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Stephen Jones



Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2004 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With regard to your query about people transferring between JIC and YIC, I know of no case of this happening either way. The fact that they are over 1500 km apart probably has a lot to do with it.

If your hubby has one of the "best paying jobs in the kingdom with minimal experience" I can't see why he would want to apply to the Royal Commssion. His experience, as you describe it, would only get him in at the bottom of the scale.
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Saudi4Ever



Joined: 25 Mar 2004
Posts: 130

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2004 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stephen Jones wrote:

If your hubby has one of the "best paying jobs in the kingdom with minimal experience" I can't see why he would want to apply to the Royal Commssion. His experience, as you describe it, would only get him in at the bottom of the scale.


That is one of the best paying in the tefl field, not the entire Kingdom. But anyway he is really not all that interested and i'm not pushing just keeping our options open. We have children and with the College he can be out of school the same time they are. Last year we were stuck in the house the entire summer because he coud not take his vacation. His vacation time the kids are in school so we just sit around the house. I'm thinking with the college the lowest they would offer him would be at least 10sr??? If you do the math it is really nt that bad taking a cut because the vacation time alone is 2x as much. And to be totally honest, I did get sold on the hijaz mountain, red sea, nice landscaping thing Cool I'm in love with just the idea of Yanbu Embarassed
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 11720
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 3:35 am    Post subject: $$$$$$$$ and SR Reply with quote

Saudi4ever reminds us that it is not just a question of how much is in the salary cheque.

I took a cut in riyals to come to a job with better vacation.

And remember that the high-paying jobs (eg Raytheon, Britsih Aerospace) are sometimes AWFUL.
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ohman



Joined: 09 Sep 2003
Posts: 239
Location: B' Um Fouk, Egypt

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 11:22 am    Post subject: Meanwhile, next do' Reply with quote

Kuwait is issuing visitor's visas now because of the amount of trade going on with the support of the US and United nations presence north of here.

What this means for folks in our field is that you can catch a Kuwait Airways flight to Kuwait, check into a hotel (2 stars cost about 60 US a night), and hand carry your CV around for a few weeks. You may even pick up some classes right off the plabe, parttime in an institute.

Business is booming across the board here with all the military and humanitarian support and so is the urgency for speaking better English (Kuwait has always seemed to me to be more ESL than EFL).

There are some differences between the lifestyle here and those in Bahrain or the UAE; here they're making a lot of fast money over the pandemonium in Iraq. Perhaps in Bahrain with increased US Naval presence this may be true.

Kuwaitis aren't necessarily exploiting the situation--(just the reverse, they're preparing to issue 50,000 jobs to Iraqis here), though if anyone in these parts has a right to a little pay back it is Kuwait, wouldn't you think.

Bear this in mind--yesterday a window of opportunity opened, which will allow local hires to transfer their visit visas to work visas without making a visa run to Bahrain.

Because one doesn't live on fortified compounds here, the booze doesn't flow quite so freely. Then again, if this is your main concern, I invite you to meet Bill and Lois, friends of mine, whose four meetings per week have at least 18 real drunks like me showing up to beeatch and moan for one hour.

By the way, the meeting takes place in an actual church.
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12056
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 1:14 pm    Post subject: Iwait for Crack Reply with quote

Dear ohman,
It's good to hear that your new situation seems to be a LOT better than the last one.
Your mention of Kuwait Airways reminded me of a joke I made up during the 1st Gulf war, when Iraq took over that airline:

The new name for the company would be either:

1. Iwait Airways

or

2. Kraq Airways

OK, I didn't say it was a GOOD joke.

Regards,
John
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Saudi4Ever



Joined: 25 Mar 2004
Posts: 130

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ohman, couldn't you have started your own thread? Mad This has nothing to do with my query. My username is SAUDI4EVER, does that sound like I am unhappy here or interested in fleeing to Kuwait? Confused
Did you read my very opening statement about my purose of started a new thread to discuss YANBU? Rolling Eyes

S4E
A very content wife of an efl teacher who wishes that all disgruntled expats with prove the ole cleche "misery loves company", wrong!
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Albulbul



Joined: 08 Feb 2003
Posts: 364

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 2:23 pm    Post subject: KSA ! Reply with quote

"Saudi Arabia : Love It Or Leave It !"

Ohman will not be persuaded but there are people who have positive experiences here.

Choose your employer carefully, but even then, Saudi is not for everyone.

Some people cannot adapt to different realities, different lifestyles, different ways of seeing things.

Personally I would sooner teach in saudi Arabia than in the country of my birth. Does that make me some kind of crazy ? That is not the way I see it !
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Saudi4Ever



Joined: 25 Mar 2004
Posts: 130

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We know of several non-muslim western families who prefer to raise their children in Saudi then in the west. Not everyone lives to have a 'drink' or illicit sex. Some people prefer the 'old fashioned' ways of the gulf. We even know of western families who get disgusted when they see the Saudis imitating the west in non-sense. At least when we turn on the tv we do not have to expose our children to Janet Jackson's breast or other inappropriateness. Actually my kids have more variety here then in the States. My dh is ant Dsney so most of the so-called family movies were not allowed but at least here we can go to mega star and get a pretty good chop job movie with no nudity or kissing.

From my observations the people with the most complaints are here by themselves. Most of the expats with kids really do not complain much, because if they add up the pros and the cons then raising your kids here far out way the pros of raising them in the west.

