Job Discussion Forums

[7734]

I've taught in Egypt, off and on for about fifteen years.

Some of the posts here are from disgruntled employees who were perhaps not prepared for the Egyptian cultural experience.

But I know others who are happy teaching here.

Unless you're hired from abroad, you won't get much money or respect here.

Most of these schools are good places for people fresh out of university, or foreigners who've married a wealthy Egyptian -- the wages are weak by western standards.

And yes there most certainly are discipline problems unimaginable to the western-educated teacher. These are rich kids are raised by the nouveau riche. The kids see no need to behave or take anyone seriously, since they will simply inherit the family business.

Essentially the schools take anyone who can pay, and then make sure they hold on to them by passing the kids with glowing report cards.

They do this by changing or over-looking wrong marks, giving easy exams and (sometimes) allowing kids to cheat.

You won't reform them, and they don't want to be reformed -- so just roll with the punches.

I've personally known teachers at the schools mentioned in the title, and the schools have a tremendous turn-over rate. This doesn't seem to bother the parents for some strange reason. Anyone knows a high turn-over rate is a sign of a serious internal problem.

New Horizon is supposed to be the best in its area. I know several teachers who were tossed out because the school is terrified of parents whom cannot possibly consider that their child is causing the problem.

You won't reform them, and they don't want to be reformed -- so just roll with the punches.

In all fairness, I've taught next to many foreign teachers who were not qualified. But if the school doesn't care, then why should I?

Chouiefat has unruly kids, but they pay a serious wage, so maybe you can overlook that.

But make sure you are prepared to work in a developing nation when coming here. There are shortages on books, and materials. The tedious and iditoic paperwork and buerocracy that has been crippling this country is embraced by locals, like a comfort blanket.

Give it a shot. There are advantages to coming to Egypt, but I will let you decide what those are for yourself.

[veiledsentiments]

That puts it all into a nutshell... Nice to have someone with direct experience in these types of schools come on and confirm my endless repetition of the need to go with the flow.

Welcome to the Board 7734

VS

[DesertStar]

Roll with the punches, go with the flow....ignore all if the pay is good, etc. The implied message of this baby thread (so far) is rather unfortunate. Whatever happened to teachers' ethics?

I'm familiar with the Egyptian system too well, I was lied to, ripped off by officials and bureaucrats amongst others; it's corrupt practically everywhere you go. Schools or systems that work are the exception.

You can't single-handedly reform a system (even if it's begging to be reformed). However, cheering for going with the flow as described above is equal to condoning it. At best, it's hypocritical. When one is stuck with a contract, made a trip across the globe- there may not be too many options but to go on and survive it somehow. To have an idea about it in advance, accept an offer, and play the game is another story.

Nice to have the cultural experience , better when coupled with decent pay , but is it really worth giving up your principles?

[veiledsentiments]

The facts are here and people can choose to go or not. But, they can't say that they weren't warned if they bothered to read around this board.

Most of the people that take the jobs that he is describing have neither the credentials nor the experience to be choosy. With luck, the experience will at least give them something for the CV and they can move on to something better...

If you have read this board, you would know that I personally advise people to avoid these jobs. But, for those who have to take them for various reasons, practical advice is more helpful than idealism or insulting their motivation.

VS

[DesertStar]

Sorry, I disagree: the leading post is a description of the situation in some schools in Egypt and an explicit recommendation on how to handle it. I keep on thinking about the (sometimes) very young newbies who come to this forum asking for advice.

[Ally951]

Hi all -

Just finished reading this thread, and here's my two cents. I have now been in Egypt for about two months. When I arrived at 2am at Cairo airport, no one was around to pick me up - as my employers said they would. (They washed over it saying it was a "missed communication"). I taxied to the school I'm at without an address, just the area. No one at the school was awake to take me in, so the security guard at the front eventually found me a room, but the bed broke when I sat on it - I kid you not. You can get the gist of what my first day here in Cairo was like, and what I was feeling then (as in what the hell was I thinking, coming here...)

Fast forward two months, and things are slowly getting better. Here's why: the school I'm at just hired another Canadian teacher/acting principle. She's a retired teacher from Ontario (same province as myself) and after receiving a reception not that much different from mine, she demanded that things be changed, provided, considered at the school. Of course, nothing happened as immediately as we would have liked, but slowly things are starting to progress. We've become close friends (she's like a mother to me) and of course, grumbled on and on about how to work with/deal with the school. We have fought together for the Internet that I now am using - that took two months to get.

Yes, I have been told that I should "roll with the punches" from Egyptians and non-Egyptians alike. I can see the reason for that, after observing the attitude, disposition and social interactions with Egyptians. There's alot of laughing, humor, poking fun, etc, etc. And part of this reason is that there is nothing else that can be done to change the circumstances (ie. our bus driver is consistently an hour late at the school - consistently). So we laugh. But one has to draw a line somewhere in order to see any progress. To just accept the status quo does make one an accessory (sp?) to the inertia that sometimes sets in, in Egyptian schools.

That's my two cents - after living here two months. It's been a struggle to say the least, but I think it's worthwhile.

[veiledsentiments]

Hi Ally,

Glad to hear that you have someone there to help things along. IMHO, the key is to choose the battles carefully and keep your expectations realistic.

Good luck to both of you...

VS

[7734]

I think VS condensed what I said the best.

Nothing I was talking about had to do with priciples, ethics or educational integrity.

I was trying to be helpful and realistic. Getting upset about something you cannot change is only going to damage you -- psychologically and physically.

Truth be told, if I want to live in a world of effeciency, politesse, honesty and cleanliness, then I should move back to where I came from.

Prinicples, ethics and educational integrity cannot be enforced on a society uwilling, unable or incapapble of adopting such.

Yes, it is completely frustrating here at times -- and more often than I'd like it to be -- but like the saying goes, "the tree that doesn't bend in the wind breaks."

Thanks for sharing, guys and gals.

[constant_sorrow]

Some people thrive on fighting to improve the system and getting the satisfaction from winning those principled battles here and there.

Others would rather roll with the punches the Egyptian way, shrugging and saying "ma`alesh".

Whatever works.

[Sekhmet]

I tend to agree with VS. I've been working in Egypt now for nearly 2 years, and I'm pretty lucky with my situation, in that my bosses actually listen to me. Being brutally honest (granted, from my own experience), school principles hire natvie speakers to improve their intake. This is not a blanket statement about all schools, and I am well aware that there are plenty of schools that really do care about what kind of education their stduents receive. Unfortunately, it's not all of them, and it seems like the "bad" ones are the only ones we ever hear about.
Like I say, I'm absolutely not complaining about my own situation - although I would appreciate a heater or two around the school - but I have spoken with a number of ex-pats who have had the same types of problems talked about by the OP.
Oh wow, and I just noticed how long ago this was originally posted! Sorry, mods.....