Job Discussion Forums

senor boogie woogie

Hola!

In technical terms, the wealthiest man in the world, Bill Gates cannot becaome an ESL teacher. Why? He has no college degree. He is a college drop out. Korea and Japan would not allow him employment.

The Senor can. I graduated. So, I can get a job teaching in the Far East and maybe the Middle east with no other qualification.

Who is smarter of us two? Who could do the job better? Sorry Senor(me), I vote Bill, how about you?

Bill dropped out of Harvard, the best college in the USA and probably the world (my apologies to Yaleies). I graduated from a second tier state University with a liberal arts degree with grades which would stink up Yankee stadium. I can, Bill cannot. So is a parchment a reliable guidepost to employment after all?

So, the question is, what makes an excellent ESL teacher? A TEFL, TESL, CELTA, DELTA degree? Someone with imagination with no direction? How does a creative soul become profitable in this business? I do not believe ESL is a dead end, the career is for those people who are truly interested in living in a far off land. A free spirit so to speak.

So, how does one cut it in this field? A forum for debate no doubt.

SENOR

shenyanggerry · Joined: 02 Nov 2003 Posts: 619 Location: Canada

With all due respect, Bill Gates is a computer geek. He would probably make a lousy teacher.

I agree that a piece of paper does not a teacher make. My mother never did finish her degree. I still hear comments from former students on what a wonderful teacher she was - and she's been dead for thirteen years.

Glenski · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

senor,

You are asking 2 separate questions here.

1. Who is legally employable in the eyes of Japanese immigration?
2. What makes a good ESL/EFL teacher? (Who would make a better teacher, someone with or without a degree/lots of money?)

apples and oranges

thelmadatter · Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2003 9:12 pm Post subject: Japanese Immigration?

Why does Japanese immigration sound like an oxymoron to me? lol

denise · Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Posts: 3419 Location: finally home-ish

Senor--

Interesting topic! (And, might I add, approached with a good deal of tact--the "qualifications" debate can get pretty mean-spirited.)

The way that you have presented the scenario--you vs. Mr. Gates--you seem to be presenting polar opposites, extreme cases. Let's assume that Mr. Gates has a true affinity for teaching, great people skills, an understanding of foreign languages, etc., but just lacks those crucial bits of paper that says he studied those things at an accredited institution. And let's say you... or rather, our other candidate... (I don't want to imply anything about you!) has every qualification imaginable--BA in Education, TEFL, DELTA, MA. PhD, MBA, etc., etc., has published countless articles and books and given numerous presentations, and frankly just sucks in the classroom. Has no empathy, is dull, doesn't care, etc.

In such a case, immigration laws aside, I'd choose the first candidate every time. In reality, though, I'd say the majority of the teachers out there fall somewhere in the middle. Unless the candidate were simply "a natural," whatever that means, or had some other life experiences to replace a formal education, I would hesitate to hire someone without at least a BA and a TEFL certificate, as those things would at the very least indicate a) a familiarity with educational settings and b) some attempt on the candidate's part to "follow the rules."

On the other hand, I would also hesitate to hire someone with qualifications up the wazoo unless he/she could convince me of his/her passion for and dedication to teaching.

So, after a long-winded ramble of a reply, I have to take the "easy" way out of the debate and say that a balance of qualifications and "skills" is ideal.

d

Mosley · Joined: 17 Jan 2003 Posts: 158

Here are a few dolts that never had a university degree: Thomas Edison, Henry Ford, Albert Einstein, Abraham Lincoln, Harry S. Truman, Winston Churchill...there are many others....

Deborann · Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2003 7:43 am Post subject: Bill Gates is a nerd

Bill Gates couldn't become an ESL or any other teacher because he didn't have the social skills to complete his degree. He had plenty of creative, analytical and nerd type skills, but he had and possibly still has, zero social skills to be able to figure out what is required in writing for, presenting for and putting in the 'people' practical stuff for a degree in any 'people' area.

Teaching is primarily an area that requires huge people skills. Content stuff is secondary importance - useful, but unless you have the ability to understand the way people learn, their motivations and foibles, then no matter how well versed you are in your content area, you can't teach.

PS - what's this stuff about Yale? UQ is where the real academics sit! Laughing

Jen2003 · Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2003 9:55 am Post subject:

I agree with Senor Boogie Woogie that there are a lot of second rate schools in the U.S.A. TEFL would be a better industry is there weren't so many second rate American teachers out there with low grade B.A.s getting them their visas.

But Bill Gates would be a poor EFL teacher.

So I guess Senor actually proves his own point is in error: the system does work!

Jen

senor boogie woogie · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2003 1:41 am Post subject: Not just Japan, anywhere.

I am not just mentioning Japan, anywhere, China, Korea or the Middle East. Gates could not legally get a job teaching at a Wonderland in Korea. I think that if my mother was a younger person, she would of made an excellent teacher, but she only has a high school diploma.

So, what makes a good instructor?

senor boogie woogie · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2003 1:44 am Post subject: Not just Japan, anywhere.

I am not just mentioning Japan, anywhere, China, Korea or the Middle East. Gates could not legally get a job teaching at a Wonderland in Korea. I think that if my mother was a younger person, she would of made an excellent teacher, but she only has a high school diploma.

So, what makes a good instructor?

SENOR

senor boogie woogie · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2003 1:47 am Post subject: Not just Japan, anywhere.

I am not just mentioning Japan, anywhere, China, Korea or the Middle East. Gates could not legally get a job teaching at a Wonderland in Korea. I think that if my mother was a younger person, she would of made an excellent teacher, but she only has a high school diploma.

So, what makes a good instructor?

SENOR

FGT · Joined: 14 Sep 2003 Posts: 762 Location: Turkey

Someone who knows the difference between "would of" and "would have" for a start, might be able to teach English!

senor boogie woogie · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2003 1:55 am Post subject: Not just Japan, anywhere.

I am not just mentioning Japan, anywhere, China, Korea or the Middle East. Gates could not legally get a job teaching at a Wonderland in Korea. I think that if my mother was a younger person, she would of made an excellent teacher, but she only has a high school diploma.

So, what makes a good instructor?

SENOR

FGT · Joined: 14 Sep 2003 Posts: 762 Location: Turkey

Is this a record? Same post posted four times? Obviously English language teaching ability has nothing to do with other skills!

Jen2003 · Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2003 3:07 am Post subject:

Senor BW,

I wish EFL teaching had MORE hurldles for people to get in. Employers often just look for short term cheap labour.

THat's why there are professional associations. Professionals (rather than employers) ensure the quality of their industry.

Imagine if a Korean hagwon owner had total power over an airline or medical clinic Shocked