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Homeland Security Woes
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RatAttax



Joined: 07 Mar 2005
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 2:36 pm    Post subject: Homeland Security Woes Reply with quote

Question Hi everyone. I'm an ESL teacher, working in Boston. I became TEFL certified last February, and have been working for over a year trying to obtain my Italian citizenship, so that I can comfortably (and legally) work in Italia.
I have ALL the documents I need, but I'm awaiting the office of Homeland Security to "approve" my great grandfather's naturalization papers. The Italian Consulate requires this "authorization" of the naturalization papers. I seem to constantly run into walls on this. Can anybody tell me WHO to talk to or WHERE to direct my questions? I am becoming frustrated and feel that I'll NEVER get this last piece of the citizenship puzzle in place. Grazie mille!
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Gregorio



Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Ratattax.

Have you actually spoken to your consulate about this or are you basing this on their "written" requirements on their web site? I have found that there are many exceptions to the rules for acquiring citizenship because I am on the same quest as you are. However, I am dealing with the Chicago Italian Consulate and they have been extremely accomodating. Just for an example, the Chicago Italian web site states that I need to have my great grandfathers birth certificate from Italy as well as his proof of Italian citizenship. Well, I mailed out for his birth certificate and his Proof of Italian citizenship (actually, I don't even know what other proof there is supposed to be besides a birth certificate) and only received his birth certificate from the comune in Italia. I emailed the consulate asking them if just his birth certificate would be sufficient, and they said yes. I was happy because I do not want to have to snail mail another request.

I have heard other stories similar to this, but again, those are with the Chicago Consulate.

For my great grandfather's Naturalization papers the Chicago consulate will accept copies from the INS. No authorization that I know of is required.

I just want to make sure you have inquired directly with someone from the consulate about the requirements. What is on the web site is always different than what is actually required or supposedly required.

I hope I provided some hope.........
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Gregorio



Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK Rattax...

I just checked out the Boston Consulate web site and I feel sorry for you because it is absolutely riduculous. They don't even have a link for citizenship requirements. It is absolutely the worst consulate web site I have seen. I would try to call them directly and ask who deals with citizenship processing and see if you can get a straight answer out of them. Afterall... that is the person who will be processing your application.
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dea712



Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Boston MA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:08 pm    Post subject: Obtaining Italian Citizenship Reply with quote

Hi,

I too have been trying to find out where I can obtain the correct documents in order to apply for my dual citizenship. Right now, I am having difficulty finding out when my great (maternal) grandfather was naturalized. I actually sent a letter to the Court Archives in Boston asking them for this information since the NARA in Waltham didn't have it. Where were you guys able to find it or did your family already have the papers? Also, do you know anything about the website myitaliancitizenship.com? They claim that they will be able to obtain all of the needed and translated documents needed from Italy, but for about $39 for each document (including $5 shipping). If anyone knows anything about this, please let me know. Thanks so much.

Oh, and in regards to the Italian Consulate in Boston, well it is best to call them, get their name and if need be, go in there for the info that you need- they are not always so willing to share the info over the phone- why, I have no idea.
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Gregorio



Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought about having one of those places get the documents from Italy for me, but the price is too outrageous. I sent a letter to the comune in Italy and for 5 euros, including postage, I was able to obtain my Great Grandfather's birth certificate. If you know when and where your ancestor was born I would just send the letter with a five euro note yourself. I actually sent 20 euros because I didn't know the cost and they sent me fifteen euros change. I couldn't believe it.

Regarding the naturalization papers, you either need to get a copy from your state's archives or a copy from the INS. From the INS you need to fill out a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) form- Form # G-369. You can find it on the INS web site. Once you have it... fill it out and send it to the INS in your jurisdiction. It takes about 3 months or so to get it from the INS or a couple weeks from the state archives.

Again... this all depends on the requirements of your consulate and whether or not they will accept the copies from the INS or the state archives. From the sounds of it, the Boston consulate does not sound too accomodating.
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Gregorio



Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry... the FOIA form is actually # G-639. Dislexia gets me again.
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dea712



Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Boston MA

PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2005 10:39 pm    Post subject: Info on obtaining records for Italian Citizenship Reply with quote

Hi Gregorio,

Thanks for the info. Shockingly enough, the court archives actually e-mailed me yesterday and said that if I send them $3.00, they will send me a copy of my maternal great grandfather's naturalization paper.

I have some more questions for you....

Are you going through your maternal or paternal great-grandfather? Does it matter?

How did you know where to send the 5 Euro note to?

Where did you find out exactly which documents you need to submit for your application. I don't know if you have been to that website, but according to them, you need practically everyone's birth, death, marriage, divorce certificates from either Italy or the States. MA charges a ridiculous $33 per copy via snail mail, $47 if you send your request over the net. I just don't want to start sending all of these people all of this $ if I really don't need all of these documents, you know?

I just went to the Boston Consulate's website. They don't even make mention of trying to obtain citizenship through your great-grandfather.

