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holding documents

 
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Adela



Joined: 30 Jul 2006
Posts: 40

PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2012 7:12 am    Post subject: holding documents Reply with quote

Do employers in Turkey "hold" documents such as university diploma, passports, etc while you're in their employment?
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Eagle Eyes



Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 121
Location: Istanbul

PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No they don't...actually they don't need to as there are thousands of EFL teachers ready to work for them in Turkey and since they are easy to replace there is no need to keep their documents! Shocked
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billy orr



Joined: 15 Jul 2009
Posts: 214

PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2012 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adela, there was a discussion on this last year:
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?p=983686&highlight=#983686

It seemed at that time that people felt it was not necessary for a university to hold documents like degree and teaching certs. However, the rules may have changed since then. As far as I know now all teachers who hold first degrees and Masters degrees gained outside Turkey need to apply to YÖK for 'denklik' (an equivalence certificate), and notarised, translated original certificates need to be submitted. At least, that is what they asked me for when I applied for 'denklik' earlier this year.
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Adela



Joined: 30 Jul 2006
Posts: 40

PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for your comments. I tend to worry about everything.
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billy orr



Joined: 15 Jul 2009
Posts: 214

PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your concern is understandable. You do not want to feel like a prisoner.

If they have asked for your original certificates, it is most likely to do with denklik. If you hand them over, you should either have already started working there, or be certain that you want to work there, as the process can take some weeks or even months before the documents return from Ankara. It took them nearly 5 months to send me my denklik certificate, although my circumstances are a bit different to most, and I think it is done more quickly for most people.
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wander&teach



Joined: 15 Nov 2009
Posts: 112

PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A couple of more general suggestions to make your life easier here;

1) Contact the institutions you attended and purchase original "copies" of all of your teaching credentials including transcripts and diplomas before you arrive, and bring them with you. They are relatively inexpensive and good to have on hand. This way if push comes to shove, nobody can hold you "hostage."

2) Bring several color photo copies of your passport with you. These come in handy while traveling as hotels require you leave to your passport with them at the front desk. I have always had them gladly accept these copies so never give up the originals if possible (of course employment is the exception). They also serve as great everyday identification so keep your original in a safe place and carry one with you in your wallet or purse. As you may know the Turks issue National Identification Cards to all of it's citizens. Most Turks are very proud to show you theirs and the authorities are sticklers on identification for everyone.
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tarte tatin



Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Posts: 247
Location: Istanbul

PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was the OP on the thread that is linked above.

I did eventually get my documents back, but it was a long fight. It is unusual in Turkey but it happened to me and my native speaking colleagues.

My advice is to only hand over the notarised copies.
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Eagle Eyes



Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 121
Location: Istanbul

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Notarized copies of your originals should only be sufficient...this is an unfortunate sign which proves that some employers in Turkey feel that they own you by holding back your original documents. Needless to say they also know they will always have the upper hand on you as they know you are easy to replace at any time! Shocked
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billy orr



Joined: 15 Jul 2009
Posts: 214

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This may not be about employers at all. If YÖK expects to see the original, they probably won't issue a denklik certificate until they have seen it, which means no work permit and job.

I dealt with YÖK myself, and I did not want to risk the original certificates getting lost in transit, so I sent notarised copies. They immediately wrote back saying they could not proceed without the originals. Teachers new to Turkey will probably need the employer to deal with YÖK and denklik, so it may be necessary to provide originals to YÖK. They should be returned as soon as the denklik returns. And the denklik certificate should be the property of the teacher, not the employer, so they should be put in the hands of the teacher too.
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tarte tatin



Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Posts: 247
Location: Istanbul

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, apart from Billy I haven't heard of other teachers being asked for originals and I have many friends in other universities.

Our problem stemmed from one man who thought he could hold us by keeping our certificates. We complained to our rektor who was shocked and wrote to YÖK himself to see if this was necessary procedure.

YÖK replied that it was a good idea to hold our certificates as it could prevent us moonlighting at second jobs! They do not like their resources being shared around apparently. Fortunately our rektor reasoned that as Turkish staff are not required to submit their certificates and could equally easily moonlight (and many do), he should return our certificates to us.
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