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TKT Practical

 
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davidmsgi



Joined: 01 Feb 2011
Posts: 56
Location: Mexico City

PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 12:35 am    Post subject: TKT Practical Reply with quote

I am confused regarding the TKT Practical Certificate.

On the Cambridge web site, TKT Practical is listed with the 3 Modules of the normal TKT exam - it almost looks like another module.

But when I read about the TKT Practical, it doesn't seem to make sense as just an additional 'module' of the TKT program.

I am a native-American English teacher and I'm currently teaching Junior High (secondaria), High School (prepa), and University classes, as well as Company and private classes. I'm an FM-2 Inmigrante Visa holder, my wife is a Mexcian citizen, and I've been living and teaching in Mexico since my arrival here 10 months ago.

But I have no teacher's certificate, and no University degree.
With a certificate, I could get a higher salary at the schools where I teach, and higher hourly rates from my Company clients and private students.

I thought that the TKT Practical was a new program designed to allow 'working' , experienced teachers like me to get a TKT certificate by having an examiner visit a real class, observe, and evaluate my performance for the purpose of granting a TKT certificate. I thought that this was an ALTERNATIVE to taking the 3-module written TKT exam.

But I have been told that a teacher must complete the three TKT modules before taking a TKT Practical. This doesn't make sense to me - why would anyone need a TKT Practical after taking the 'normal' 3-module TKT written exams? After the 3 modules, you would already be certified!

The schools seem to have little knowledge or experience with the 'new' TKT Practical. I think they are trying to 'sell' me on the normal TKT because they either are not familiar with, or are unable to offer, the new TKT Practical exam and certificate.

Can anyone help me with real answers and experience regarding the new TKT Practical certificate?

Thanks!
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Guy Courchesne



Joined: 10 Mar 2003
Posts: 9403
Location: Mexico City

PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I noticed the addition of the practical TKT as well and wondered the same. I took the 3 module TKT test last Saturday.

I suspect the practical module is much like the other 3 modules...a cash cow enterprise.
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1133
Location: 17°48'N 97°46'W

PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know this for a fact, but it seems to me that this was to compensate for the major criticism of the TKT, which is (was) the lack of observed teaching practice.

Quote:
This doesn't make sense to me - why would anyone need a TKT Practical after taking the 'normal' 3-module TKT written exams? After the 3 modules, you would already be certified!
But many schools will not hire teachers whose certification did not include a practical componant.
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Gregory.



Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 39
Location: Mexico City / Tlaquepaque

PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with MotherF.

The TKT practical is a module that can be taken and it will become a core module. Additional modules such as CLIL are extra and completely optional to take but the TKT practical is being added to counter the arguement that the TKT is extremely theoretical and not really practical.

Remember that teachers cannot fail the TKT, they are graded by band. This is interesting because when someone says I have the TKT- the real question is 'but which band did you get?'

I would recommend a teacher training course such as the cambridge CELTA or, if you're planning to stay for a long time here in Mexico then the CENNI is a very good option because it's what the SEP are looking for.
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BadBeagleBad



Joined: 23 Aug 2010
Posts: 844

PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gregory. wrote:


I would recommend a teacher training course such as the cambridge CELTA or, if you're planning to stay for a long time here in Mexico then the CENNI is a very good option because it's what the SEP are looking for.


That, or a SEP approved Teacherīs Diploma course. Being SEP certified will open a lot of doors. And if you are planning on staying in Mexico long term, I would actually recommend a Teacherīs Diploma course (a good one, check around, there is a WIDE variation in quality) over a CELTA. First, it is more recognized in Mexico, second it is recognized by the SEP, third, it has more hours of instruction (the one I took had 240 hours) and far more class observation, demo classes and observed classes. The cream of the crop is the CELE at the UNAM, and a close second is the course at the Universidad Panamericana. The director of the language center at Panamericana also works at the UNAM and was instrumental in designing the CELE. In fact, many of the materials we used (I took the course at Panamericana) were the actual materials from the CELE, and we had several guest speakers from the UNAM. It was a great course (taught in English, for those who donīt speak Spanish), and there was a student in the course who already had a CELTA and said he learned a lot. If you plan on moving from country to country, then a CELTA would probably be a better choice in the long run, though.
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FreddyM



Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 178
Location: Mexico

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gregory. wrote:
if you're planning to stay for a long time here in Mexico then the CENNI is a very good option because it's what the SEP are looking for.


Hmm. I have a Cenni diploma, but all it goes is vaidate my Engilsh level, proven by a Cambridge CPE. (The CPE also only validates your English level, it has nothing to do with teaching.) Are there different cenni diplomas? There was no work involved in my getting a cenni, other than showing them my CPE and filling out some paperwork.

