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Why Is Interac So Keen To Hire New Teachers?
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2012 1:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

spidr,
First you wrote "friends" and now you write "friend". Which is it here?

Just because the are Asian in appearance and ethnicity, and some employers discriminate against them, that doesn't mean this was the reason JET did. What can they do? Nothing. As has been stated on this and other forums, all you can do is go with the flow

1. If it was discrimination, you are likely not going to be able to fight it unless you have strong proof, and even then it will be a hard ride to victory. Avoid those employers and tell other people who they are.

2. Since we have no proof, how about being fair about this whole thing and assuming there could have been other reasons they were rejected? People, good teachers and bad, make mistakes on resumes and cover letters, bomb the English test, make poor impressions on demonstration lessons, and do terribly on interviews. Sometimes (often?) they do not even know how poor their performance is, and they blame some other reason. Please keep all this in mind, especially with no proof of racial discrimination.

In the case above, I can only suggest that someone go over their resume for them, see how well it was formatted, and inspect the cover letter. I've seen scores over the years, and you'd be surprised what sort of mistakes people make. As for the other things (demo lesson, interview, English test), it may be a matter of perspective, but how about asking your friends to self-evaluate themselves and really, really give a fair assessment? Essentially, that's all you can do unless you have a time machine and can go back to watch it all.

As for a blanket statement that JET doesn't hire Asians, that is totally false. Look at the JET pamphlet showing the various nationalities, and you'll see Asians represented there. Any number bigger than zero proves that statement false.
http://www.jetprogramme.org/documents/pubs/2010_jet_E.pdf
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spidr245



Joined: 26 Nov 2008
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2012 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glenski wrote:
spidr,
First you wrote "friends" and now you write "friend". Which is it here?

Just because the are Asian in appearance and ethnicity, and some employers discriminate against them, that doesn't mean this was the reason JET did. What can they do? Nothing. As has been stated on this and other forums, all you can do is go with the flow

1. If it was discrimination, you are likely not going to be able to fight it unless you have strong proof, and even then it will be a hard ride to victory. Avoid those employers and tell other people who they are.

2. Since we have no proof, how about being fair about this whole thing and assuming there could have been other reasons they were rejected? People, good teachers and bad, make mistakes on resumes and cover letters, bomb the English test, make poor impressions on demonstration lessons, and do terribly on interviews. Sometimes (often?) they do not even know how poor their performance is, and they blame some other reason. Please keep all this in mind, especially with no proof of racial discrimination.

In the case above, I can only suggest that someone go over their resume for them, see how well it was formatted, and inspect the cover letter. I've seen scores over the years, and you'd be surprised what sort of mistakes people make. As for the other things (demo lesson, interview, English test), it may be a matter of perspective, but how about asking your friends to self-evaluate themselves and really, really give a fair assessment? Essentially, that's all you can do unless you have a time machine and can go back to watch it all.

As for a blanket statement that JET doesn't hire Asians, that is totally false. Look at the JET pamphlet showing the various nationalities, and you'll see Asians represented there. Any number bigger than zero proves that statement false.
http://www.jetprogramme.org/documents/pubs/2010_jet_E.pdf


Hold on here! I didn't say anything like JET not hiring Asian people. I've seen my fair share while in Japan.

I am only bringing up one person's account, but there are others as well. I don't want to have to list every single account because (as you say) not all of them are true. But you've worked with JET too, so I'm sure you have some idea of this.

I've seen resumes of the people I know and I am well aware of their abilities. There definitely could have been some others more qualified than them. Of course, they could have just blown their interview as well. But you can't deny the truth that comes from someone's mouth on the inside. And sure, maybe it's not JET that denies them, but on the outside, that's what it looks like to everyone.

In the end, it's like we've all been saying, "Not much you can do about it." Just continue on with your life because JET isn't the only thing out there. It's just another option like the many others out there.