They said that you have to pay a fee in cash only, but they don't say how much. Did the Chicago one charge you, and if so, how much?

I would really appreciate any help that you can give me on this. I am starting to go crazy trying to decipher what it is exactly that I need, you know?

Thanks again.
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Gregorio



Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 4:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey dea712... drop me an email when you get a chance with all of your specific questions and I will answer you. My email adress is greglundin@hotmail.com.

Ci parliamo presto.
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jvs_2003



Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 3:16 pm    Post subject: Boston Consulate Reply with quote

Hey all,

I'm also working on my dual citizenship with the Italian Consulate. I'm just a few months into the process and after hearing how long it's taking, am getting kind of discouraged!

RatAttax - When did you find out you needed this "approval" of the naturalization documents? I met with the Italian Consulate last week and he mentioned needing to see the original document, but nothing about any sort of "approval."
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Madrilenyo



Joined: 08 Apr 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Massachusetts

PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2005 3:30 am    Post subject: Italian Citizenship Reply with quote

Well, looks like a few like-minded ppl here Wink

I'm in Massachusetts, too, and just starting the process now. I'm about to send off a request to a comune for a birth certificate, but was interested in your successes (hopefully!)

Having lived six years in Spain, I am nervous about capricious bureaucratic decisions, i.e., one civil servant blocking all progress, for no apparent good reason... Neutral
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ameliagirl



Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All this is rather strange, I've been talking with the Italian Consulate here in Denver and they told me I only needed photo copies of the Italian documents like my Grandmother's birth cert. and her naturilization papers not the originals.

Do you know if you have to get Itailan translations of the american documents??

Also, Did you have to get Apostilles on all of your american docs or just the ones pertaining to the itialian side?

Grazie mille!
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jvs_2003



Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been working with the Boston consulate and I've needed originals of everything except the naturalization papers. And even with the naturalization paper, I need to show him the original when I turn in the photocopy.

You should ask the consulate if you have to get the translations done or if they will do it for you (it varies from consulate to consulate).

Either way, you only need apostilles and translations for the documents from the US that pertain to the Italian side.

Hope this helps!
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Madrilenyo



Joined: 08 Apr 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Massachusetts

PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2005 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jvs_2003 wrote:
I've been working with the Boston consulate and I've needed originals of everything except the naturalization papers. And even with the naturalization paper, I need to show him the original when I turn in the photocopy.

You should ask the consulate if you have to get the translations done or if they will do it for you (it varies from consulate to consulate).

Either way, you only need apostilles and translations for the documents from the US that pertain to the Italian side.

Hope this helps!


JVS - Thanks for the info - it does help! You mention "naturalization papers" - do you mean the certificate of naturalization? I need to get this, and I think I can only get it through an FOIA.

How has your experience been with the consulate?

Can you recommend a translator? Did the consulate refer you to one?

That is encouraging that I only need the Italian side documents translated.

Thanks for any info/perspective you can offer. Very Happy
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jvs_2003



Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2005 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
JVS - Thanks for the info - it does help! You mention "naturalization papers" - do you mean the certificate of naturalization? I need to get this, and I think I can only get it through an FOIA.


Yes, I mean certificate of naturalization. I was lucky enough to have my great grandfather's already, so I didn't have to go and get it. I'm not sure where you do get them from, but I'm sure you can find out from searching on the internet.

My experience with the consulate has been pretty good. You'll be dealing with the same guy, since there is only one person who does the citizenship requests. In fact, a few weeks ago my paperwork was accepted and he said it should be in Italy for approval as we speak. He was really nice about everything, except it can be hard to get him on the phone sometimes. Since I don't live that far from Boston I was able to go see him face to face (I had to make about 3 trips before all my papers were in order). I think going face to face is the best way because you get solid answers.

As for the translations, it actually ends up that the Boston consulate will do this for you, so you don't need to worry about it. The main things are getting all your papers and making sure that all the names are correct. The guy at the consulate can go over the documents with you and let you know if there are any corrections that need to be made. These corrections (and waiting on the Italian birth certificates) are what slowed down the process for me. If I were you, I would work on getting the certificate of naturalization too, since this will hold things up if you don't have it.

Buona fortuna!!
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Vince



Joined: 05 May 2003
Posts: 511
Location: U.S.

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to the consulate Web page, it doesn't look like I'm eligible for Italian citizenship. But after reading this thread, I wonder if I missed something.

Here's my situation: My grandfather arrived in the US when he was three. I don't know when he was naturalized, but I suspect it was before my father was born. My father was born in the US and never had Italian citizenship. I remember hearing that my uncle (my father's younger brother) was trying to get Italian citizenship, but I don't know if he did. I don't know if my great grandparents were ever naturalized.

Based on what I wrote, does it sound like I'd have a chance? I'm going to my grandparents' place this weekend and plan to uncover as much as I can while I'm there. My grandfather has Parkinson, so I'm not sure what he'll remember. Maybe my grandmother will know some details or can show me some documents.
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