Site Search:
 
Get TEFL Certified & Start Your Adventure Today!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Safety in the ME
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> General Middle East Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Pilot in Command



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Posts: 50

PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2004 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The news media are hinting today that there was a deal made to let three of them go. I wonder if that had anything to do with the 7 Americans that were "rescued" hours before the final assault on the compound by Saudi forces? Prince Bandar actually called Fox News Saturday night to report the release of the 7 Americans, but he refused to comment on how that came about.

Meanwhile, the media are also reporting today that the three escaped terrorists are still being pursued by the Saudi police. There was one report that the three had taken a vehicle at gunpoint today.

There have been several interviews today on the issue of infiltration of the Saudi police and military (including the so-called elite forces that stormed the compound) by Al-Qaeda sympathizers.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15329

PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2004 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I write this there are word-of-mouth reports of shooting in dowtown Khobar and Dammam.
One report said MacDonalds in Khobar was at the centre of a shoot-out.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bindair Dundat



Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Posts: 1123

PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2004 7:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Tough call Reply with quote

johnslat wrote:
At the same time, I KNOW if someone I loved were being held hostage, I'd want to kill anyone who refused to make a deal.


Can't say I blame you, Mr. Slat. Say what needs to be said and let them walk out the door. But get away? In a car, when the government has helicopters, jets, and (theoretically) every kind of technology at its disposal? Sheikh Yassin should have been so lucky.

I am not one to believe that any deal made with a gun held to one's head must be honored. Say what has to be said, let them walk out the door, and then blow them to Kingdom Come.

Insha'allah.

BD

P.S. I think the House of Saud just lost.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 12:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Bindair Bundat,
Don't count out the House of Saud just yet; the guys in charge in that family are survivors, and they are, for the most part, pretty sharp cookies.
Regards,
John
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stillnosheep



Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 2068
Location: eslcafe

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 1:28 am    Post subject: Cynicism is not the answer! Reply with quote

Pilot in Command wrote:
The news media are hinting today that there was a deal made to let three of them go. I wonder if that had anything to do with the 7 Americans that were "rescued" hours before the final assault on the compound by Saudi forces? ... There have been several interviews today on the issue of infiltration of the Saudi police and military (including the so-called elite forces that stormed the compound) by Al-Qaeda sympathizers.
.

Man things may be a virtue to many peoples young PiC but i doubt you'll find cynism amongst them anywhere.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
stillnosheep



Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 2068
Location: eslcafe

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 1:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

and the same applies to you, young master dundat!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

How come nobody calls me "young master johnslat"?
Regards.
John
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
shebab



Joined: 17 Sep 2003
Posts: 168

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 5:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scot 47 said:

Quote:
So are you still planning a return to KSA. shebab ?


Yes, I am. I have started the visa processing steps and am hoping that things in the Eastern Province will have calmed down by the time I get there. I suspect that the whackos will have moved on to a new locale in Saudi by August to carry out their evil deeds.

While things are not pleasant at the moment in KSA, I have seen much worse in Colombia. In any case, nothing can help you if it's your time to move up to that great ESL classroom in the sky.

If anything good can come out of what has transpired in the past few days, it should hopefully be that the majority of Saudis in the Kingdom who are against these attacks will have more appreciation for the foreign workers who dare set foot on their shores while everyone else is running away. Of course, I may just be an idealist who wants everyone to just love one another. Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15329

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 6:50 am    Post subject: Green Igama Reply with quote

If you are coming back, take out the following insurance : convert to the one true faith and get a green "Igama" instead of the sh**-coloured one given to non-Muslims.

Then when the throat-slitters ask about your religion you can in truth say that you are a Mussulman.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15329

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So these three mujahideen just walked away from the compound where they had murdered so many people !

See :

http://www.arabnews.com/?page=1&section=0&article=46060&d=1&m=6&y=2004

Could it be that KSA's finest are not particularly interested in catching them ?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From today's (June 1st) NY Times:

KHOBAR, Saudi Arabia, May 31 - The Iraqi-born American engineer stood listening to two of the four terrorists who had attacked his luxurious residential compound in this Persian Gulf oil center wrangling over his fate.

"He's an American, we should shoot him," he recalled the younger of the two as arguing. He looked about 18 and was wearing desert camouflage.

"We don't shoot Muslims," responded the older man, perhaps 25, with wispy facial hair.

The argument seesawed for several minutes, both men displaying a certain calm determination. The engineer had a stark example of just how determined they were because a few yards away lay the body of a Swede he knew, oozing blood. Two other militants cradled guns as they paced nearby.

The engineer stood there silently, hoping, praying the older man would prevail. "I was on the borderline," he said, "but finally the older one said, 'We are not going to shoot you.' "

Instead, they gave him a brief lecture about the merits of Islam and their cause, then tried to make him point out the houses of infidel neighbors.

The engineer, who has a fringe of black hair and gold-rimmed glasses, only wanted to be identified by his adopted name of Mike because three of the four gunmen remained at large on Monday. He remains too nervous even to have his current home mentioned.

While the 242 residents rescued from the upscale Oasis compound here were departing the country as quickly as possible, the way the hostage drama ended Sunday, with three militants escaping and with 22 people dead and 25 wounded, left more questions than answers in the heart of the kingdom's oil industry along the Persian Gulf.

Many Saudis and expatriates wondered aloud whether the gunmen and the police had struck a deal, speculating about how it was possible that the militants could escape from a walled compound surrounded by hundreds of police officers.