It's really just sad that these kind of things are still going on. (I'm sure many can agree on this point at least.)
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2012 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

spidr245 wrote:
Hold on here! I didn't say anything like JET not hiring Asian people.
Huh? Then what did you mean when you wrote:

"I only knew of this discrimination through word of mouth. It basically boiled down to JET not wanting Asian people..."

and

"I've had friends rejected from JET because they were Asian."


Quote:
But you've worked with JET too, so I'm sure you have some idea of this.
Actually, I never was on JET. I did not pass the interview.

Quote:
I've seen resumes of the people I know and I am well aware of their abilities. There definitely could have been some others more qualified than them. Of course, they could have just blown their interview as well. But you can't deny the truth that comes from someone's mouth on the inside.
Wait. What inside dirt are you talking about?
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spidr245



Joined: 26 Nov 2008
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2012 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glenski wrote:
spidr245 wrote:
Hold on here! I didn't say anything like JET not hiring Asian people.
Huh? Then what did you mean when you wrote:

"I only knew of this discrimination through word of mouth. It basically boiled down to JET not wanting Asian people..."

and

"I've had friends rejected from JET because they were Asian."


Quote:
But you've worked with JET too, so I'm sure you have some idea of this.
Actually, I never was on JET. I did not pass the interview.

Quote:
I've seen resumes of the people I know and I am well aware of their abilities. There definitely could have been some others more qualified than them. Of course, they could have just blown their interview as well. But you can't deny the truth that comes from someone's mouth on the inside.
Wait. What inside dirt are you talking about?


"Not wanting" and "rejected" doesn't exactly equal "not hire." It does sound very close, however, so maybe I should have phrased it better.

Those above quotes just relate to the "dirt" you want to know so much about. I don't want to get into it because it could just have been a bad group of reviewers (maybe there was a secret far-right politician in the group). Basically, not every JET location is going to discriminate, or every interview session for that matter, as they shouldn't. But from what I heard, it can happen on rare occasions.

There are still those in Japan who refuse/don't want to interact with outsiders. (And if you are of any non-Japanese Asian descent, just wait 'til you meet one of these guys in person... Things can get really ugly, and fast...)

I'm not saying JET is a bad program, or deter people by any means. It's a great opportunity compared to many of the other options out there. Even if it's something rare, or something that may never happen again, I just wanted to chime in. That's all. (We've already gone too far off-topic.)
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2012 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spidr245 wrote:
"Not wanting" and "rejected" doesn't exactly equal "not hire." It does sound very close, however, so maybe I should have phrased it better.
Yes, you should have! So, what are you saying now in reality?

A. None of them were hired.
B. Some of them were hired.
C. All were hired but somehow they found out from an inside source that they were unwanted by someone (who?) because they were Asian.

Quote:
Those above quotes just relate to the "dirt" you want to know so much about. I don't want to get into it because it could just have been a bad group of reviewers (maybe there was a secret far-right politician in the group). Basically, not every JET location is going to discriminate, or every interview session for that matter, as they shouldn't. But from what I heard, it can happen on rare occasions.
The way I read your earlier post, it was not a rare occasion. Please be more careful how you express yourself in the future.

Quote:
There are still those in Japan who refuse/don't want to interact with outsiders. (And if you are of any non-Japanese Asian descent, just wait 'til you meet one of these guys in person... Things can get really ugly, and fast...)
We're talking about something entirely different here.

Quote:
Those above quotes just relate to the "dirt" you want to know so much about. I don't want to get into it because it could just have been a bad group of reviewers (maybe there was a secret far-right politician in the group).
Once again, you have not proven a darned thing about whether someone did this because of the candidate's Asian heritage. You are speculating.

