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Apartment costs in Poland
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dynow



Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 1022

PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 1:23 pm    Post subject: Re: erm Reply with quote

sharter wrote:



Moreover, we rarely mention the rigmarole that is working for many of the schools here in Poland ie the late pay, no pay, tax dodging, split shifts etc etc.


the entire industry is pretty ghetto, and i see no reason to believe that there is something inherently wrong with TEFL that it's the only industry in Poland that holds these types of bad business practices.
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lundjstuart



Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 211
Location: Warsaw, Poland

PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 2:06 pm    Post subject: Re: erm Reply with quote

dynow wrote:
sharter wrote:



Moreover, we rarely mention the rigmarole that is working for many of the schools here in Poland ie the late pay, no pay, tax dodging, split shifts etc etc.


the entire industry is pretty ghetto, and i see no reason to believe that there is something inherently wrong with TEFL that it's the only industry in Poland that holds these types of bad business practices.


It happens because everybody is trying to take advantage of foreigners... in my opinion!
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sharter



Joined: 25 Jun 2008
Posts: 878
Location: All over the place

PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 4:25 pm    Post subject: yep Reply with quote

You're both right Dynow and Lund. Business practice is shabby and foreigners are an easy target. The work problems are endemic the world over in EFL. Your almost like a person who has been trafficked...at the mercy of your guardian, who in most cases is a language school. You're much safer with a university for sure. I feel something very weird and sinister in Poland. 90% of Poles earn f*** all and prices are becoming silly for just about everything. Where is this magic growth going? Into the pockets of a tiny elite I'd say. Poles owe more than they have ever owed. The whole EU membership thing is also something that bothers me as countries like Poland, Slovakia and the Czech Republic are clearly on a different level to the UK, France and Germany. If the EU can't handle Greece, why let a whole bunch of countries with shady work practices in? There are tonnes of pubs in or near Poznan's rynek which are permanently empty yet remain open regardless. The two busiest pubs the rynek ever had ie Harry's and Dom Vikingow, both owned by foreigners couldn't survive-how? Money laundering must be going on and tax avoidance big time. I'm not a Michael Moore fan but he should come here and make a documentary. Poland joined the EU, big business got in employed Poles for peanuts, created new markets, showed the Poles the carrot and they're off. I don't buy it. Forget the capital as capitals are never representative of countries as a whole; Poles don't have any money yet seemingly thrive. I digress but Poland and Europe will go bang soon. Nothing seems to add up. 6zl for a tin of tuna my a**.
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corij



Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

true,somethings dont add up. IF east europeans are on such low wages generally,how come they can afford new cars and fuel (which is the same price or higher as in the UK )
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PeterParvo



Joined: 18 Dec 2011
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My memory of earning money as an English teacher in Poland was that every other month of the school year had some holiday so I never got all my hours. People saying they make X zlotys a month means what? That's what you make in your best month, or is that the average over 12 months? One of the reasons we left was because I could never count on a stable wage, saying nothing of summer.
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Master Shake



Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 914
Location: Itabashi, Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:41 pm    Post subject: misleading Reply with quote

sharter wrote:
I'm stunned by the 160Zl shots of Macallum or the 140Zl steaks. My medicine costs double what it costs in the UK. Kids stuff, electronic goods and clothes cost more, like for like, in Poland....it's just a fact. Therefore I think the rose tinted view some have here is a-inaccurate and b-misleading for newbies.

Misleading? What's really misleading is writing about 350zl meals, 160zl shots and 5000zl five-day binges on a Poland TEFL forum. As if anyone working here actually lives like that. It's just pointless bragging and has no place at all in a debate about cost of living.

sharter wrote:
I still contend that whether we (men) like to admit it or not, we're mostly here because of the nightlife and chicks. If you're a totally average guy, you can still have a beautiful girlfriend and drink beer at the 5zl place if you so wish....ie you can extend YOUR student lifestyle (hence the absence of kids in most of you).

When the big responsibilities kick in (wife, kids, alimony, etc.) people who stay and work here long term (of which there are many on this forum) find a way to earn enough to make it work. They don't work for a dodgy language school; they go into business for themselves, branch out into another field or teacher train. Simon P and J Lund are two examples of this. They were doing quite alright for themselves last time I checked.

