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Can I get a job at a university?
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forest1979



Joined: 10 Jun 2007
Posts: 507
Location: SE Asia

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OP - In light of your question, are you employable in Taiwan? Of course. Will you get a job in Taiwan at present? Not so likely. Are jobs available? Yes. Are jobs at good universities available? Yes. Are you likely to be in the competition for one? No. Are you likely to be employed by a second rate instituions desperate to employ a foreigner as it gives good face, and because the person who said they will take the job didn't show up? Take that job if you want. Personally, avoid it like the plague.
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JZer



Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3824
Location: Alaska

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

forest1979 wrote:
Romanworld, as do others, make some very good points in this thread. The crux though of the debate is Romanworld's point on demand for jobs exceeding supply. This, at least with regards to the OP is critical because now in effect the university has free reign to choose who they want and with what background they want. In other words 5-10 years ago a MA in anything was enough to work in a ELC. Now it must be education or language-centred (the MA). Furthermore, there are moves that have been discussed on this website about ELC's creating language jobs but at staff and not faculty level. This means more hours of remedial language teaching, for less pay, and with no rights. In other words, jobs with a lower status than an earth worm! Notably, these jobs are going to Taiwanese people, not so much foreigners because they are refusing to work for NT40,000 a month. Hence I can truly appreciate the remark about why anyone these days would work at a university in Taiwan.

One point that needs to be carefully considered about working at a university is whether the job holder merely sees it as a job or as a career move. At the end of the day, IMO, someone coming to Taiwan to work in a university as a career choice is making a fundamental error. Being a MA holder is not useful with some years of Taiwanese experience in case you have to move 'back home'. I'd go as far as to say its a negative as blame for this lies in the fact that the education system in colleges and university is, by and large, so poor in quality and so badly run. Where money should be invested in books and learning facilities it is instead channeled into grandiose, back slapping schemes to help prove the university is really a university. As strange as that sounds standards within the classroom doesn't come in the equation! Bottom line, you want to be a university instructor then get used to the idea of teaching maybe 70 uninterested, unmotivated, and uncaring students per class for maybe 15 hours a week.


Not to mention that fact if you take 10,000NT off of a 50,000NT salary for housing you only have 40,000 which is around 8890RMB. You might even find a university in China offering that salary. Taiwanese university salaries will soon be at the same level as salaries on the Mainland.
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yamahuh



Joined: 23 Apr 2004
Posts: 1026
Location: Karaoke Hell

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JZer wrote:


Once again a spot on answer from JZer.


Yeah, you're the best JZ'er - how ever will we manage without you?
Oh, wait - I know - happily.

JZer wrote:

Not to mention that fact if you take 10,000NT off of a 50,000NT salary for housing you only have 40,000 which is around 8890RMB. You might even find a university in China offering that salary.


And so begins the played to death old JZ'er chestnut - 'Go to China you can make 30,000 RMb a month working in Hangzhou with my these guys I know...'

Rolling Eyes
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JZer



Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3824
Location: Alaska

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yamahuh wrote:
JZer wrote:


Once again a spot on answer from JZer.


Yeah, you're the best JZ'er - how ever will we manage without you?
Oh, wait - I know - happily.

JZer wrote:

Not to mention that fact if you take 10,000NT off of a 50,000NT salary for housing you only have 40,000 which is around 8890RMB. You might even find a university in China offering that salary.


And so begins the played to death old JZ'er chestnut - 'Go to China you can make 30,000 RMb a month working in Hangzhou with my these guys I know...'

Rolling Eyes


I have never posted that you can earn 30,000RMB a month in China. That was another poster.
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yamahuh



Joined: 23 Apr 2004
Posts: 1026
Location: Karaoke Hell

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah - you're right. What you actually said was this...

JZer wrote:


30 hours of work in China would pay around 80,000NT.


3-8, 8-3 my memory isn't what it used to be.
I'm almost scared to post this in case you start banging that drum again.
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JZer



Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3824
Location: Alaska

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

30,000RMB and 80,000NT is a big difference. 80,000NT is around 18,000RMB.
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Taylor



Joined: 24 Oct 2003
Posts: 383
Location: Texas/Taiwan

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Never forget this point, as made by forest1979 : Bottom line, you want to be a university instructor then get used to the idea of teaching maybe 70 uninterested, unmotivated, and uncaring students per class for maybe 15 hours a week.

To be honest, you might have 5 or 10 students who actually care.

For me, it just isn't worth the hassle of parking, walking all over campus, being thrown into numerous classrooms, etc.

Keep in mind the term "college kids" as used in the US. You will be teaching big children (ages 18-22). They have virtually no life experience to share, other than being students. And with I-phones, Facebook, and all the other distractions, I can not imagine trying to manage such a crowd.

For those who are teaching in universities in Taiwan, may God Bless You!
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romanworld



Joined: 27 May 2008
Posts: 283

PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I need to add one more negative about working in a Taiwanese university and it is related to the falling birth rate issue and lack of jobs around in the tertiary sector. With fewer and fewer jobs available, and universities being strapped for cash, many ELC's and DAE's are downsizing, which means that there is an anxiety amongst (English) teachers of retaining their jobs. Unsurprisingly, the work environment is becoming more competitive and there is much back-stabbing going on. Chinese management often stoke the fires of this dissent and use it to their own advantage, making a bad situation worse. Long gone are the good old days when it was fun to teach in Taiwan. The best thing I ever did was get out of there. But then again, I was smart and saw the writing on the wall.

Last edited by romanworld on Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:35 am; edited 1 time in total
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JZer



Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3824
Location: Alaska

PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So where did you wind up if you don't mind me asking?
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romanworld



Joined: 27 May 2008
Posts: 283

PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JZer wrote:
So where did you wind up if you don't mind me asking?


Far away from Taiwan . . .
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TaoyuanSteve



Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 1028
Location: Taoyuan

PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the salary figures obscure the reality for a lot of the instructors here. The salary is based on something like 14 contact hours per week and is paid for 13 months, while the instructor only works 10. Yes, the salary isn't earth-shattering but, when you consider it's basically a part-time job, it's not that bad. Also, most instructors moonlight-- as they have plenty of time to do so-- and easily double their salaries.
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romanworld



Joined: 27 May 2008
Posts: 283

PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TaoyuanSteve wrote:
Also, most instructors moonlight-- as they have plenty of time to do so-- and easily double their salaries.


But this is illegal and risky and you face deportation if caught, unless you hold an APRC of course.
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yamahuh



Joined: 23 Apr 2004
Posts: 1026
Location: Karaoke Hell

PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TaoyuanSteve wrote:
I think the salary figures obscure the reality for a lot of the instructors here. The salary is based on something like 14 contact hours per week and is paid for 13 months, while the instructor only works 10. Yes, the salary isn't earth-shattering .....


What kind of salary are we talking about?

13 months pay for 10 months work doesn't sound too bad to me - probably get paid for summer vacations - essentially getting your vacation away from Taiwan / travel around Asia / flight home paid for.

Doesn't exactly sound horrible....
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JZer



Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3824
Location: Alaska

PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The salaries for working as a university EFL instructor have already been posted! And not only in this thread!
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TaoyuanSteve



Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 1028
Location: Taoyuan

PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

romanworld wrote:
TaoyuanSteve wrote:
Also, most instructors moonlight-- as they have plenty of time to do so-- and easily double their salaries.


But this is illegal and risky and you face deportation if caught, unless you hold an APRC of course.


Wrong. Even if you don't have JFRV or APRC, you can still get additional work permits to legally work additional jobs.
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