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teaching qualifications required

 
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Dean T



Joined: 13 Feb 2003
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:04 am    Post subject: teaching qualifications required Reply with quote

Besides my degree in Business, what other Qualifications or certificates must i have to be allowed to teach english in Spain.

Would a TEFL be sufficient or would the CELTA course be what i require?

Or is it accepted that i can be employed on the basis of being a native english speaker that holds a degree?
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naturegirl321



Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 8977
Location: home sweet home

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Usually, to get legal work, you need an EU passport, that being said. Spain, along with Greece and Italy are pretty tranquilo about those laws. You can find illegal work, just don't expect it to pay well.
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gsbcn08080



Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 73

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2004 5:46 pm    Post subject: Experience is important Reply with quote

Most of the ads I've seen around looking for teachers mention "experience". I think employers would not take you just because you have a degree since having a degree in Business does not mean you know anything about teaching English and what they actually want you to do is teach English. I think they may value more a TEFL certificate than a degree since the government in Spain does not require you to have one if you teach in a private school. About getting badly paid all the Americans I met got paid the same as the European ones, some more others a bit less but there wasnt much difference. I would also like to mention that when you say teachers get badly paid you must be comparing the salary with salaries in other countries because teachers in Spain get better paid than most Spanish people. I have Spanish friends and their salaries are not better than mine. Spain has the lowest salaries in the EU, this was mentioned today on TV.
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BCNorBust



Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2004 4:18 pm    Post subject: What exactly is good or bad pay? Let's talk numbers... Reply with quote

I've read on various postings that TESOL/TEFL teachers who are American and working as English teachers in Spain are poorly paid. But I've also read that they are paid enough to get by. Forgive me for speaking so bluntly, but WHAT exactly is poor pay or good pay? I live and work in New York City and am planning to move to Spain at the end of the year to get my TEFL certificate and look for jobs teaching English. I'm willing to give up A) a good job B) a great apartment C) the security of knowing what I'll be making each month, but I can't do this without knowing I won't be broke and underpaid and forced to return to the US 3 months after moving to Spain.

Considering I work an average of 15-20 hours per week, making 15 euros/hour, that equals 225-300 Euros/week, or 900-1200 Euros/month. Is this an average estimate? Is it overestimating? Underestimating? I realize living in a major city like BCN or Madrid costs more, but it's hard to gain a black and white, realistic estimate of how much I'd be earning/spending monthly with words like "good pay" and "poor pay".

Can someone give me some insight? I won't make a move abroad without having a decent idea of if I can swing living expenses without having to teach 40 hours/week...

Thanks! Smile
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Mouse



Joined: 24 Dec 2003
Posts: 208

PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2004 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Answering the OP, first, it is always possible that you might get work even without a degree or a teaching qualification, but whether it would be at the rate you're looking for, or even whether you'd keep the job if you couldn't perform in the classroom, is another question. Depending on where you're hoping to live, of course, competition is currently quite fierce, and every extra feather you can put in your cap goes a long way.

Regarding what can be considered an average wage in Spain, my first piece of advice would be that you can get an idea by looking at advertisements, and that the kind of money you can bring in is dependent on the kind of experience and qualifications, etc, that you can bring to bear on an employer. However, BCNorBust, I presume that you were hoping for something a little bit more "real" than that. From what little I know (and my experience is only in Catalonia), your estimate "15-20 hours per week, making 15 euros/hour, that equals 225-300 Euros/week, or 900-1200 Euros/month" is rather high on the money count and rather low on the hours. It would be far more likely, I would offer, that you'd end up working from 25-30 hours (including travelling, if your school offers classes "in company" as many do), bringing in something around 1000 Euros a month (but often less), which is usually before tax (but not always). I've heard of jobs advertising a few hundred more a month, but generally when they've been looking for experienced (four or five years plus), and preferably DELTA-qualified, teachers.

Of course, this information is completely anecdotal, and you may well find your experience to be different. Very Happy Hope that it's a bit of help, though.
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BCNorBust



Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2004 5:23 pm    Post subject: What exactly is good or bad pay? Reply with quote

Mouse-

Thanks for the advice. I realize it's impossible to estimate how much money I'll be making months from now when I'm in a totally different atmosphere. I appreciate you shedding some light on the subject. You say that you can expect around 1000 euros/month (or less) for teaching 25-30 hours a week -- is that enough to pay rent/gastos/food? I lived in BCN a few years ago and that amount of money would be plenty, but I'm not sure how much things have changed since then.

A few people have also mentioned picking up extra hours doing private lessons - I am very willing to do that to make some extra cash as well. How's the job market in BCN/Catalunya compared to Madrid? Any ideas?

Thanks
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brighton74



Joined: 05 Feb 2004
Posts: 6
Location: Madrid

PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:12 am    Post subject: Re: What exactly is good or bad pay? Let's talk numbers... Reply with quote

BCNorBust wrote:
Forgive me for speaking so bluntly, but WHAT exactly is poor pay or good pay? Considering I work an average of 15-20 hours per week, making 15 euros/hour, that equals 225-300 Euros/week, or 900-1200 Euros/month. Is this an average estimate? Is it overestimating? Underestimating?


I'd say overestimating. 15 euro/hour? Academies in Madrid don't pay that.