And now that yall got me started Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
I really hate it when I here EFL teachers talk about they are only here for the money. what kind of losers were you all before? the money in this country is not to be made in EFL The wealthier expats are in the oil business or upper management not the teachers. Is money really all that important, that you will make yourself and everyone around you miserable? Case in point, I am willing to (well my dh is) take a pay cut so that my family can have their vacations togther, and since I am in the house most of the time it is reasonable that I would want to live in a home that I am pleased with. If my dh gets the College job with the less pay then he is still a winner because now his family is happier and has fewer complaints, which should positively eefect his work performance and insure that his employer would continue to renew his contract because he has a good teacher.

I must get off my soap box because my baby is crying for me again Smile
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12056
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 3:34 pm    Post subject: Complaints Reply with quote

Dear Saudi4Ever,
I can understand and appreciate your points; however, I knew plenty of married couples in the Kingdom with kids who weren't exactly loath to complain. But heck, that's pretty normal, I'd say - no matter where you are, there's always plenty to complain about. I can still recall being in hospital in Japan (back when I was in the Marines), probably the best duty station possible (especially during the Vietnam war), and yet, at the clubs, the favorite song of most of the troops was:

"We Gotta Get Outta This Place"

Go figure.

Also, I'd say there's nothing wrong in being there for the money. I don't see it as an "either/or" situation, perhaps because I was fortunate in that I really enjoyed my job there. If you love teaching, why not go to a place that lets you make and save more than you can anywhere else?
And let's face it - there are aspects of Saudi society that MOST Westerners
find, well, less than appealing. I do agree that people who are constantly moaning and groaning about being there are a pain; I mean, if they dislike it so much, do they need someone to point out to them how to get to the airport?
Regards,
John
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dmb



Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Posts: 8397

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I applaud Ohman in realising he has a problem and is going to meetings 4 times a week. Good luck.
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Bindair Dundat



Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Posts: 1123

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Complaints Reply with quote

johnslat wrote:
Also, I'd say there's nothing wrong in being there for the money. I don't see it as an "either/or" situation, perhaps because I was fortunate in that I really enjoyed my job there. If you love teaching, why not go to a place that lets you make and save more than you can anywhere else?


Why, Mr. Slat! We meet again, and in the warm glow of brotherly agreement. I think it's a happy coincidence that some of the best-paying EFL jobs are in the most fascinating countries, with the added bonus that these countries scare the h e l l out of many of our would-be competitors in the job market, who then flit off to Korea or some other place where the food is as bad as the housing.

I got into EFL for the travel, but travel gets wearying. Money, OTOH, is so refreshing: It always feels fresh, crisp, cool, and clean to the touch. I find it a real comfort; it imparts a joy and meaning to my life that nothing else can quite match. I sometimes suspect that people who do not fully appreciate money are lacking something in the spiritual realm; I wonder if their souls are fully evolved; but that, Mr. Slat, is strictly my personal bias.

As I was reading Ms. Ever's post, I had a moment of apprehension as I thought, "Horrors! Is she one of these anti-materialist types?" But then I remembered that she has her heart set on a villa. No one who truly wants a villa can go too far wrong in this world.

Mercenarily,

BD
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Stephen Jones



Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm worried about all the Kuwaitis going into therapy.
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Saudi4Ever



Joined: 25 Mar 2004
Posts: 130

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 6:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Complaints Reply with quote

Quote:
I got into EFL for the travel, but travel gets wearying. Money, OTOH, is so refreshing: It always feels fresh, crisp, cool, and clean to the touch. I find it a real comfort; it imparts a joy and meaning to my life that nothing else can quite match. I sometimes suspect that people who do not fully appreciate money are lacking something in the spiritual realm; I wonder if their souls are fully evolved; but that, Mr. Slat, is strictly my personal bias.

As I was reading Ms. Ever's post, I had a moment of apprehension as I thought, "Horrors! Is she one of these anti-materialist types?" But then I remembered that she has her heart set on a villa. No one who truly wants a villa can go too far wrong in this world.

Mercenarily,

BD

Laughing Laughing Is this guy a Comedian or what? Really you tickle me pink Very Happy
Seriously though, there is nothing superficial about wanting a decent home. I live in a Villa now. It is actually halfway decent. Could be a lot better but in order to make the neccessary improvements then we the expat would have to fork out the money. Like i said, if we had more job security then that would not be a problem, but since we could be given the boot at anytime then it is not wise to make such an investment. The problems I speak of can and have been hazardous to my families health. we have old moldy,mildewy, dirty carpet. The furniture is mostly broken. the appliances are all damaged (fridge leaks and if this was america we could have a major law suit for everytme we slip in our laundry rom from the washing machine leaking). I have mentioned it to some who have worked in other parts of the world that say this is nothing and we are living in luxury. If this was our only option I would not complain and would appreciate what we have (and I still do). However, there are other options out there to consider, but if we chose to stay here then you will not catch me on here 'be-iching and moaning' about wanting a better Villa. My dh will just have to deal with that Wink
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dmb



Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Posts: 8397

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

we have old moldy,mildewy, dirty carpet. The furniture is mostly broken. the appliances are all damaged (fridge leaks and if this was america we could have a major law suit for everytme we slip in our laundry rom from the washing machine leaking).

Welcome to the world of ESL
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12056
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 7:40 pm    Post subject: Lie down on the couch, please Reply with quote

Dear Stephen Jones,

"I'm worried about all the Kuwaitis going into therapy."

And the problem would be . . .??

Just kidding, although I will say that a good number of the Kuwaitis I ran into during my time there wouldn't be hurt any by a little therapy.

Regards,
Jogn
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