Please forgive any typos. It's Sunday morning and I'm hungover from drinking 5zl beer and partying like a student. Wink
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sharter



Joined: 25 Jun 2008
Posts: 878
Location: All over the place

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:18 pm    Post subject: erm Reply with quote

Teachers who thrive here are in a minority. I just have to look at my TEFL teacher pals. Have lots of 'em and most have very little spare cash if any at all. My cost of living update was on the mark. No-one's bragging Shake, it's just that's part of the picture of what you can spend here without even trying if you are blase on occasion. Tapas is hardly an upmarket restaurant in Poznan but 3 mediocre meals (me,son and ex-wife) and a cheap bottle of grog came to 350Zl last week. The Macallum quote was the result of a conversation with a pal of mine who owns a bar I drink in. At the time I was on the JD. Your comments seem tinged with some sort of chippiness. I try to paint the full spectrum from the everyday to the excessive. I don't quote what I spent on the stingiest day in any given period of my life and make that the norm. Spent 250Zl on a week's shopping in Tesco today. No salmon, smoked eel or caviar. Times that by 4 you get 1000Zl. Add rent you get another 1,500Zl. Then add the phone, bills, going out and dating and you can double it. How many TEFLers earn 5,000x12 ie the months of the year. Here, very few. You gotta make 6,500 to take home 5000 anyways....give or take a few quid. And then figure that the 60,000 annual is only 12,000 quid and you get the stark picture. 12K GBP in the EUROPEAN UNION is a shabby wage. You couldn't live easily on that in the UK, so don't expect to here. Why do so many Poles leave if it's so rosy? Why is there the term 'kombinowac'? It's a bloody struggle that's why. There was a time when the teaching kinda compensated for the drop in living standards but the gulf is now much bigger and growing.

You're a geezer, you like the totty and nightlife. Maybe not so much now but that was the lure. Don't try and pretend it's anything else.

There is no pot of gold at the end of this rainbow and there's much better scenery close at hand....not to mention less parochial people.

And how many have got a pension or something put by for if they get sick?

Step outside Warsaw and you'll see pal.
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Master Shake



Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 914
Location: Itabashi, Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:49 pm    Post subject: Re: erm Reply with quote

I'm being called a geezer by someone almost twice my age. Laughing Nice try.

Anyway, you did get part of it right - I don't deny that nightlife in PL is better than back in the States. It's true that Polish girlfriends were a big reason I've stayed as long as I have. I have a distinct feeling this is a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

I hold no grudge, but I know many of your prolific posts are not giving the profession of teaching EFL in Poland a fair shake. That, and some of your figures have just been asinine.

The fact is that teaching Eng can work out if you're committed and want it to, even if you have a family. Maybe you should give it a shot again. You obviously enjoy your time here more than you do in the mid-east sand box you're in now. Stop drinking top shelf and it may well work out for you.
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sharter



Joined: 25 Jun 2008
Posts: 878
Location: All over the place

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:03 pm    Post subject: erm Reply with quote

I don't drink much at all....just the odd bender here and there. 8 months of the year I'm teetotal and there is booze where I'm at I just prefer not to. I'm in Poz now and haven't had a beer since Thursay.....that's quite incredible for the expats I know here!!! Part of the reason for heading to the Middle East was a change of lifestyle...more outdoors, less nightlife...the other part was the lure of loot.

I like my job in North Africa; I get well-paid, I like the beach, I have a few friends there and I have tonnes of free time. Added to that I can afford to do whatever I want pretty much when I'm off for those 4 months of every year on full pay.

I've never had a beef with life inside the classroom in Poland....put simply it's great. I don't even think many of the things that vex me are relevant to just Poland. Dodgy employers are a dime a dozen in this trade. My bread and butter was earned teaching university students and in publishing. Just about every time I wandered into the world of the private school to earn a bit more I got screwed around.

I just think the older you get ad the more responsibility you have, the harder it gets here. It's a fact that most TEFLers I know here are skint and it's not just the people who have developed drink problems. In any bar when you meet expats, you can tell who the teachers are before they say a word.