Linguarama used to pay 15 euro/hour to freelance teachers. You pay for your own taxes (income tax and Social Security). But, being an American, I doubt you'd have to pay tax because you'd be illegal and I'm not sure a lot of academies could employ you legally.

Academies usually require EU citizenship. Hiring Americans requires a lot of paperwork and you'd have to go back to the US once you had an offer in Spain. It's fair, it's just as difficult for Europeans to get permits to work in the US.

A good academy would pay 1000 + euro a month for 21 hours a week. It's the salary teachers are entitled to according to the "convenio" (agreement between the Unions and employers). Schools generally pay better than academies, but rarely hire people without a teaching qualification (PGCE or "CAP" as it's known here).

If you found your own private lessons, say, flyposting and advetising in "Segundamano", you could charge 15 euro and above. Some people charge 20 an hour. But, beware, the students cancel a lot of classes and you'll find that your income drops dramatically at Christmas, in summer and anytime there's a bank holiday.


Last edited by brighton74 on Wed Feb 11, 2004 10:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Mouse



Joined: 24 Dec 2003
Posts: 208

PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2004 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, BCNorBust, I don't think by any stretch of the imagination we're talking about a lot of money here, but depending on your wants and needs, the quantities being bandied around can be ample. If you share housing, for example, or do private classes (of which a market always exists), then you will certainly pay rent and food, etc. Whether it will keep you in the manner to which you've grown accustomed or not, is less certain... For example, I live in a town just outside BCN, in my own flat, eat pretty much whatever I please and go out more than often enough for me, and at present I'm saving a couple of hundred Euros a month. Obviously, in the city itself, that would be a different kettle of fish... I've heard that the competition in Catalunya is currently fierce for jobs, but actually, I couldn't say that for certain. Where are you thinking of going? You have any contacts?
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brighton74



Joined: 05 Feb 2004
Posts: 6
Location: Madrid

PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2004 12:02 pm    Post subject: Small town / provincial capital = calidad de vida Reply with quote

I agree that small towns are better places to live. Some friends on my CELTA course settled in Málaga and had a better standard of living than I do, for half the money.

They said they earned 600 - 800 euros a month (a pittance in Madrid), but everything was much cheaper. There's plenty of demand for English and less native speakers around. Private classes in Málaga are charged at 10 euro. Food is cheaper, housing is cheaper (150 - 200 euro).

In Madrid you'll have a hard time finding a room to rent for less than 300 euro. Prices are going up every year.

You can still get a three-course meal for 6-7 euro. In the government building where I teach and in most University cafeterias, a meal is a lot cheaper, 4 euro.

Going out is expensive. I generally spend 20 - 40 euro per night out. A drink can cost 10 euro or more. A club will charge anything between 10 - 15 euro for entry + a drink. If I get a taxi home, it's another 10 euro at least.

Clothes are cheaper than in other countries. Check out Spanish shoes, they're really good quality and quite affordable. There are lots of big chains with well-priced clothes (Zara, Springfield, Pull and Bear, Often...)

I don't know anyone who saves significant amounts money in Madrid or sends money back home... You probably could if you tried very hard and worked all day. The bad thing about teaching (especially adults) is that your schedule is so disperse... Most people in companies want lessons early in the morning, at lunchtime or late in the afternoon. Private students prefer classes after 6 pm. Some people will even ask you to teach them at 9 pm... And, if you've had an early start, that can prove quite exhausting.
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BCNorBust



Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Thu Feb 12, 2004 2:24 am    Post subject: bcn, madrid, malaga y mas! Reply with quote

hmm, to answer some questions, I initially wanted to go to bcn b/c i lived there for a year during college. i know the city very well and would feel most comfortable there (besides loving the culture, arts, history, people, etc.) But many people I've talked to have mentioned Madrid having many more opportunities (esp. for Americans) than Barna, so I will probably end up in Madrid. Not my first choice, but I need to play the safest hand and would like to minimize the risk of not finding work as much as possible.

While I know living/working in smaller cities (malaga, sevilla, valencia, san sebastian) means spending less money, I would still like to be in a big city. Plus, many people have all but raved about EBC in madrid (again, esp. Americans), so I'm thinking that is my best bet. Because of circumstances beyond my control, I can't go until November. While I realize December/January isn't the most prime time to job-hunt, it's the best I can do.

To address another question, I realize my standard of living on a teacher's salary won't be anything like working full time in publishing in NYC. I'm fine with sharing a flat with others, and am used to cooking at home and limiting my social outings to save $$. But it's something I'm willing to suspend for a few years in trade for moving abroad and completing a long-term goal I set for myself a few years ago.

Anyway, thanks all for listening to me rant and rave. Smile I truly appreciate everyone's comments - any others (be it positive or negative) are welcome.
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gsbcn08080



Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 73

PostPosted: Fri Feb 13, 2004 5:22 pm    Post subject: jobs in Spain Reply with quote

Look in " international jobs" that should give you an idea maybe. There is one about teaching in Cuenca I think.
You won't find many or any about teaching in Madrid or Barcelona because there's many teachers around and they don't need to pay for ads.
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naturegirl321



Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 8977
Location: home sweet home

PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2004 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ONe thing about small towns is though you may make less, things are cheaper.
And don't forget there are always private students!
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