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ILS Milano?
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kriskem



Joined: 25 May 2009
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:42 pm    Post subject: ILS Milano? Reply with quote

Hi All,
This is my first post here though I've been a member of Dave's ESL for quite awhile. I did a search prior to posting but didn't find anything so please forgive me if I missed it! I've applied for a job at ILS Milano and have been talking to them but can't seem to find anything about them online - nothing here in the forums, etc. The contract they sent me looks really good but I suppose I'm letting my inner pessimist out to play because it almost seems too good to be true. (this may be because I've been applying for jobs for what seems like forever. who knows). The woman I've been in contact with seems very nice.

If it matters, I am American, have two MAs (TESOL + Linguistics), 3+ years experience teaching ESL, and no Celta.

So....does anyone know anything about teaching for them? I can't really risk such a big move and have it all fall to pieces around me!

Thanks in advance.
K
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Teacher in Rome



Joined: 09 Jul 2003
Posts: 1216

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Um - do you also have European citizenship? Without that you won't be able to work legally in Italy unless that nice woman is also prepared to wade through all that expensive, time-consuming paperwork to get you a working visa.
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kriskem



Joined: 25 May 2009
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teacher, I don't have citizenship but am married to an EU citizen.
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Teacher in Rome



Joined: 09 Jul 2003
Posts: 1216

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And do you have the right to work in Italy? I think you need to get that sorted out before you decide whether to come over to work. As far as I know, if you're married to, say, a French citizen, you can work in France - but not necessarily in Italy...
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kriskem



Joined: 25 May 2009
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From the research we've done, as a spouse of an EU citizen, I have the same rights to work in Europe that he has. We just have to go together, which we will, obviously. He is a translator of European languages and so hes very mobile for work. There may be more paperwork in moving to a third-party country, but from our research, it can be done. He can work in any country in the EU and as his spouse, I can go with him and get a job as well.

Also, I have told the school (and others I've applied to) about my citizenship and that I am married to an EU citizen and they (and all of the others) continued with my application. I've never been told I'm not eligible based on my citizenship
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9600
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do not know about Italy, but I can say definitively that being a spouse of an EU citizen doesn't allow one to work in every EU member country, regardless of whether one's EU spouse can/does work there or not.

I know spouses of EU citizens who are not able to get work visas, though they have an automatic right to live in whatever country their EU spouses are employed in. It was a problem for me personally in the past as well - but this may not apply to Italy.
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kriskem



Joined: 25 May 2009
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spiral, thanks for the reply. As far as I know, it's not a problem, and I am always forthcoming with employers about my citizenship and marital status. The school knows, and has offered me a job, so I suppose it's not a problem.
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9600
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hopefully someone here will know something about the school itself. I'll ask my Italian colleagues - I have two from Milano.

It is also possible for a school to request an exceptional visa based on qualifications anyway, if the school can argue that you have quals that no EU candidate for the job has. You may also fall into this category, with your dual MAs.

Good luck, in any case!
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Teacher in Rome



Joined: 09 Jul 2003
Posts: 1216

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The school knows, and has offered me a job, so I suppose it's not a problem.


It might not be, but then it's also possible that the school doesn't know all the legal ins and outs! It's also possible that they offer you a job, then two minutes before you're due to leave, rescind the offer...

I know plenty of US citizens working here, but they're all married to Italian citizens (not French or German or anything else.) That could of course just be coincidence, but I'd really urge you to check it out before making any final decisions.

Did you want any feedback on the contract itself? Feel free to post terms / conditions etc!
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kriskem



Joined: 25 May 2009
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teacher,
thanks for your response! That's true, they may not know! I did go on the EU website to see what they said about EU spouses and from what my husband and I can tell, I can work in the EU but I'd definitely get some more clarification before packing my bags. Smile

Here are some of the terms of the contract:
2500 eur monthly w/ severance pay at end
Apartment available
ticket reimbursement
visa assistance
overtime when available
25 hours teaching time per week
health care paid by school

To me, the contract looks super and i guess I've just heard way too many horror stories with regard to super looking contracts! I am also hopelessly trusting which can be bad in ESL, I think, as there are lots of horrible schools out there. :/
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9600
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sad This sounds like a classic scam ad, I'm afraid - though of course it may be legit!!!

The salary is very very high for a private language school, as this one seems to be. 'Visa assistance' is also a bit of a red flag - either they will get you one or they cannot (and private language schools normally cannot!!). On this point, if you need a visa to work in Italy, a private school won't be able to get you one. If you can work there legally, then you don't need 'assistance.'

Almost no school in Europe will offer to pay for flights, from private language schools to proper universities. It's just not a normal benefit for the region. Another red flag.

Don't send them any money up front for anything, and do let us know what happens!!

Seriously, this sounds like a scam.

http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=93134

http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=92410&start=0
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kriskem



Joined: 25 May 2009
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spiral,
Thanks for your input! I thought so too, but haven't really been looking in europe for that long, so was like, what do I know? Definitely wouldn't send money for anything!

Thanks again Smile
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9600
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Basics for the entire region:

It is rare to find any job from abroad, unless you are applying for an international school or possibly a university position. These jobs require specialist qualifications, which you may be considered to have, but they are fairly rare and usually go to people with local connections.

Private language schools VERY rarely hire sight-unseen, the most common exception being a school in some very remote area.

Pay other than at universities and international schools is generally subsistence level or just above. The pay rate you quote in the package above is (in my experience) something one might receive at a university or int'l school, but definitely not at any private language school. Benefits normally should include health insurance, may include a subsidised flat, may include travel passes for public transit in the city.
Airfare is never paid so far as I know, at any level.

Most job contracts are September/October through June.

You normally need to be here in person to apply for jobs other than university/international schools.

I hope that helps, if you're going to continue to look in Europe. Where's your husband from?
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kriskem



Joined: 25 May 2009
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for that info!

My husband is British. We're currently living in the UK and I am looking for university positions here but am having zero luck so far. A university position is what I really want (and why I did my MA in TESOL) but it seems a lot here want the CELTA, which is not a requirement in the US (where I am from and did my MA TESOL). So I've branched out to looking in France, Germany, Spain, and Italy hoping to find a university teaching job. :/
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spiral78



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 9600
Location: On a Short Leash

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It sounds strange that a CELTA would get you a university job when your MA wouldn't - that's very very odd.

The university ESL scene in the UK is quite tight I understand from my British colleagues. I worked at (and still do project work for) a university in the Netherlands, where we also had partner universities across the EU. I know that the job market in this sector is very tight and unfortunately probably getting tighter for the foreseeable future.

Your best bet might be to pick a city where you will be able to get a private language school position and then try to work your way into the 'better' jobs around, but that obviously implies a fairly long-term commitment to an area.

Well, and to keep watching the adverts - openings DO come up occasionally!
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