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Who has worked in Both Cambodia & Vietnam? Compare for m

 
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thegoodprofessor



Joined: 03 Sep 2009
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:17 am    Post subject: Who has worked in Both Cambodia & Vietnam? Compare for m Reply with quote

I'm trying to decide on one of these two countries. Here are a few things that are important to me.

1. I can bring my small dog with me and feel he is safe.(he's a traveler already)

2. Good Salary for someone with MA/ 10 yrs international exp.

3. Decent and low cost living situation (so as to be able to save)

4 Nice working staff.


I'm sure there is more but these four things are what feel most important to me.
Feel free to pm me anytime
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anubistaima



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 110
Location: Thailand

PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, dog meat is popular in both Cambodia and Vietnam. I never lived in Cambodia (only traveled there) but lived in Vietnam with two dogs for a year and a half. Actually, arrived with one dog and bought the second one at a meat market in Sapa. That should give you an idea of what to expect.

They made it out fine (we're now in Thailand) but I was extremely careful. Dog theft is common in Vietnam and stray dogs are aggressive, so you need to be careful when walking your dog. Leaving him unattended, even for a few minutes, is a big no-no. I don't know about HCM but there's only one vet in Hanoi. She's Danish and excellent, but the facilities are extremely limited. One of my dogs needed an x-ray once and we actually paid a local (human) clinic to let us come in through the back door and have the x-rays taken in total secrecy.

I know others will disagree with me, but I think Vietnam is expensive. USD500 in Thailand gets me a villa with a private pool. In Hanoi, you won't find the same thing for under USD1200. Cheapest house I ever saw (never lived in apartments because dogs are big) was $350 and it looked from the past century (not in a charming way)

Can't help with the ESL thing, as I wasn't there teaching.
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deessell2



Joined: 11 Jun 2005
Posts: 132
Location: Under the sun

PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 5:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Who has worked in Both Cambodia & Vietnam? Compare f Reply with quote

thegoodprofessor wrote:
I'm trying to decide on one of these two countries. Here are a few things that are important to me.

1. I can bring my small dog with me and feel he is safe.(he's a traveler already)

2. Good Salary for someone with MA/ 10 yrs international exp.

3. Decent and low cost living situation (so as to be able to save)

4 Nice working staff.


I'm sure there is more but these four things are what feel most important to me.
Feel free to pm me anytime


I have lived in both countries. There is more money to be made as a teacher in VN however, life is MUCH harsher there. The traffic is dangerous and the air pollution is literally sickening. The longer I lived there, the less I liked being RIPPED OFF.

Cambodia is not cheap but is much more chilled out. In my opinion Cambodia is more developed than Vietnam, more civilised even, certainly a lot easier to live in as a foreigner. There is not a lot of money for teachers but money isn't everything, is it?

For the record, Cambodians only eat dog in Vietnamese restaurants.
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anubistaima



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 110
Location: Thailand

PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me second deessell2's post about Vietnam not being a civilized place. It's not. And it's so exhausting to deal with overpricing on EVERYTHING just because you're a foreigner.
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MrMrLuckyKhan



Joined: 08 Feb 2008
Posts: 282
Location: Kingdom of Cambodia

PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CAMBODIA is more developed than VIETNAM?!?!?! I'm not sure of your definition of 'developed' but Cambodia has only ONE building with 34 stories, and has only recently opened up more than ONE kfc. I would agree the vibe is much better here (Cambodia) than in Vietnam for foreigners, but to say Cambodia is more developed than Vietnam, I can't even imagine what someone could possibly mean by that....
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anubistaima



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 110
Location: Thailand

PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 4:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I assumed you're talking to deessell2? I'm not sure I would call Cambodia more developed, but it's definitively more civilized.
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deessell2



Joined: 11 Jun 2005
Posts: 132
Location: Under the sun

PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrMrLuckyKhan wrote:
CAMBODIA is more developed than VIETNAM?!?!?! I'm not sure of your definition of 'developed' but Cambodia has only ONE building with 34 stories, and has only recently opened up more than ONE kfc. I would agree the vibe is much better here (Cambodia) than in Vietnam for foreigners, but to say Cambodia is more developed than Vietnam, I can't even imagine what someone could possibly mean by that....


In my opinion Phnom Penh is more developed than Hanoi and I should have clarified that. For me developed doesn't always have to equal high buildings. For me it's being able to shop at real supermarkets. It's being able to walk along a footpath. It's seeing many women driving cars. It's cars driving sensibly and following the road rules, for the most part. It's being able to transfer money easily. It's getting my new things delivered on four wheels rather than a xe om. Maybe developed is the wrong choice of word, maybe westernized is better?

Hanoi does have it's charm for the short term but the longer I stayed, the more energy it took just to accomplish everyday tasks. It wore me down.
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sigmoid



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 1006

PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have to agree with Mr. Lucky in that Cambodia is NOT more developed than Viet Nam. People here are talking about a few select parts of Phnom Penh.

Actually, it's kind of a moot point as NEITHER country or city [Phnom Penh vs. Ho Chi Minh City/Ha Noi] is really that developed or westernized.