Before I breathe I pay 2,300zl for a flat, 1,500Zl child support, 600Zl school fees plus bills, food, clothing, going out and other odds and sods. A move back is simply undoable. And, I wouldn't want it. That whole working yourself into the floor just to stand still doesn't cut it for me. Long-term you've got pension issues, sickness problems, dental fees and so on and then the expense of funding kids through uni. Possible if 2 incomes are in the mix but that isn't the case in my situation.

I honestly believe service is dreadful....I'm just trying to figure out why the standing order I set up in person with my bank to pay my landlady on September the 26 was withdrawn last Friday...I mean I have the contract in front of me clearly stating the 26th of every month. It's just a microcosm of all the other appalling service that goes on here. It drives me nuts. The restaurants are shockingly mediocre as are the bars. Filthy toilets, badly cooked food, inconsistent beer.....it's all very poor.

I was in the Czech before Poland...I met my Polish wife in the UK back in 96 and came here. That's why I know it all about the birds; I've yet to meet a male teacher here who isn't or at least wasn't chomping at the bit re the dating scene. We all bat way above our average out here. We're all Kenny Powers.

As a jolly Brit I find the Poles dour....it's a constant; why the long face? I don't think I'm Pole bashing, I just haven't seen otherwise.

On top of that...after nearly 2 decades around these parts it's just become stale.

It could be I'm just becoming a grumpy middle-aged git.
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maniak



Joined: 06 Feb 2008
Posts: 194

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im just wondering if any of you spend money on things like your health or I dont know, a car, hobbies or clothing? This crap is incredibly expensive in Poland. As it sounds like most of you are still living like students.. out of a suitcase with a laptop as your only possession... and most of you are in the 30s?

My budget looks like this:

go to the dentist twice a year for teeth cleaning and next year I need braces, pay for private medical insurance, and still pay ZUS every month, homeowners insurance, car insurance, regularly maintain my car, pay for gas, pay my bills, pay for lawyers/accountants, buy clothes, buy appliances, buy legal computer programs, pay off my student loans, pay for my very expensive hobbies and still try put some cash aside, and when I travel to do it at a semi-comfortable level.. no bumming rides, slow trains, hostels or shared rooms and eat semi-decent food.

For me, thats 4-5000zl minimum per month and thats with no rent. And praying that nothing major breaks or needs replacing anytime soon.
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sharter



Joined: 25 Jun 2008
Posts: 878
Location: All over the place

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:26 am    Post subject: reality at last Reply with quote

I'm in your camp Maniak-couldn't have put it better myself.
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RL



Joined: 23 Jan 2010
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which is better in terms of teaching salary compared to overall cost of living, Poland or the Czech Republic?
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sharter



Joined: 25 Jun 2008
Posts: 878
Location: All over the place

PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 6:57 pm    Post subject: it's been too long... Reply with quote

It's 17 years since I lived in the Czech Republic, so I really can't say.

Forget the capitals. Poland is bigger, so there's probably more out there. Polish girls are better presented but vainer. The beer in the Czech Republic puts the nat's pish of Poland firmly in the gutter where it belongs.

My Czech girlfriend looked like Cindy Crawford......oh for my youth!!!! The Polish ex-wife like Cameron Diaz.

I look like Marlon Brando.....Apocalypse Now......not On the Waterfront.
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RL



Joined: 23 Jan 2010
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Sharter for the info! Hilarious. I like your posts man, some levity in an otherwise serious forum. I'm not in the business (TEFL that is), but I have been considering it for a while. It would be a second career for me - Poland and the Czech Republic are two places that interest me. Both seem like great places. Thanks again for the info.
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sharter



Joined: 25 Jun 2008
Posts: 878
Location: All over the place

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 7:07 pm    Post subject: need any help Reply with quote

RL-need any help just ask. What was your 1st career? If you've got enough to buy a place it'll set you up. Avoid Warsaw-it's a dump....I hated living there even my chauffeur wasn't that happy about it-even dressed in my suit, which he nicked.
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