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learning Russian in Ukraine

 
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Mark



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 500
Location: Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:22 pm    Post subject: learning Russian in Ukraine Reply with quote

Hi folks,

Just wondering what you folks think of the idea of choosing to learn Russian in Ukraine rather than Russia. Things just seem safer and more stable in Ukraine (relatively speaking, of course).

Also, I have a Ukrainian acquaintance in Kiev, so hopefully I'd be able to meet locals, although my friend is Ukrainian-speaking. I'm still a bit fuzzy on how different Ukrainian and Russian actually are. I know that the eastern part of Ukraine is the Russian-speaking part, but I don't know how good of a location Kiev is for learning Russian. Would another city be better?

Any thoughts? Perhaps the Russia vs. Ukraine topic has been done before, but I didn't see it here on the Ukraine forum.

Cheers.
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coledavis



Joined: 21 Jun 2003
Posts: 1829

PostPosted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 3:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All I can say is that there are loads of language schools in Kiev which offer Russian as well as foreign languages. This is no recommendation of quality or price, but organisations you could consider in Kiev include Oxford Klass, Nova Mova and Dec. Im sure that several others are also in the market.
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Mark



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 500
Location: Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the reply. I'm actually not planning to go to school - I'm more into independent learning.

I was just cuious about people's experiences learning Russian in Ukraine. I know that they are quite similar, so I wonder if I even have to worry much if my area is mostly Russian-speaking or Ukrainian speaking.
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jpvanderwerf2001



Joined: 02 Oct 2003
Posts: 1076
Location: New York

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You will have no problem learning Russian in Ukraine. I lived in L'viv, probably the most Ukrainian-speaking city in the country, and there were Russian speakers everywhere. You people, especially, speak Russian in social situations.
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AYMAT38



Joined: 24 Jun 2009
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 8:42 pm    Post subject: Russian in L'viv Reply with quote

jpvanderwerf2001 wrote:
You will have no problem learning Russian in Ukraine. I lived in L'viv, probably the most Ukrainian-speaking city in the country, and there were Russian speakers everywhere. You people, especially, speak Russian in social situations.


Yes, there may indeed be Russian speakers in L'viv. Hmmm, why is that?......Hmmmm, oh yes, because Ukraine was taken over and controlled by the USSR. I've worked for the Ukrainian Catholic University in L'viv before, and Russian is NOT the language you want there. Russian lessons in Ukraine! That is like getting a job in Dallas and being offered Spanish lessons. Learn Ukrainian first, and then Russian. Despite Yanukovych's best efforts, Ukrainian is still the national language of the country.

Pa pa...
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Cardinal Synn



Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 572

PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The OP didn't mention Lviv. In Kyiv, Russian is very widely spoken, so it's really a personal choice for the individual - not a political issue.
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jpvanderwerf2001



Joined: 02 Oct 2003
Posts: 1076
Location: New York

PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:42 am    Post subject: Re: Russian in L'viv Reply with quote

AYMAT38 wrote:
jpvanderwerf2001 wrote:
You will have no problem learning Russian in Ukraine. I lived in L'viv, probably the most Ukrainian-speaking city in the country, and there were Russian speakers everywhere. You people, especially, speak Russian in social situations.


Yes, there may indeed be Russian speakers in L'viv. Hmmm, why is that?......Hmmmm, oh yes, because Ukraine was taken over and controlled by the USSR. I've worked for the Ukrainian Catholic University in L'viv before, and Russian is NOT the language you want there. Russian lessons in Ukraine! That is like getting a job in Dallas and being offered Spanish lessons. Learn Ukrainian first, and then Russian. Despite Yanukovych's best efforts, Ukrainian is still the national language of the country.

Pa pa...


Wow, a bit of aggression there Shocked
In short, yes, you can easily learn Russian in Ukraine. Ukrainian is hardly spoken outside of the west of the country, and there are many, many Russians in the country. I'm not sure, exactly, what AYMAT was getting at, it's nothing akin to learning Spanish in Dallas (although one could easily do that, too).
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coledavis



Joined: 21 Jun 2003
Posts: 1829

PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, nothing like it. Russian is still the lingua franca there. I guess what could have been said is that Ukrainian is dominant in western Ukraine, where Russian is discouraged; the situation is more finely balanced in Kiev; and Russian is favoured more in eastern Ukraine.