Quote:
I'm not saying JET is a bad program, or deter people by any means.
Excuse me, but you just said it does so on rare occasions. I'm having a lot of trouble trying to follow what you are talking about.
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OneJoelFifty



Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 463

PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2012 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kionon wrote:

OneJoelFifty, I pretty much agree with Glenski on this. I don't honestly, rationally, reasonably expect that everyone should strive for changes in the system. We're talking about the ideal, and my ideal presumes quite a lot. For one thing it presumes that ALTs have the training and background I do, and therefore are "equipped to facilitate the changes that need to be made," and more importantly know enough to care enough. I don't think either of those presumptions are true. You may be right about the consequences, I guess I just don't care, because I have to continue to look myself in the mirror each day and go to sleep each night. If I were to stop "making noise" I wouldn't be able to do either of those things. It also just wouldn't be me.


I understand all that. I wasn't suggesting that you should stop, in fact I was encouraging you. My entire argument was just that it's unrealistic of you to demand that everyone else make the same efforts as you when everyone has different backgrounds. But it seems as though you agree with me on that now.
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OneJoelFifty



Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 463

PostPosted: Sun May 20, 2012 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glenski wrote:
IMO, it's not a matter of being equipped to facilitate changes. Most foreign teachers simply are not teachers by vocation or calling or training, and they leave in 1-3 years so they don't care about changing things for the better. That's how I see it.


I'm not disagreeing with that, and it results in a lot of teachers being ill-equipped to do anything differently to what is required of them. And a bunch that can't even do that.

If everyone was a teacher by vocation, calling and training, do you think that the foreign teachers in Japan would be able to make changes to the way English is taught? I have my doubts.
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2012 4:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OneJoelFifty wrote:
If everyone was a teacher by vocation, calling and training, do you think that the foreign teachers in Japan would be able to make changes to the way English is taught? I have my doubts.
At least the JTEs that work with them would be able to rely on a source of information that is dependable, and which can give them a different perspective on how they themselves should consider changing.

As it is, if you have a dedicated JTE who follows only the current regime, working with an ALT who doesn't know the first thing about lesson planning or curriculum creation, how is the JTE supposed to hold a meaningful dialogue with them to tap them for other ways of doing things?

There are more advantages to having real educated teachers here, but that addresses one of the points.
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Kionon



Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 226
Location: Kyoto, Japan and Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2012 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glenski wrote:
There are more advantages to having real educated teachers here, but that addresses one of the points.


Of course, whether or not we could get the Japanese to agree...

I now have a new position. I'm quite happy with how our negotiations worked out.
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OneJoelFifty



Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 463

PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2012 5:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Details please Kionon!
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Kionon



Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 226
Location: Kyoto, Japan and Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2012 6:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OneJoelFifty wrote:
Details please Kionon!


Going to wait on that until I am actually standing in the classroom. The position is with Interac, and didn't get everything I asked for, but I got enough that my take home pay should be the same or more as I was making in my previous position.
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OneJoelFifty



Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 463

PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2012 6:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Congratulations. I'm very interested to hear how you go about implementing your ideas with the JTEs, so please keep us updated.
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Kionon



Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 226
Location: Kyoto, Japan and Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2012 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I've been told to have 50万円 on my person for the next 60 days for initial start up costs... Uh. On my person? LOLWUT? I'm not going to carry hundreds of thousands of yen around when I have a Japan Post account... trying to confirm they literally mean cash on my person or they just mean available funds. I have it, but uhm... I'm sorry. I'm not going to keep in my wallet, or under my mattress or something...
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2012 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You must be kidding. They merely mean "with you" and available to use, not in your wallet. That's the bizarre J-English used so often.
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Kionon



Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 226
Location: Kyoto, Japan and Dallas, Texas

PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2012 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glenski wrote:
You must be kidding. They merely mean "with you" and available to use, not in your wallet. That's the bizarre J-English used so often.


...This is a native English speaker. If it was a J-national, I would have just assumed that what was meant. Instead, I did a double take and asked for confirmation. I asked "how much cash do I need on my person" and I got a reply, "You should have 500,000 yen on hand for the first sixty days." This I immediately replied, "When I say on my person, I mean in cash, in my hand... physically located on my person... Do I really need that much?"
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