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reddevil79
Joined: 19 Jul 2004 Posts: 234 Location: Neither here nor there
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Phil_K
Joined: 25 Jan 2007 Posts: 2041 Location: A World of my Own
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Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 2:25 am Post subject: |
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Another one?! |
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MotherF
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 1450 Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W
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Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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I've very sad about this. While I actually don't like several of his books that I've read. I first "met" Carlos Fuentes in high school when I was a big fan of the writing of Ambrose Bierce, and so read The Old Gringo and saw the movie. I did really like that book. I also admired Carlos Fuentes as his role of public academic. I think academics have a social responisblity to allow the public to know their opinions on a wide range of subjects, even when those are outside of their field of study. I think Carlos Fuentes was a good example of a well trained mind and a widely read individual. So I appreciated knowing his political opinions, not just his fiction writing. |
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Phil_K
Joined: 25 Jan 2007 Posts: 2041 Location: A World of my Own
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Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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I think it was the other way around for me. I admire anyone who can be successful in the difficult field of writing, but I'm not enamoured of the culture of building up so-called "intellectuals" or "thinkers". I just think that paying undue attention to the opinions of other people, and particularly the almost orgasmic fawning that was going on among journalists and writers last night, is a cop-out. I'd like to think that my own particular brand of original thinking is borne out of my experiences and observations, and as such is as valid that expressed by my fellow human beings.
And for the record, I always found Fuentes to be a little too full of himself, un poco sagr�n, if you will. But RIP all the same. I'm sure he and Monsiv�is will be happy to resume their "intellectual" ramblings. |
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MotherF
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 1450 Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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Some photos from the wake.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-18096809
Phil, Fuentes was born into privledge, but instead of using the privledge to only expand his economic capabilities, he also used his position to expand is intellectual capabilities. The vast majority of Mexicans (and people around the world for that matter) to not have the luxury of being able to persue intellectual persuits. You (and I) are more to the privledge side, no matter how much or little cash we have on hand at the moment. So people like you and I can experience and observe the world and come up with our own brand of original thinking. But the masses can not. The masses could just turn to the likes of EPN and allow him to make choices that affect their lives. Or they could turn to people who have had the calling (and the luxury) of a life spent studying and thinking. |
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Guy Courchesne
Joined: 10 Mar 2003 Posts: 9650 Location: Mexico City
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 4:27 pm Post subject: |
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This is a very poor thread to say this, so I am sorry Mr Fuentes...
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So people like you and I can experience and observe the world and come up with our own brand of original thinking. But the masses can not. The masses could just turn to the likes of EPN and allow him to make choices that affect their lives. Or they could turn to people who have had the calling (and the luxury) of a life spent studying and thinking. |
What an elitist point of view. Pity the common man for he cannot think and must but push buttons to make the machine work. |
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MotherF
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 1450 Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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The common man has to find a way to feed his children. It is a very unfortunate situation not one you've ever likely been in. It's not at all elist to excuse them for not being well read. On the contrary It's quite elitist to think you can labour for 14 hours a day and still have time to be so. |
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Guy Courchesne
Joined: 10 Mar 2003 Posts: 9650 Location: Mexico City
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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MotherF wrote: |
The common man has to find a way to feed his children. It is a very unfortunate situation not one you've ever likely been in. It's not at all elist to excuse them for not being well read. On the contrary It's quite elitist to think you can labour for 14 hours a day and still have time to be so. |
You have no idea who I am and probably have no business telling anyone who is well read and whether they should be or not.
I'm saying it is quite elitist to think that the common man has no capability to expand on his intellectual capabilities. All men have to feed their children and whether they do it by the sweat of their brow or by the sweat of someone else's may be an election debate, but observing the world is best done with your hands, not from an ivory tower. I find it odd to be to the left of you on such a thing? |
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MotherF
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 1450 Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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Anyone who posts on this board is not poor. You might have or have had cash flow issues. No one from the US or Canada is poor by world standards. You've never been in a situation where you had no choice but to drink water you knew was probably going to make you sick, but it was that or die of dehydration. That's what poor it.
I'm saying that people with the luxury of dedicating their lives to academic persuits have a social responsiblity to get out of the "Ivory Tower" and tell people what they think. That's what Carlos Fuentes did and that's what Phil said he shouldn't do. I said it's one thing for Phil to be able to dismiss Fuentes opinions, Phil has the luxury of researching a wide variety of topics for himself because he has both the time and the economic resources to do so. The vast majority of the 7 billion people on the planet do not have that.
While I support the occupy movement I find the whole 1% Vs 99% movement very ironic and short sighted. The United States and Canada, together have a population of around 352 million, That's 5% of the world's population. Europe's population is about 733 million people. That's 11%. |
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Guy Courchesne
Joined: 10 Mar 2003 Posts: 9650 Location: Mexico City
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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Fair enough analogy but you and Fuentes fall into the same category as Phil and I. Who is to say that a better course comes from one in the ivory tower that hasn't actually lived the same way, or has had to make the same choices?
Solutions to problems should come from the bottom up, where actual experience lies, and not from the top down. History is rife with top-down ideas that have failed miserably.
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I'm saying that people with the luxury of dedicating their lives to academic persuits have a social responsiblity to get out of the "Ivory Tower" and tell people what they think. |
Nothing wrong with that, but like you say, if you haven't had that actual experience, these are words in the wind. You're looking for a Che but not finding one here... |
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MotherF
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 1450 Location: 17�48'N 97�46'W
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Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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Guy Courchesne wrote: |
Fair enough analogy but you and Fuentes fall into the same category as Phil and I. |
I never said anything to the contrary. Anyone with access to this forum, on the interent, in English, falls into that category. |
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