Last edited by coledavis on Sat Feb 11, 2012 1:04 pm; edited 2 times in total
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bingbing223



Joined: 15 Jan 2011
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exactly as mentioned before- it would be easier for you to learn it in an Eastern Ukrainian city, where everyone speaks Russian on a regular basis. You'd have the immersion aspect, but you'd also be living in Eastern Ukraine... Wink
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ecocks



Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 855
Location: Gdansk, Poland

PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Until 20 years ago Ukraine was Russia. They spoke Russian thee for centuries. The Russian you learn there will be no different than the Russian you learn in Moscow or Vladivostock. The more correct analogy to learning there would be taking lessons in Dallas versus taking lessons in New York, Boston or Atlanta. Your accent will probably be slightly detectable to a native speaker and a couple of contemporary slang words might be unfamiliar. Otherwise, it's the exact same language.

As just one example of an objective organization's validating this, several NATO and US military agencies polish off their Russian language specialists in Ukraine.
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Vanica



Joined: 31 Aug 2006
Posts: 368
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe go to Odessa?
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JoeRomano



Joined: 12 Jan 2010
Posts: 49

PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ecocks wrote:
Until 20 years ago Ukraine was Russia.


Ukrainians will disagree with that statement, plus it is legally incorrect. It is like saying that Scotland and India are/were England. Legally Ukraine was not Russia- it was its own republic with a parliament and a seat in the UN and a separate flag. And there was still the Ukrainian language taught in schools.
Think of Ireland- Gaelic is taught and signs are in Gaelic but everybody speaks English in Dublin. And Ireland gained independence when? Last century. Until then was it...England? You'd better not say that in a pub in Dublin.

However, if you say that Ukraine was USSR, then it is correct. But Russia and USSR are two different entities- although they were used interchangeably in Hollywood movies and by most English speakers.

Kind of like the French call all Brits- les Anglais- wrong but an engrained habit.
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ecocks



Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 855
Location: Gdansk, Poland

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2012 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whatever, quibble about the legalities if you wish, but the context is learning Russian. Until 20-odd years ago they were speaking Russian, serving in the Red Army, going to RUSSIAN Universities, marrying Russian families and, oh yeah, providing the RUS in Russian.

Another by the way, there's a heck of a lot of Ukrainians, most say about 65+% who consider themselves Russian rather than Ukrainian......
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sparks



Joined: 20 Feb 2008
Posts: 496

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2012 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought the OP was about how similar the two languages are... I would guess that unless you are going to a school to learn Russian, you will learn Ukrainian in your daily interactions. The two languages are very similar, but if you are trying to learn "pure" Russian you may want to be aware of the nuances. I would guess like learning Spanish in Mexico or Spanish in Spain (although some people will claim there are huge differences in the two). You can see major similarities in all slavic languages, sometimes trying to learn more than one can only add to confusion as the temptation to just assume that words/the myriad endings are the same when, in fact, they are slightly different.
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ecocks



Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 855
Location: Gdansk, Poland

PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Just wondering what you folks think of the idea of choosing to learn Russian in Ukraine rather than Russia. Things just seem safer and more stable in Ukraine (relatively speaking, of course). "

Russian in Ukraine is Russian. Most Ukrainians don't speak Ukrainian in everyday activity, most speak Russian.

The Mexican - Spain comparison is a bit off. I would categorize it more like whether native Americans speak American English or whether someone in the Deep South speaks real "Murrican". If you don't think they do, then go taker your classes in Russia.

Anyway, it's good enough for NATO and the US Military, it's good enough for my reply to be "no difference". Others opinions may vary.

As for safety and stability, I wouldn't consider either of them to be that much ahead of the other in that respect. Yankyurkovich is a bit more the thuggie to Putin's suave Mafia don persona but neither cares for anything other than themselves.
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