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eleccion 2012
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notamiss



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 908
Location: El 5o pino del la CDMX

PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Guy Courchesne wrote:
Remember, those officers were lynched because they were photographing children in that neighbourhood and the immediate suspicion was that they were part of a kidnap gang working that area.


I remember, but that's not all there was to it. There are further layers to the story. I won't hijack the discussion by going into it here, we can talk about it some other time. None of the additional info helps make Ebrard look better for his lack of leadership that night.

I would like to like him, because my political sympathies are much closer to PRD than PRI or PAN, but that event is a big stumbling block.
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BadBeagleBad



Joined: 23 Aug 2010
Posts: 1186
Location: 24.18105,-103.25185

PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

notamiss wrote:

I would like to like him, because my political sympathies are much closer to PRD than PRI or PAN, but that event is a big stumbling block.


Me too, but I can�t stomach him, for a lot of reasons. I think he has done some good things, yes, but they were not well planned, or well thought out, and little, if any, thought was giving to people who were going to be displaced, and businesses that were going to be effected. They just showed up one day and started tearing up miles and miles of street. Due to all the rain yesterday work has come to a halt, so another day with no progress.
I wish PRD had a decent candidate, I think someone who really believed in the party platform could do some real good. I think a lot of what Ebrard does is flash. And he does a lot of dumb crap too, that benefits very few people, leaving things undone that would benefit many.
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Phil_K



Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2041
Location: A World of my Own

PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 9:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You have the advantage of having education and skills that enable you to earn a living


Finished high school (UK equivalent), a waste of two years. Plodded along in a "job" for years, and taught myself everything I wanted and needed to know!

While I accept that some people have the disadvantage of lack of formal documents, I think you are talking about a small minority, and the ingenuity that these people show in "making a living" could easily be channeled in a legal and more socially acceptable way if, as you suggest, they are serious about providing for themselves and their families.

Also, if you read my previous comments, you will understand I am not necessarily blaming these people, but suggesting what policies a serious, reforming president should adopt. Therefore, removing this plague from our streets should go hand-in-hand with having a policy to help (regularize) those who really are in need, and not those who are just taking the easy option.
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Phil_K



Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2041
Location: A World of my Own

PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I wish PRD had a decent candidate


Maybe we should convince Cuauht�moc C�rdenas, at his nearly-80 years!
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periodista-masajista



Joined: 13 Jun 2005
Posts: 54
Location: Texas, USA

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bump. Thought I'd scoot this one to the top in case anyone had any thoughts about Pena Nieto's Guadalajara gaffe. What do you think? A non-event, a dooming error, or somewhere in between? How would you compare and contrast the way Mexican voters react to incidents like this to the way voters react in the US?
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Guy Courchesne



Joined: 10 Mar 2003
Posts: 9650
Location: Mexico City

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://eldeforma.com/2011/12/07/loret-de-mola-defiende-de-nuevo-a-pena-no-es-para-tanto-leer-libros-ya-esta-overrated/

Loret de Mola defiende de nuevo a Pena: "No es para tanto, leer libros ya esta overrated."

Quote:
M�xico (7 de diciembre del 2011).- El reportero y conductor de Primero Noticias sali� a la defensa del candidato a la presidencia por parte del PRI una vez m�s al asegurar que �hoy en d�a ya no es importante leer libros.�

�La gente est� exagerando, �qu� tan grave puede ser que un presidente no sepa leer?,� se�al� Loret en�rgicamente en su programa matutino. �A mi se me hace importante que por ejemplo: D� una imagen de elegancia y est�tica atractiva� no quiero decir que se me haga guapo, pero esta �padrot�n� y eso nos hace ver bien ante el mundo.�

Durante el programa tambi�n asegur� que de toda la gente que ha criticado �al pr�ximo presidente de M�xico� m�ximo el 2% ha le�do un libro completo en sus vidas �y lo peor de todo es que son de las persona que sustituyen la C por la K cuando se expresan en las redes sociales.�

�Me queda claro que la hija de mi estimado Pe�a ten�a raz�n, es pura prole la gente que anda hablando, �adem�s que le vamos a hacer? �Votar por AMLO? � tampoco estamos tan pen�sativos.� Concluy� as� Loret de Mola el tema.



