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bgates276
Joined: 13 Jan 2011 Posts: 22
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Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:55 am Post subject: ISS international schools |
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Hello,
I wasn't sure where else to post this because ISS has International Bachelorette schools all over the world. Has anyone used their services and landed a job with them? Apparently it costs $185 just to use their recruiting services for a year so I wanted to make sure it was worth it. What are the salaries like and how are the job conditions? The problem is, I go to the web site of many of these international schools and there is no information about salaries. |
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Trebek

Joined: 30 Oct 2003 Posts: 401 Location: China
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Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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I signed on with ISS early December. It takes a month for them to go through your paperwork and decide whether you are worthy of the international schools that they represent. They pretty much do all the time comsuming pre-screen work which is why so many international schools use them.
You shouldn't consider joining them unless you are ready to plunk down an extra $290 to attend one of their 5 day job fairs (plus flight and hotel of course). There should be more than 40 schools with positions in my subject areas attending the fair, and hopefuly I'll land a job.
After being through the usual teachers job search, involving countless hours of filling out applications, writing essays, waiting for each school to pre-screen me etc... I don't mind the expense of paying to do all this at once though ISS.
I'll let you know more after the job fair next month. |
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Trebek

Joined: 30 Oct 2003 Posts: 401 Location: China
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Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:23 pm Post subject: |
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The salaries are generally as high or higher than I currently make as a Utah teacher with 13 years experience and a BA plus 36. Many also include free housing or generous housing allowances. Many are in countries where your taxed very little compared to my current tax rate. Most pay your annual fights back home. But be sure to read the benefits of each school, some aren't so good. Hope this helps. |
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bgates276
Joined: 13 Jan 2011 Posts: 22
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Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 6:32 am Post subject: |
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I didn't have enough posts to send you a private message but perhaps you can tell me what you earn in Utah with all your experience. Do you have a bachelor's with certification? If this is too personal than send me a pm. I know in Canada, starting salaries in the public school system is about 50k and goes up to around 90k with lots of experience.
I know that the pay for an ESF international school in Hong Kong is pretty good. Starting salary of 361,000 HK per year plus 8000 for living allowance a month and a 20% bonus at the end of the contract, taxed at only 16% means you can SAVE about $50,000 Canadian dollars a year if you live cheaply. The only ISS School that I could find that posted their salary was one in Columbia and the total salary was only about $20-25 thousand for the year before expenses or taxes. Surely most schools are better than this.
Perhaps, if you got some numbers, you could post the salaries of some of the better schools when you get more information.
Thanks |
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tttompatz

Joined: 06 Mar 2010 Posts: 1951 Location: Talibon, Bohol, Philippines
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Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 7:40 am Post subject: |
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bgates276 wrote: |
I didn't have enough posts to send you a private message but perhaps you can tell me what you earn in Utah with all your experience. Do you have a bachelor's with certification? If this is too personal than send me a pm. I know in Canada, starting salaries in the public school system is about 50k and goes up to around 90k with lots of experience.
I know that the pay for an ESF international school in Hong Kong is pretty good. Starting salary of 361,000 HK per year plus 8000 for living allowance a month and a 20% bonus at the end of the contract, taxed at only 16% means you can SAVE about $50,000 Canadian dollars a year if you live cheaply. The only ISS School that I could find that posted their salary was one in Columbia and the total salary was only about $20-25 thousand for the year before expenses or taxes. Surely most schools are better than this.
Perhaps, if you got some numbers, you could post the salaries of some of the better schools when you get more information.
Thanks |
Typical newbie mistake. Only looking at the base salary.
$25k per year in a country where the average household (not personal) income is less than $3k means you can live a very comfortable lifestyle and still bank a LARGE part of your salary.
A good example is my current situation. I live in Thailand (not in BKK), and our family (3) usually banks about 30-40k baht per month.
At the same time we have a comfortable lifestyle, 3 bedroom/2 bathroom house, air-conditioning, cable TV, broadband internet and can eat out as we like (western style restaurants) or stay home when we prefer. Our daughter enjoys the luxury of a private school.
I enjoy 3-4 months of paid annual vacations and the ability to travel all over east and SE Asia.
You better look the the other benefits as well as the base salary and then put them in the context of the economy that you are going to. They ALL add up and the net savings at the end of the year can be substantial even on a lower salary if the economy is low cost as well.
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bgates276
Joined: 13 Jan 2011 Posts: 22
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Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 11:32 am Post subject: |
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Not a newbie mistake.MOD EDIT BTW, I don't know anywhere where the GDP per capita is only 3k a year. Maybe some African countries but I don't know anyone who goes there to teach English. You do have a good point though where everything is equal besides cost of living. A good example would be choosing Korea over Japan where the salaries would be approximately the same but the cost of living in Japan is much higher. From what I've seen though, the pay in places like Thailand is so much lower that it is not worth it in my opinion even if the costs of living are much lower. Maybe you have something special though like a University position if you are getting 3-4 months vacation a year.
I guess the key is finding a place where you can make lots and the costs of living won't eat too much into your savings. I don't have my bachelor of education yet, but I certainly think it opens up many more lucractive opportunities. Hong Kong and some international schools are just a few examples. |
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tttompatz

