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Europe-not a living wage to be found.
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sharter



Joined: 25 Jun 2008
Posts: 878
Location: All over the place

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:33 am    Post subject: Europe-not a living wage to be found. Reply with quote

EVERY single EFL teacher I know in Europe is flat broke. There is something not right about that. EFL is a holiday job not a career.
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tttompatz



Joined: 06 Mar 2010
Posts: 1951
Location: Talibon, Bohol, Philippines

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Europe-not a living wage to be found. Reply with quote

sharter wrote:
EVERY single EFL teacher I know in Europe is flat broke. There is something not right about that. EFL is a holiday job not a career.


Darned good thing you told me that. After years and years at ESL/EFL I would have never guessed that someone could not make a career out of it.

House on 5 hectares bought and paid for.
No debt of any kind.
Comfortable job in a decent place with nice weather
Savings on the order of 650 pounds per month AND a comfortable lifestyle.

Crying shame that this is only a temp, holiday job.

Maybe, if you are qualified, you should consider looking outside of the EU.

.
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11523
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I reckon that many EFL ers at the newbie level in Europe are living on tight finances. It's a hirer's job market, and has been for a long time.

However, most teachers who have dug into a region and put in the time and energy needed to get more quals, learn the local language, and make good local contacts do better.

I had a very decent package of wage and benefits, but it was at an international university, and it's true that those jobs are thin on the ground. And require significant qualifications, connections, and luck to find.
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denise



Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 3419
Location: finally home-ish

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is the norm, but I wonder if you know EFL teachers in a wide range of jobs--including those rare gems that spiral78 alluded to--or just entry-level language school teachers with entry-level qualifications. Europe is certainly not the place to go to save big bucks (and thanks to the EU it's also off-limits to folks like me with the wrong passport Sad ), but there are always exceptions... Very rare in the EU, though. And once you leave Europe, you can indeed make a proper career of this.

Now if you'll excuse me, I've got to go and finish packing for the holiday that I was easily able to pay for on my EFL salary, and that I have earned after a full semester of real work! Wink

d
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Enigma2011



Joined: 28 Dec 2010
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Europe-not a living wage to be found. Reply with quote

sharter wrote:
EVERY single EFL teacher I know in Europe is flat broke. There is something not right about that. EFL is a holiday job not a career.


Sounds like Mexico City. Of course there are ways one can make a living in Mexico City AND teach EFL.

Have a spouse who has a REAL job.
Have a spouse who has properties and uses them for rent
Use naive newbies to work for you.
Have a SS check or pension coming in from the U.S.

EFL alone....not good.

Many in Mexico who don't suck off of their wives or spouses are broke as well my friend. My advice would be to get back to your home country and find a real job,or do like the ones who SAY they are doing well.
Be a brownnoser, I mean a networker. Rolling Eyes
Or as they say in Mexico...have an ENGAGING PERSONALITY. Rolling Eyes
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denise



Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 3419
Location: finally home-ish

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Um, don't know if your comment was targeted at me, but I am doing well. And no, I am not a brownnoser. Rolling Eyes

Here's why I am doing well: I have an MA, 10ish years of experience, and I work in the Gulf. I am single, so no husband to mooch off of.

Seriously, people who *think* EFL sucks as a profession are going to have a rough time of it. Self-fulfilling prophecy... Change your attitude, get some qualifications, and work in countries that pay decent wages.

d
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Guy Courchesne



Joined: 10 Mar 2003
Posts: 9650
Location: Guadalajara

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We stopped feeding trolls in the Mexico forum so you'll have to excuse us as they wander out hungry.

Quote:
Seriously, people who *think* EFL sucks as a profession are going to have a rough time of it. Self-fulfilling prophecy... Change your attitude, get some qualifications, and work in countries that pay decent wages.


Best advice right there...the starting jobs are great if you're looking for a year abroad and some experience but one ultimately either chooses to get out or get on the career path in EFL. Upgrade the education for the latter, I think, goes without saying?
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TeresaLopez



Joined: 18 Apr 2010
Posts: 601
Location: Mexico City

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Europe-not a living wage to be found. Reply with quote

tttompatz wrote:

Darned good thing you told me that. After years and years at ESL/EFL I would have never guessed that someone could not make a career out of it.


Yeah, we are always getting the same thing in the Mexico forum, even though there are plenty of us that are doing just fine, as you are. I suspect they are people with few qualifications, and a big sense of entitlement, that think just because they speak English they can teach it. There seem to be more and more posts along those lines - where can I get a job making a lot of money even though I have not training or background, but, hey I speak English. I know 20 or 30 teachers well enough to know the condition of their finances, and they are all doing just fine, and some more than fine. The only ®teachers®that seem to have problems are the ones that post here.
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11523
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Um, don't know if your comment was targeted at me, but I am doing well. And no, I am not a brownnoser.