Laughing
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notamiss



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 908
Location: El 5o pino del la CDMX

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.reforma.com/editoriales/nacional/637/1272168/default.shtm?plazaconsulta=reforma&

Quote:
El problema no es tanto la falta de lecturas sino el presumir de una cultura que no se tiene. [�] La cultura literaria no es garant�a de un buen gobernante. Luis Echeverr�a y Jos� L�pez Portillo eran hombres de amplia cultura y buenos lectores de libros. Echeverr�a, en particular, hac�a con frecuencia comentarios que demostraban que s� hab�a le�do las obras que citaba. Miguel de la Madrid fue director del Fondo de Cultura Econ�mica. Carlos Salinas de Gortari tiene una s�lida cultura literaria y una biblioteca impresionante.


Rough translation: �The problem is not so much lack of literacy as of claiming to have a degree of culture that one does not possess. [�] Being well-read and cultured is no guarantee of being a good political leader. Luis Echeverr�a and Jos� L�pez Portillo were widely read men. Echeverr�a in particular often made statements that showed that he had indeed read the books that he quoted. Miguel de la Madrid was the director of the Fondo de Cultura Econ�mica [a publishing house that focuses on cultural and scientific titles]. Carlos Salinas de Gortari has a well-based literary culture and an impressive library.�
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1450
Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it and the follow up comment from his daughter hurt him. Based on the posts from my Mexican facebook friends, they have spent most of this week poking fun at him.
The worst thing is not that he couldn't remember a book he's read, the worst thing is that he was unable to improvise on the spot. I mean he should at least know the names and authors of some "iconic Mexican books" right. He could have easily said something like "I imagine I'm like most Mexicans, marked individually as well as collectively by Juan Rulfo's Llano en Llamas." The person who is going to lead the country needs to be able to think on his feet and improvise--even if that means telling a white lie.
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Phil_K



Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2041
Location: A World of my Own

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the opposite! I, too, am not a great reader of fiction, and would be hard-pressed to honestly mention two or three books I've read, and could comment on.

I'd be more impressed with someone who said so, perhaps mentioning something else which occupied his time, although it would take a lot for me to be impressed by Pe�a Nieto!

I think, irrespective of our particular political leanings, we are going to miss Calder�n. Could you imagine EPN doing "The Royal Tour", and it being seen as anything other than a blatant publicity stunt?
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1450
Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil_K wrote:
I think the opposite! I, too, am not a great reader of fiction, and would be hard-pressed to honestly mention two or three books I've read, and could comment on.


Never said it had to be fiction Phil.

All in all it was a Sarah-Palin-esq moment and showed an inablity to go off script.

(It's only fair for me to add, that non of my Mexican facebook friends would ever have dreamed of voting for him before this.)
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Phil_K



Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2041
Location: A World of my Own

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Never said it had to be fiction Phil.


Ah, good. I could talk all day (I usually do!) about the biographies I've read.
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Prof.Gringo



Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 2236
Location: Dang Cong San Viet Nam Quang Vinh Muon Nam!

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

globalcitizen1968 wrote:
BadBeagleBad wrote:
Can�t we do any better than this?


Nope. Mexico is too corrupt and backwards.


Laughing

Pe�a Nieto will be the next Mexican Pres in 2012 barring some intervention from the Virgin of Guadalupe.
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Phil_K



Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2041
Location: A World of my Own

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Prof.Gringo wrote:
globalcitizen1968 wrote:
BadBeagleBad wrote:
Can�t we do any better than this?


Nope. Mexico is too corrupt and backwards.


Laughing

Pe�a Nieto will be the next Mexican Pres in 2012 barring some intervention from the Virgin of Guadalupe.


Let's pray for a miracle then!
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Isla Guapa



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 1520
Location: Mexico City o sea La Gran Manzana Mexicana

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil_K wrote:
Prof.Gringo wrote:
globalcitizen1968 wrote:
BadBeagleBad wrote:
Can�t we do any better than this?


Nope. Mexico is too corrupt and backwards.


Laughing

Pe�a Nieto will be the next Mexican Pres in 2012 barring some intervention from the Virgin of Guadalupe.


Let's pray for a miracle then!


Today would be the day to do it!
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1450
Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil_K wrote:
Prof.Gringo wrote:
globalcitizen1968 wrote:
BadBeagleBad wrote:
Can�t we do any better than this?


Nope. Mexico is too corrupt and backwards.


Laughing

Pe�a Nieto will be the next Mexican Pres in 2012 barring some intervention from the Virgin of Guadalupe.


Let's pray for a miracle then!


Something we agree on! Razz
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