Joined: 06 Mar 2010 Posts: 1951 Location: Talibon, Bohol, Philippines
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Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 1:55 am Post subject: |
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bgates276 wrote: |
Not a newbie mistake.MOD EDIT BTW, I don't know anywhere where the GDP per capita is only 3k a year. Maybe some African countries but I don't know anyone who goes there to teach English. You do have a good point though where everything is equal besides cost of living. A good example would be choosing Korea over Japan where the salaries would be approximately the same but the cost of living in Japan is much higher. From what I've seen though, the pay in places like Thailand is so much lower that it is not worth it in my opinion even if the costs of living are much lower. Maybe you have something special though like a University position if you are getting 3-4 months vacation a year.
I guess the key is finding a place where you can make lots and the costs of living won't eat too much into your savings. I don't have my bachelor of education yet, but I certainly think it opens up many more lucractive opportunities. Hong Kong and some international schools are just a few examples. |
I didn't say you were a newbie, I said the mistake was.
Home country certification and B.ed you should look at a public school job in places like Taiwan. Pay scales up to about 88k TWD + full benefits (per month). You can find similar in HK (NET program).
I spend the better part of a decade in Korea and China and they are not all that.
And my last comment before I leave, comparing per capita GDP is NOT comparing actual earned salaries for the majority of the population.
A an example" locally here in Thailand regular teachers in regular schools earn about 10,000 THB per month (CAD$325/mo) and our maid earns thb150 per 8 hour day (CAD$25 per week) and thinks she has a pretty good job. Our housing costs are about $200 per month all in. My salary in on the order of CAD $25000/anum (not including extra classes or work during the holidays) so I can do pretty well when it comes to savings. I work at a decent private school (K-12) and the holidays are normal for here: October, March, April, 16 days in May and a week off for the New Year.
When we built our house in the Philippines we paid the construction crew php1200 (about CAD$27) per day (7 men). Not too expensive to live there either. I paid more per month for electricity in Korea than I paid for total household expenses in the Philippines every month.
It is very easy to live well and save a lot when you are earning 6-8x (or more) than what the average locals earn.
Then you toss in the extras: airfare, medical, contract bonuses in some countries, often housing or a housing allowance and it all adds up. I can
SAVE more here than a teacher will save in Canada after all the taxes and expenses are taken away.
BOTTOM LINE: There is a lot more to look at than just the base salary.
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Trebek

Joined: 30 Oct 2003 Posts: 401 Location: China
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Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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Utah doesnt pay that well... I made 50k last year. After taxes and other fees I take home 3200 monthly. Teaching in an international school my lifestyle and savings potential would be far better in most places. Japan and Western Europe seem to be the exceptions. South American International schools dont seem to pay that well but most offer housing. |
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Trebek

Joined: 30 Oct 2003 Posts: 401 Location: China
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Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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Keep in mind that most ISS represented schools require 2 years teaching experience in the country you are certified in. They also prefer teaching couples over single people like me. |
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tttompatz

Joined: 06 Mar 2010 Posts: 1951 Location: Talibon, Bohol, Philippines
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Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:00 am Post subject: |
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Trebek wrote: |
Utah doesnt pay that well... I made 50k last year. After taxes and other fees I take home 3200 monthly. Teaching in an international school my lifestyle and savings potential would be far better in most places. Japan and Western Europe seem to be the exceptions. South American International schools dont seem to pay that well but most offer housing. |
Take home of $3200 and what was left after the monthly bills (answer not required here - self analysis question).
Gross salary or even take home pay are only a decent comparison when looked at within the context of the cost of living and quality of living of the place you are headed to.
Net savings potential - what is left AFTER you pay your monthly bills (not gross salary) and quality of life are better choices to look at when comparing jobs in different countries.
IN Korea I was earning a gross salary of about to 40k per anum, had rent free housing, airfare, medical, pension and end of contract bonuses. Now I make about 15k less per year gross salary and have twice as much vacation time (6 weeks in Korea and 16 weeks here) but the savings at the end of the month are about the same, my housing is better, the quality of life is much improved and I don't have to worry about buying winter clothes.
Ya guys, look at the big picture when you consider working abroad. You're not going to be in Kansas anymore.
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bgates276
Joined: 13 Jan 2011 Posts: 22
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Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:34 am Post subject: |
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Trebak, I found an interesting discussion on ISS here:
http://internationalschoolsreview.com/v-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=23
Apparently, several people have been burnt by ISS. If you quit your job before the end of the contract, the directors will call ISS and they will blackball you from any future employment or recruiting fairs. Something to consider is subscribing to internationalschoolreview.com before you commit to a position so you know what you are getting into with a particular school.
BTW, what are the salaries like in Japan? One school that interested me was Fukuoka International School but if it is not worth it then I may look elsewhere when the time comes.
Sidenote. 13 years experience and only getting 50k gross a year? Geez, you could be making a lot more in Hong Kong NET program. Worth checking out too. |
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Trebek

Joined: 30 Oct 2003 Posts: 401 Location: China
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Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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Gates:
I don't see ISS as doing something wrong by blackballing, when a teacher doesn't fulfill a contract. The State of Utah would do the same thing. When you sign your contract, you should complete it. I know there are variables and circumstances but a reputable school, who sinks thousands of dollars on a teacher, has a right to expect the teacher to fulfill his/her contract.
I do appreciate the internationalschoolreview.com and HK NET recommendations. Teachers would be wise to check out any school that offers them a job. |
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Trebek

Joined: 30 Oct 2003 Posts: 401 Location: China
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Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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BTW: Fukuoka International pays a salary range of $39,000 - $61,000 Plus 60,000 yen per month housing allowance. They do tax your salary in HK but I'm not sure what the rate is. |
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