Could have been targeted at me too. Yes, I've done fine and can now afford to take a year off if I need to before I find something else rewarding in both financial and professional terms. Ditto the MA and years of experience.
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mimi_intheworld



Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 167
Location: UAE

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiral78 wrote:
Yes, I've done fine and can now afford to take a year off if I need to before I find something else rewarding in both financial and professional terms. Ditto the MA and years of experience.

It is my intention to get to this point with my own finances and am quite sure TEFLing is the way to do it. As others have posted, I too know from experience that it's possible to get a decent paying job teaching English in Western Europe. It's harder to do than in other places, but it's do-able. With the right experience, quals, and connections, anything is possible.
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love the "real job" comment - one I often used to hear in teachers' lounges here in the States:

"I'm just doing this until I can get a "real job."

Upon questioning, I discovered that the definition of a "real job" for most of the speakers was any employment that paid them a lot more to do a lot less.

I sincerely hope that they found such jobs, as they were, without exception, lousy teachers (Is anyone really surprised?)

Regards,
John
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1st Sgt Welsh



Joined: 13 Dec 2010
Posts: 946
Location: Bandar Seri Begawan, Brunei

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Europe-not a living wage to be found. Reply with quote

sharter wrote:
EFL is a holiday job not a career.


No offence sharter, but you really do sound like my mother Confused God bless her, but she honestly does believes that my current job is a complete dead-end! So much so that I have actually given up on trying to convince her otherwise. The fact that I enjoy my job, work fewer hours then I can even remember doing previously, have time to pursue other interests, am able to save money, do not suffer any work related stress and enjoy a fantastic lifestyle doesn't seem to register at all.

I've worked in "career" jobs back home and, I know from bitter experience, that they are not 'all that'. My only regret about my decision to enter TEFL is that I didn't do it years sooner.

Besides, this is as worthwhile as anything else. We are involved in education and, the acquisition of English for many people around the world, depending on certain variables, is often essential if they want to get ahead. Furthermore, it can open another world to people through greater exposure to foreign influences.

If certain people wish to view their time as an EFL teacher as little more than acting as a 'native English speaking monkey' then that's their problem. In many cases, it is also their problem if they choose to continue working for a school that shares that view and treats them as such. Just like Denise wrote, if you are prepared to invest in your qualifications, do your research, learn your craft and be realistic about the opportunities that are out there, there is no reason whatsoever why you cannot enjoy a fulfilling career in EFL Cool
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 1613
Location: Home

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iíll take Sharterís side, just to balance things.

First off, Iíll assume ttomplatz lives in Thailand, because Iíve seen the name elsewhere. I know Thailand well and like it a lot, but not everyone wants to settle there. Itís hardly a country without problems.

As for the Gulf, life is too short.

The above are small points. More salient here are the oft-used claims about the west and how ghastly it must be to be stuck in a rat race. Itís fair to say people making these claims were not knee deep in qualifications in their home countries, or they might now have rewarding jobs there. But then teachers who moan about their lot find themselves being quizzed about their Ö qualifications. So, when youíre next belittling life back home, think about why youíre not there.
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denise



Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 3419
Location: finally home-ish

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hod wrote:
Iíll take Sharterís side, just to balance things.

First off, Iíll assume ttomplatz lives in Thailand, because Iíve seen the name elsewhere. I know Thailand well and like it a lot, but not everyone wants to settle there. Itís hardly a country without problems.

As for the Gulf, life is too short.

The above are small points. More salient here are the oft-used claims about the west and how ghastly it must be to be stuck in a rat race. Itís fair to say people making these claims were not knee deep in qualifications in their home countries, or they might now have rewarding jobs there. But then teachers who moan about their lot find themselves being quizzed about their Ö qualifications. So, when youíre next belittling life back home, think about why youíre not there.


I don't belittle EFL or life at home. My qualifications are as valid in the US as they are anywhere else--too bad the job benefits aren't as good at home.

Life too short for the Gulf? Maybe. Have you lived here? If so, then you know how comfortable it can be. But not everyone can handle it.

d
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Hod



Joined: 28 Apr 2003
Posts: 1613
Location: Home

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

denise wrote:
But not everyone can handle it.


And that says all I need to know about the Gulf.

----

Sharter isn't new to this forum. Whilst his opening post is basically a rant, I think what he was after were opinions or advice. What he got was someone saying how big their house was.
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