"It makes me very nervous," said Ismail Rahim, a 33-year-old Saudi computer technician. "We are all really upset about how these people left, how they just ran away from that compound."

Hours after the standoff, the Interior Ministry said the gunmen had taken hostages with them. But Western diplomats and some Saudis discounted that argument, saying that at some point the militants had released the few residents they still had with them and had managed to get away in a stolen car.

"We don't really know what happened yet; the Saudis haven't given us a readout," said one Western diplomat. He pointed out that the compound is huge, but he believes that the official explanation remains too vague.

Saud al-Musaibeh, a spokesman for the Interior Ministry, said the safety of the residents still trapped in the compound during the ordeal, about 41 of whom were actually held captive, was the primary concern.

"The release of the hostages was the main goal," said Mr. Musaibeh, emphasizing that a nationwide dragnet would surely find the men.

There were few developments on Monday in the case, although rumors ricocheted around of gunfights, explosions and dead bodies found. A radical prayer leader in a mosque in Khobar was picked up on suspicion of having a link to the men, said a Saudi close to the investigation, speaking on condition of anonymity.

The Saudi also said the leader of the militants, Nimr al-Bigami, who had recently been released from jail and is the son of a Riyadh businessman, remained in a coma after being wounded in the shootout with the Saudi special forces early Sunday.

For Mike, the 45-year-old Iraqi-American engineer, the ordeal started early Saturday morning as he was trying to leave the Oasis compound. As the heavy metal gate clanged open to let him out, he heard gunfire and drove home to wake up his wife.

Coming downstairs afterward, he saw blood on the carpet and smelled smoke. A quick check of the family, including his daughter and son, revealed no wounds, so he went to summon security.

On the way, he encountered four men in uniforms carrying guns and asked them if they were security officers. They said yes, and he began detailing the problems in his villa. At that point they demanded his residency card, which indicates nationality and religion, setting off the argument over whether to kill him.

Mike shook his head at the memory, noting that it shows how little he was expecting an attack to succeed inside the heavily guarded compound. "I mean, until the very last minute I thought the terrorists were security guards," he said.

After deciding not to shoot him, the men tried to justify their cause.

"They told me: 'We are here because we want to promote Islam. We don't want non-Muslims to come to our country. We are promoting a Muslim cause,' " Mike recalled. They asked him to point out the houses of non-Muslims. The Saudi public was particularly disturbed by the killing of Muslims in previous attacks.

He lied and said he had only recently moved there, although he had been in the Eastern Province since 1999, building a gas and oil development company that he now hopes to transfer to Bahrain.

The gunmen let him go, apologizing as he left that they had searched his house and that one of them had bled on his carpet. Mike went home and gathered some neighbors, calling the American Embassy and the Saudi police to sound the alarm.

He says he has still not heard back from the embassy, but the police eventually sent three armored personnel carriers to rescue him and about 15 neighbors. The owner of the compound came with them.

Since Mike got out, the calls have poured in from friends as far away as Dearborn, Mich., and from family members still living in Najaf, Iraq, and from his brother in Baghdad.

"He told me I should come there,'' Mike said. "It's safer."

Regards,
John
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Truman



Joined: 24 Oct 2003
Posts: 50

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:02 pm    Post subject: ** Reply with quote

Thank you, young master johnslat.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Pilot in Command



Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Posts: 50

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for your comments young master stillnosheep.

Shebab, only you can decide if the risk is worth it. Since you've apparently decided the risk is worth it, I wish you the best and I pray for your safety in Saudi Arabia.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mark100



Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 441

PostPosted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 6:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pilot in Command said
"news media are hinting today that there was a deal made to let three of them go. I wonder if that had anything to do with the 7 Americans that were "rescued" hours before the final assault on the compound by Saudi forces? Prince Bandar actually called Fox News Saturday night to report the release of the 7 Americans, but he refused to comment on how that came about.

Meanwhile, the media are also reporting today that the three escaped terrorists are still being pursued by the Saudi police. There was one report that the three had taken a vehicle at gunpoint today.

There have been several interviews today on the issue of infiltration of the Saudi police and military (including the so-called elite forces that stormed the compound) by Al-Qaeda sympathizers."

All of what you said according to my sources (compound manager of Oasis) is basically correct.
Like everything else in Saudi security is just a facade.
Imagine three of four young men were basically running around Khobar for a couple of days killing and shooting and with all the security around could not be stopped ...laughable...

This would have made the puppeteers of these young men extremely happy...world wide media coverage....complete inaction from security forces..the portent for more serious action is ominous....not sure that the House of Saud is as secure as you think John.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 1:37 pm    Post subject: Built on sand? Reply with quote

Dear Truman,
Thanks - I needed that. Young's only a relative term, after all.

Dear Mark100,
Well, the House of Saud is certainly resting on shakier ground than it was just a few years ago (Could one say that it's a House built on sand, anyway?). However, despite all the fairly recent turmoil, I seriously doubt there are enough "committed anti-Sauds" in the Kingdom to effect an overthrow. In fact, by (finally) assuming the posture of "anti-terrorists" (apparently they realized at last that the "protection money" they were paying was helping to fund the "jihad" against them - duh), they may be seen by many of the locals as the only viable alternative.
Regards,
John
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> General Middle East Forum All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Page 2 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

Teaching Jobs in China
Teaching Jobs in China