Phnom Penh just has fewer people, so there is more space, less traffic congestion and less population density. So, yeah, it feels a little more 'laidback', a little more 'open'.

In terms of your items 2 & 3 on your list:

Salaries and rates of pay for teachers are much lower in Phnom Penh while the cost of living is only slightly lower, mainly for rent. Shocked

The food situation in Viet Nam is bad, but somehow it's worse in Cambodia: bland and overpriced food. It's a good place if you need to lose weight. Laughing

VN has FREE wifi available nearly everywhere. Most places in Cambodia do not have any kind of internet connection. Crying or Very sad

I'm not sure if the conditions at schools [classrooms/staff rooms/bathrooms, etc.] are worse in VN or Cambodia. Both are generally pretty bad. Mad

You should probably consider somewhere else. Smile
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Camvieindlib



Joined: 11 Nov 2010
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 6:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I couldn't comment on which country is more suitable for a dog or dog owner, but having taught in both countries I'd like to share my opinions:

OK, to start with I taught in Phnom Penh, Cambodia and Hai-Phong, Vietnam.

If you want to save money and money is your main motivation for going to either country then I would have to say that Vietnam is the better choice. You'll make more money and the cost of living can be a lot cheaper, especially if your school/university provides accommodation.

If you want to form friendships with colleagues, again from my experiences, I'd have to say that Vietnam would be the first choice. I found that the staffroom in Vietnam to be more integrated and the western/local staff often mixed socially far more often than Cambodia.

If you want to have complete personal freedom, I'd choose Cambodia. There are no restrictions (other than how much cash you have in your bank account) regarding things like renting apartments, transportation, travel, entertainment. ....In Vietnam there is a lot of bureaucracy and it can feel like the authorities are keeping track of you at all times.

If you are an American citizen, you might feel more comfortable in Cambodia than in Vietnam - I do know that Americans are not well received in all parts of the country, especially by the older people.
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Sudz



Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 289

PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry but "the food situation in Viet Nam is bad"? I've heard this from more than one person, and I'd like someone to explain this.

After living here for some time, I seriously am baffled by claims such as this. Where did you live in VN?
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sigmoid



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 1006

PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Sorry but "the food situation in Viet Nam is bad"? I've heard this from more than one person, and I'd like someone to explain this.

After living here for some time, I seriously am baffled by claims such as this. Where did you live in VN?


Well, it's mostly subjective, of course and others like yourself are welcome to have differing opinons. I lived mostly in HCMC, but also is Vung Tau and Ha Noi.

From my perspective, after living for years in Thailand, Vietnamese did not compare favorably. Certainly it's not all 'bad', but in general the taste is bland or greasy, the ingredients are of poor quality and overall it's not very filling.

Also, many restaurants are not very sanitary or attractive with people smoking in the kitchen, annoying waiters with their fingers up their noses, uncomfortable seating, general lack of cleanliness, etc.

I'm curious to know what you found to be good about VNese food. What's your take on the situation?
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Sudz



Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 289

PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fair enough that you're not a big fan of Vietnamese food. When you mentioned 'the food situation', I thought you were referring to every type of food within the city (including international restaurants).

Yeah it's very subjective, BUT I'd personally rank Vietnamese food up there with Thai food - though the two are very different. Big fan of most of the soup dishes, except for perhaps Bun Mam (not a fan of the shrimp paste....yuck!), Banh Xeo (quite unique), Bun Thit Nuong, most of the 'rap them and eat them' type dishes, along with a lot of others. Just as you might say that you find Vietnamese food bland, I might say that I find Thai food too sweet (not a huge fan of coconut milk). To see if from your side (as well as others), Vietnamese food is a little more SUBTLE that Thai food (hope I don't sound snobbish), and many would agree that it's a little bland in comparison. Though to be honest - despite being in Thailand many times - I stuck to curries perhaps a little too often, and as a result haven't had a ton of exposure to their cuisine; perhaps I'd agree with you after living there. I definitely like Vietnamese food more now after many years of living here, and have really only become a big fan after sampling a lot of different dishes over the years. My palette has definitely changed.

Looking at it from an aesthetic point of view, yeah Vietnam isn't up there with Thailand yet in terms of customer service, though over the years I've found some very nice, clean restaurants (well....I THINK clean. I haven't been sick here in some time). Just got back from a nice courtyard restaurant on Le Quy Don street. Great food and unimposing waiters (though the motorbike parker did try to blatantly overcharge me.....a different topic altogether!)

I'm a little on the fence with fish sauce (fairly popular in Thailand too I believe). I do like it in small doses, but I find it to be overused, and sometimes overpowering. Again it's subjective. Also, some of the higher-end Vietnamese restaurants tend to use a lot of lemon grass, which I'm also not a fan of.

Anyways I don't want to deconstruct this too much, as I don't really consider myself a cuisine expert. I just like what I like Smile
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tefl peasant



Joined: 09 Oct 2010
Posts: 131

PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2010 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saigon more developed (but this does not mean better, for everyone).

Phnom Penh is less developed, has a more relaxed life, but lower wages.

I used to go back and forth between both cities for a couple of years. Then it was OK, now it isn't (only speaking for myself).
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