[ShapeSphere]

Location: Any office in any school in any part of China.
Scene: Conversation between Chinese Manager and his assistant. (Translated from the Chinese into English).

Chinese Manager: I have secured the services of another young foreigner for one year. I will pay him 3500 RMB per month. The contract will appear reasonable, but naturally we will force extra work upon him later. We will smile and greet him on arrival. All will appear well on the surface. But we will treat him badly, because we have more power than him.

Assistant: That's excellent news, but why do they come here for so little money, when there is such a demand for their services? And why are they so full of hope and high expectations - when many people who have lived here - tell a different story.

CM: Because they are young, idealistic, want to travel and money is of no great concern to them. They think they know everything, but yet have so much to learn.

Asst: Maybe they're f*cking stupid as well?

CM: Possibly. But we are so very clever, wily and wise. Full of wisdom and culture. Accustomed to thinking and dealing with complicated matters. Our superior negotiation skills always triumph. We are so perfect.

Asst: Almost oh honourable one.

CM: What do you mean oh soon to be sacked for asking too many questions one?

Asst: If we're so perfect then why is my d*ck so small? It wouldn't fill the backside of an ant.

CM: Ah well. You can't have everything.

[tradinup]

HAHAHA!!! That's good...

Anyways, I think we've established that anyone with a degree who wants a good RMB salary can get it, but they maybe not be able to get it from the smaller towns because they can't afford it.

So, if the teacher wants to go to one of these small and village-like places and take a lower salary I think that's normal and fine. It's not getting ripped off there because that's all the small school can bare. Though, in a big city, taking 3500 may be less than what a qualified EFL teacher warrants.

[ChinaEFLteacher]

i'm currently job hunting for the next term and i can hardly find anything for above 4,000 in a college in an eastern seaboard city near shanghai. this is one of the richest cities in china, yet they're unwilling to pay more than the common colleges in the interior. i make 4,000 now in the interior and can hardly find a school willing to match it, even though i now have a b.a., 3 years experience, and good refs. from current school. i'm starting to get disheartened. any advice or recommendations? i know it's not about the money or i'd be off to the richer countries, but money means something, and i believe i should get what is proper.

[sojourner]

Re a possible shortage of well-paid jobs in, or near, Shanghai.

It could be because of the Law of Supply and Demand ! It appears that nearly everyone wants a job in the Shanghai area - consequently, why should colleges offer, say, 5- 7 K per month when there are teachers quite willing to accept much less ? It's all a matter of economics - rather than what you feel "is proper" !

If you are keen to get a well-paid job, you need to be willing to consider towns and cities that don't appear to be too popular with the ESL set. Are you willing to consider towns and cities that are only 4 or 5 hours away from Shanghai ? If you are, with your experience you should be able to command 5 K.

Peter

[ChinaEFLteacher]

thanks peter. the town i referred to is hangzhou, but most of the cities in the vicinity of 4-5 hours, like hangzhou and nanjing, are very similar. it'll be a hard bargain to get to 5k. anyone else know of something?

[sojourner]

Hangzhou is one of my favourite Chinese cities. I would dearly love to work there ! When my previous job ended in January this year, I searched for jobs in both Hangzhou and Ningbo. At that time, very few colleges/unis in those places were offering much above 4 K - apparently, it's still the same story !

I'm teaching at a college in a fairly remote corner of Zhejiang province - am on 5 K, with free accommodation, free utilities, and travelling allowances, for the usual 16 hours pw - and, I'm only about 5 hours away from Shanghai ! Forget the large, popular places like Hangzhou and Ningbo. Many much smaller places often have colleges - so, shop around ! (Admitedly, I'm on 5 K because of my Master's - but, with your several years experience, you should be able to negotiate for 4.5 to 5 K )

Peter

[ChinaEFLteacher]

thanks for your input Peter!

[yamahuh]

[oprah]

Does having teaching experience in China have value?? When I mentioned to the leader about my experience, he said well he has 30 years of experience and you make more than me???

[millie]

Hello opah,

Well I guess the obvious retort to that sort of dismissive arrogance is "but what sort of experience have you had compared to mine?” Not sure that it would have much impact though

Another concern related to salaries is that people believe that they should be paid X amount but simply find that they are offered only RMB4,000 or 5K, far below their expectations.

It has been said before and I simply repeat, except for a few, you don’t make much money in China.
There are other nearby countries where teachers stand a much better chance of doing that (eg Korea, Taiwan, and Japan – yeh, OK lots of variables but there you go.)

So my advice to those in such a situation: the world is a big place and China is certainly not the most glorious part of it.

The next point is that people in China who make much better than average salaries have usually been here a while and it may have been be a gradual climb up the financial ladder.
Again, there are exceptions and this includes teachers hired from home with Joint Venture programmes in China.

There is another that issue has been discussed by various people on the list over time but it still intrigues me.

Do Chinese educators and administrators really believe they are doing a good job -when clearly they are not
-OR-
Do they think they are just doing the best they can with the available resources?

For a start, this is an absurdly huge generalisation for a country of this size and I see examples that may confirm either view.
However, the nature of the answer would tell you something about the future of EFL education in China.
Thus:
Will it make meaningful progress?
-OR-
Will it remain a source of cash and/or a means to bolster the position and ego of those concerned?

I must say I am not overly pessimistic about it since change is neither uniform nor constant and depends on local education boards as much as the personality of individuals in control at a school level.
It will just take a long time I think.

M

[yamahuh]

[fred13331]

[/quote]



Where I work now, I teach 12 hours a week, live off campus in a rent free apartment, and make 5500 RMB a month. I also teach about 10 hours at different locations for at least 100 RMB an hour[/quote]

If the point you are trying to make is that this guy, by accepting 3500, is helping to keep salaries down, that is a fair point. However, in all honesty, I think anyone accepting 5500 a month is actually doing the same thing. 5500 is peanuts, it is an insult, and accepting it does in fact help keep salaries down

[7969]

Nice revival of a nine year old thread Fred. Half the posters on here are probably deceased by now.