Another teacher once told me that that Cenni diploma was all I needed to be SEP authorized as an English teacher. I found it hard to believe because I basically had to do nothing to get it. Are the standards really THAT low here?
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1133
Location: 17°48'N 97°46'W

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Freddy, I afraid that they are pretty low.
I've looked into the CENNI as an evaluation for our students as well--not English majors. As far as I could tell, it's meant to be like the Cambridge exams only national to satisfy the Anti-Malinchista current found in some sectors (such as the SEP).
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Isla Guapa



Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 1520
Location: Mexico City o sea La Gran Manzana Mexicana

PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 1:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MotherF wrote:
Freddy, I afraid that they are pretty low.
I've looked into the CENNI as an evaluation for our students as well--not English majors. As far as I could tell, it's meant to be like the Cambridge exams only national to satisfy the Anti-Malinchista current found in some sectors (such as the SEP).


I'm confused. How is making standards for English teachers low anti-Malinchista?
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1133
Location: 17°48'N 97°46'W

PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isla Guapa wrote:
MotherF wrote:
Freddy, I afraid that they are pretty low.
I've looked into the CENNI as an evaluation for our students as well--not English majors. As far as I could tell, it's meant to be like the Cambridge exams only national to satisfy the Anti-Malinchista current found in some sectors (such as the SEP).


I'm confused. How is making standards for English teachers low anti-Malinchista?


Two separate things.

The standards for English teachers in Secondary schools are extremely low.

Side topic---The CENNI (As fas as I could glean from their website) is basically a Mexican made copy of Cambridge Main Suite/IELTS exam. An attempt to say, we don't need some fancy English university to accredit us.
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FreddyM



Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 178
Location: Mexico

PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MotherF wrote:


Side topic---The CENNI (As fas as I could glean from their website) is basically a Mexican made copy of Cambridge Main Suite/IELTS exam. An attempt to say, we don't need some fancy English university to accredit us.


That's how I see the Cenni, it's just the mexican version of the cambridge exams (or toefl, or toeic or any similar examination). Which is why i've never understood how it can be used as a TEACHING credential.
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Gregory.



Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 39
Location: Mexico City / Tlaquepaque

PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MotherF wrote:
Side topic---The CENNI (As fas as I could glean from their website) is basically a Mexican made copy of Cambridge Main Suite/IELTS exam. An attempt to say, we don't need some fancy English university to accredit us.


An interesting point of view however, it would seem logical that a national government would want some form of internal/local/ non-foreign exam to evaluate their own teachers.

I don't see anything wrong with that. I don't think it's because they are trying to make any statement.

Just national testing for a national programme. The other thing is that the CENNI can be developed by the SEP and not reliant on an international [Cambridge] exam. Once again, it seems logical to want to keep the examination in-house.

Nothing sinister here at all and whatsmore, I salute the SEP for taking this step. Its definitely a step in the right direction of improving the standard of language teaching in Mexico.

First get everyone certified, then start to raise the bar.
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jaimem-g



Joined: 21 May 2010
Posts: 85
Location: The Desert, CA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do the countries in Europe that do a fairly good job of producing students proficient in English use to evaluate their students and teachers?

Do they have something similar to Malinchismo?

Or what about India ...... Just thinking
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1133
Location: 17°48'N 97°46'W

PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gregory. wrote:

An interesting point of view however, it would seem logical that a national government would want some form of internal/local/ non-foreign exam to evaluate their own teachers.

I don't see anything wrong with that. I don't think it's because they are trying to make any statement.



Rather naive view of government--everything they do is all about statement.
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Gregory.



Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 39
Location: Mexico City / Tlaquepaque

PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MotherF wrote:
Rather naive view of government--everything they do is all about statement.


If trying to improve the quality of language teaching throughout the republic is a statement, then I apologise for my 'rather naive view of government' but I think you have missed the point of the post, mother F.

The point is - why have all the teachers in country take an external exam when an internally designed and developed and cheaper one could be offered.

Teachers can take a TKT or the CENNI- both are recognised, so teachers have a choice. Isn't that the best option for all?
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MotherF



Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1133
Location: 17°48'N 97°46'W

PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why reinvent the wheel?
When the CENNI was created it wasn't to fill a whole in the crenditial market. It was to stop the flow of pesos out of Mexico and to the Cambridge Local Exam Sindicate, now known as Cambridge ESOL. There is nothing innovative about the CENNI. It is mearly a Mexican made copy of an exsisting exam. I'm sure someone who is probably related to a SEP official was paid very nicely to "develop" the exam. It probably took about 45 minutes for them to do said development.


Also why limit your students (the CENNI is not a TEACHING credential) to a certificate that won't be recogonized beyond national boarders when they could take one that is recognized all over the world? If someone says to you, I passed the level 4 STEP exam from Japan do you know what level that is? I don't. But teachers all around the world do know what level a FCE exam is.

There is also the issue of the know corruption in Mexican government bodies. I would be much more likely to believe a student with an FCE pass had really passed.

And to answer jaimem-g's question. Students in France, or Germany, or Spain all take Cambridge Exams. Just as students in England take the DALF (French) DELE (Spanish) or the Goethe-Zertifikat if they need their level accredited. And I understand that IELTS is very popular in India.
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