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DD Dragon and Dragon Recruiters
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pintobean



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2003 5:13 am    Post subject: Yeah but Reply with quote

yeah, but Id be getting a practically free place to live if I went through these guys...like 100US a month or something...i know in some places rent is cheap, sooo, i guess it doesnt matter, but in Taipei isnt rent really high???
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TaoyuanSteve



Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 1028
Location: Taoyuan

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2003 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Because I was burned by a recruiter, I feel the need to speak to this very old and constantly reincarnating topic. Recruiters are scum. They are not necessary. They get you nothing that you cannot get for yourself if you did your own job search. Everything the recruiter tells you is for the sole purpose of getting you sign with his clients. They will tell you anything you want to hear. I could go on...

Most people contemplating employment as an efl teacher here have security concerns. They are coming to a new place and they want assurances that there will be a job for them when they arrive. Who doesn't have these concerns? You're paying alot to relocate to a foreign country and you want some kind of assurance. A recruiter preys on this insecurity. Let me tell you, however, that they will likely cause you more headache than peace of mind. In reality you have no more security dealing with them than if you went solo. In fact you may have less. Contracts are often not worth the paper they're written on. Jobs you supposedly have nailed down and in writing can disappear upon your arrival. Salaries and available hours can suddenly be reduced, working conditions can be attrocious... the list goes on. Such problems have been encountered by myself, people I know and countless others. Think about it seriously. In your home country, would you take a job sight unseen, without so much as visiting the worksite, and based totally on the recommendation of someone you've never met? Most reasonable people wouldn't do this. Then why do this when coming to a foreign country where employment standards are nowhere near western standards?

So what can you do? Well, start by paying heed to the warnings. Those giving you these warnings are not grumpy old men, just people who've been there trying to save you alot of trouble. Listen to us and commit to nothing before coming here. Then, do some pre-departure job searching of your own. Major, and even smaller, cram schools and kindies all have web addresses. Often they have online application forms and methods of contacting them for jobs. Also, the English daily papers have web sites with their classsifieds sections on them. You can get more contacts by searching them. Negotiate directly. Set-up interviews before you leave. Finally, bite the bullet, save up enough money to support yourself for a while and come over here sans recruiter. You will encounter challenges and setbacks coming here. This seems unavoidable. You can however, avoid major nightmare scenarios by not falling for the snake oil salesmen of the efl industry. Best of luck!
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pintobean



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 8:36 pm    Post subject: Doesnt Matter Reply with quote

I got a sweet job offer at Chatteris in Hong Kong that will lead me to be a NETS art teacher!! So ill be doing what i went to school for, WOW, very cool. So TAIWAN is OUT of the question, yippee, it sounded SO shady anyways! Just sucks cause in Hong Kong i wont be able to practice my mandarin as much as in Taiwan...i dont even know if im going to take the job yet
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EOD



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 167
Location: Taiwan

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those NET jobs in Hong Kong are some of the most sought after in Asia. If you should decide not to take it, please give me a reference!
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pintobean



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 4:00 am    Post subject: Oh, well... Reply with quote

Why dont you try working for Chatteris?? They have great connections, at least thats what they said...you could apply to be a 04-05 Schools Coordinator and then do NET...im still not totally positive ill do NET but if i do take the job ill let you know how it works out, like i said, i wont be able to do the NET scheme for another year plus I only want to do it if I could teach art as well...ok...ill keep in touch, word!!
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pintobean



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 4:02 am    Post subject: oh DUH Reply with quote

www.chatteris.org.hk
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Okami



Joined: 25 Jan 2003
Posts: 121
Location: Sunny Sanxia

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually in Hong Kong, you'll probably get a lot of Mandarin practice if you try. When I went there several times, I was shocked how useful my bad mandarin was. They also have Mandarin lessons at the YMCA.

I had to use it for the hostel, taxis, and occasionally at stalls in the many markets.

CYA
Okami
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pintobean



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah, i agree, the same thing happened to me while i was there...but it gets old saying the same thing over and over: how much?, CityU, when are you open till? etc...
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Chairman Roberto



Joined: 04 Mar 2003
Posts: 150
Location: Taibei, Taiwan

PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2003 11:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanx for the great advice regarding recruiters...in the People's Republic, the situation is much the same...recruiters have the reputation of pond scum...

Having said that, let's return to the original point of this thread...is Dragon a good place to work? I've looked at their website, and it looks impressive enough, with foreigner testimonials and management. Of course, websites can be as reliable as travel brochures, so of course I'm taking it with a grain of salt. Still, this Dragon school is offering one of the best starting salaries that I've seen around, and they seem to have a very tight knit, comprehensive program. Do any of you know of anyone who has worked at this school? I couldn't find anything in the Journal section of this website...

Roberto
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stgeorge



Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2003 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well dragon is not "this school" but a recruitment agency. i have heard that they are complete scum who beak all their promises. whether that is true or not i don't know but it's enough for me that these people ILLEGALLY take money from the salary that the school pays you. they are a criminal organisation.
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pintobean



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2003 3:56 pm    Post subject: yeah Reply with quote

thats why I am not even going there OR even going to Taiwan.
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EOD



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 167
Location: Taiwan

PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2003 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taiwan is not as bad as it sounds. It can be difficult for the uninitiated but once a person adapts it can be an overall pleasant experience or at least not boring. Yes there are better places to teach and work and if I did not have a family here, I would not be here. That doesnít mean it canít work for you. A few people do quite well here however the vast majority of those have a family conection to this place.
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killian



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 936
Location: fairmont city, illinois, USA

PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2003 4:05 pm    Post subject: interesting phrase-ology there Reply with quote

so, the vast majority of the few who do well here have a family connection to the place. don't see how this can be refuted.

sorry about that. it has been trying time of late.
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EOD



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 167
Location: Taiwan

PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2003 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry Killian, was I being too vague. What I was trying to say is that it helps to have a little guanxi. Most non-Chinese in Taiwan do not have the necessary guanxi required to succeed.
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bigjobs



Joined: 01 Apr 2003
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 5:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hey eod,

my girlfriend is taiwanese, and basically, for us to be together, i will need to live in taichung. she has little freedom from her parents, so moving overseas is out of the question. i understand you have a similar situation, in that you are here through family, so can i ask you, can these kind of things work?

i'm actually in taiwan now, and will go home now, and there's a bit of a culture shock. i've been around china, so it's not as though i wasn't totally unprepared. coming from australia, i think the lack of space here is a little difficult to adjust to. but the people are definitely nice, and that's absolutely a positive. i came here expecting taiwan to be fairly modern, but in a lot of respects, it feels like china, in terms of the day-to-day lifestyle.

but, if you have guanxi, both chinese and non-chinese, is living here for a long time not as hard as people make it out to be? like you said, there might be better jobs in other places, but i think if you can live relatively comfortably, have both guanxi and friends, living in taiwan can work. i was talking to one expat, and he seemed to say that after a while, you do miss your home country, wherever it might be, and you do think about going home. so basically, i don't want to make a commitment (ie. marriage) and then say 'sorry, i can't do this'.

is there any opportunity for career advancement in taiwan? i'm actually serious about what i do, so although teaching in taiwan allows us to be together, it's something i wanted to do anyway. so, assuming you don't turn up to work drunk, take your job seriously, put the effort in, do more study, can you make a reasonable life in taiwan? wherever i live, i don't want to be stuck in a mindless job, banging my head against a wall.

thanks!
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