Job Discussion Forums

[Cleopatra]

I heard a rumour (admittedly third-hand!), according to which someone said that many of the colleges/unis in the UAE allow male teachers to teach female students, but not vice-versa - ie, women are not allowed to teach men.

If this is true, I must say I find it a tad odd. I would have thought that if anything it would be the other way round:you know, the importance of preserving the modesty and dignity of local women?

Anyone care to deny/confirm/discuss?

[veiledsentiments]

Hi Cleo,

Not true, there are women teaching men at HCT and MLI. Originally MLI was men only, but that changed a couple of years ago. There have always been women teaching at the HCT men's colleges.

Can anyone answer for UAEU?

VS

[hmbaba]

Hello,
Confirm - at MLI men teach women and women teach men.
At UAEU men teach women, women do not generally teach men - certainly not in the regular program on the Men's Campus, but in ESP Dept. think that women teach men sometimes.
Think that ages ago it was mainly married men who were put on the Women's Campus, but that's not the case in recent years.
WHY? Not sure that there is a logical explanation - Men's Campus is a male enclave, the admin HQ - it could also be a discipline issue - often at UAEU the bottom line is 'we teach Shariah Law' which sort of reflects on other things... Could be practical - there are no women's offices and only one women's bathroom...
As to why men can teach women - well, maybe there are more male teachers available with the appropriate qualifications faculty wide - getting women teachers may be a problem too - taking responsibility for single female teachers could be an issue -
UAEU is more trad than other places and Al Ain is more conservative - and that's the way it is. Not sure that any female teachers would want to teach men there.
Good news is that UAEU is female-friendly, family-friendly and 'single-parent'-friendly.
Regards

[scot47]

I have visited Al Ain and other parts of the UAE and can vouch for the fact that it is easier for western women than Saudi Arabia.

California it isn't, but some of us might take comfort in that.

[Cleopatra]

Looks like the rumour is rubbish then - as so often is the case in this part of the world.

Above poster said men teach women at MLI - must say I was surprised. ARen't all the students at MLI male? Surely no "respectable" Emirati family would let their daughter risk her honour by studying/working in such an environment?

[veiledsentiments]

Hi Cleo

So much of what passes around as 'fact' about the Middle East is 'rubbish.' Mostly based on what is true only in Saudi. I have spent the last 18+ years fighting that fight. (no, I didn't have to wear a veil; yes, I could drive and always owned a car; no, it is not only not dangerous - it is safer than the US---)

As to MLI, yes, the students are all men - as education is mostly segregated in the UAE unless the name of the place is 'American University of X.'

My theory on why MLI started accepting women was problems that AMIDEAST was having with the US government EEOC (Equal Employment Opportunity Commission). It is illegal for any US organization to discriminate in hiring by sex (age, etc). Thus, they were unable to state in their ads that it was 'men only' and unable to inform any applicant that it was 'men only' and there were numerous female American applicants that caused problems for them. I suspect that they convinced the military to allow women in. (this was a regular topic of discussion on the old board here with women complaining about this---)

There may have also been problems in getting enough teachers? Just guessing here--- I wonder if now that AMIDEAST is out, the women will be phased out. Perhaps not as I see that they are advertising for 40 teachers for next year. ???

BTW, as to an Emirati woman working there, not terribly likely. So far not much is heard or seen of Emirati women moving into teaching. It seems that Saudi is pushing that more than the Emirates so far. But I would expect that any that are teaching are in places like ZU or HCT/UAEU women's branches.

VS

[hmbaba]

Hi
VS - you got it wrong this time - MLI has female students in the evenings - however, they attend on different evenings from the men.
MLI also has Emirati lady officers and female clerks in the admin.
MLI also raised its age limit for male applicants at the same time it started hiring women - they also used to hire Americans only... who knows - maybe they were having trouble finding people so widened their nets? Maybe the female students wanted female teachers? If the UAE military has female soldiers, then surely it follows on that there should be females in other roles, too?
What's this about 'problems with women applicants'? Saudi employers seem to be able to advertise for males only. As for phasing women out - we'll see - MLI has many branches now and outreach centers and these places don't seem to be prepared to take female teachers (as I understand it) - so they may need to hire more men to staff those places.
Hope that sets the record straight a bit.

[veiledsentiments]

Hi Heather,

Ah-Ha, that explains a rumor I heard that all the women teachers had been assigned to teach in the evenings. I knew that one of the military schools that MLI hired for was a women's academy. But, if I read your message correctly, they don't have any integrated classes (men and women students together). Was I right that women are still able to teach the male students at the main branch?

Yes, AMIDEAST did get a great deal of heat in the US for their 'men only' policy. If I was a betting woman I would put money on their having to fight a number of lawsuits about it - and even though they would win because they were hiring for a foreign government, legal fees are still horrendously expensive in this country.

The Saudi employers can't be affected as they are foreign companies and US law can't hurt them. But, in a US newspaper, you will not see an advertisement for a Saudi job that says only men may apply. It will mention that the students are all male and hope that any applicants know enough about it to realize that it is male teachers only - and not waste their time applying. But, AMIDEAST is an American organization and thus is required to follow American law - which says that you can't discriminate by sex.

Thanks for the added information---

VS

[hmbaba]

Confirm: No integrated classes at MLI (nor HCT, UAEU, ZU..)
Confirm: men teach women, women teach men at the main site.
At KAC (now MLI-run) teachers are male and female.
The policy of reverse seniority is in effect, so people are requested first to volunteer for assignments and if there aren't enough volunteers, it goes by 'last in'. As I said earlier, for whatever reason, women can't be placed in the outreach and off site locations, but they can be put on the evening shift - so to sort of even things up, lady teachers were first in line for the evening shift. As we get new teachers, presumably people will be able to swap around - we'll see.
Even foreign employers have to interview people they could never hire due to the policies of equal opportunities etc in the States - I'm not spelling it out - but am sure you can figure out the groups of people who would be affected.
Regards.

[scot47]

When hiring in the USA, a certain large organisation based in Saudi used to interview males and females - even though they never hired females. This was so they did not make waves in the "Land of Equal Opportunities".

I am pleased to say that I no longer work for that organisation !

[JCMach1]

coed...

[Bindair Dundat]

[Cleopatra]

So, did she get sent on her way, complete with her boob tube?