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ICEAT/KSU Re-Visited...Consider Carefully..
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DenUk



Joined: 08 Aug 2009
Posts: 60
Location: Ask me..

PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 2:32 pm    Post subject: ICEAT/KSU Re-Visited...Consider Carefully.. Reply with quote

Dear Fellow ESL Teachers,

The end of the academic year is fast approaching here at KSU and what a relief it will be for ICEAT.

For those considering coming with ICEAT to KSU for the next academic year or have been given employment offers by them, think twice. ICEAT isn't the company it use to be. Their reputation has been tarnished and here are some of the things they have done:

1) False promises of Iqamas (teachers waited for 9 months! to get their Iqamas. Most gave up and kept their Work Visit Visas)

2) No flight reimbursements (those teachers who were told to leave the night before their visa was due to expire!)

3) Visa and Iqama fees paid by the TEACHERS and not the company

4) Promises broken by the former Project Manager ( who is now the Recruitment Manager and whose name begins with an "A" and is synonymous with cheating and lying)

5) Paid-holiday authorized and given by KSU to companies, yet some ICEAT teachers weren't even paid at all!

6) Family Housing allowances only given if your spouse is with you in Saudi Arabia, otherwise you get single status allowance.

7) A poor and incompetent team working at their office, any process takes weeks to complete.

8. An increasing array of complaints this year from teachers given to KSU's HR Team regarding their pay being docked, ill-treatment by the company, no proper channel of communication etc.

9) Salaries being docked by the MINUTE if teachers are late signing-in and in some cases, whole days being deducted.

I felt it fair and just to given a holistic view of what has been happening this year for those teachers who are considering coming here for the new academic year.

Peace out!
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Bill Frawley



Joined: 07 Mar 2012
Posts: 6
Location: Riyadh

PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Xxxxxxx

Last edited by Bill Frawley on Tue May 29, 2012 9:28 am; edited 1 time in total
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Kornan DeKobb



Joined: 24 Jan 2010
Posts: 242

PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2012 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DenUk wrote:

4) Promises broken by the former Project Manager ( who is now the Recruitment Manager and whose name begins with an "A" and is synonymous with cheating and lying)

Are you clairvoyant? The very day you posted the above, he (whose name ends in an "L") was at it again, spreading another rumor about a teacher in the workplace!
...

Quote:
8. An increasing array of complaints this year from teachers given to KSU's HR Team regarding their pay being docked, ill-treatment by the company, no proper channel of communication etc.

This is true.

Quote:
9) Salaries being docked by the MINUTE if teachers are late signing-in and in some cases, whole days being deducted.

See other KSU/ICEAT/EdEx thread.
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milliman



Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 11:39 am    Post subject: Re: ICEAT/KSU Re-Visited...Consider Carefully.. Reply with quote

first all no company will ever be perfect that is a fact no matter how much you wish them to be good your never going to find teachers that are ever satisfied with what they have.

yes the company lied and have made huge mistakes and i don't condone it but couple questions has to be asked.
1 do they pay you on time?
2 if you are not happy why are you still there?

what annoys me is people who go there and then find it hard to be there and then complain. if you are not happy with the situation leave why stay there and come on here.

i am not speaking on behalf of the company but i am speaking about the stupid choices people make. if you find the company you have signed for is not what it seemed to be before you signed with them. why didn't you do research on them? again why are you still around working for the company.

stop coming on here either do something about it or leave. ESL cafe is not what it used to be

Milli
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12347
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear milliman,

" . . . why didn't you do research on them?"

Agree - everyone should try to research potential employers.


" . . . stop coming on here . . ."


Disagree - that's HOW potential employees can do that research.

You seem to be giving conflicting advice here.

"ESL cafe is not what it used to be"

Ah, but what (or who) is Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy? Lord knows I'm not, and Saudi certainly seems to have gone downhill since the addition of so many "recruiters/contractors." Which is exactly why people posting about them is needed.

Regards,
John
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fledex



Joined: 05 Jun 2011
Posts: 301

PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

People have been warned about KSU and their recruiters (ICEAT, EDEX, and BELL before them). It helps to have new information, though, to know that the recruiters and university haven't changed. By the way, why would KSU's failure to pay have any effect on the teachers? Aren't teachers who are recruited by these agencies working and contracted with these agencies? When I was with EDEX, I was on a fixed salary from them. If whatever university we worked for didn't pay them, that would have been EDEX's problem, not our problem. Maybe teachers should be checking in with the labor dept. in Riyadh to find out more.
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cmp45



Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 1369
Location: KSA

PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fledex wrote:
People have been warned about KSU and their recruiters (ICEAT, EDEX, and BELL before them). It helps to have new information, though, to know that the recruiters and university haven't changed. By the way, why would KSU's failure to pay have any effect on the teachers? Aren't teachers who are recruited by these agencies working and contracted with these agencies? When I was with EDEX, I was on a fixed salary from them. If whatever university we worked for didn't pay them, that would have been EDEX's problem, not our problem. Maybe teachers should be checking in with the labor dept. in Riyadh to find out more.


Shouldn't the question be: Are these teachers working in KSA legally, meaning, do they have an igama? It's my understanding, if they are working in KSA on a business visa then there isn't much help available from a legal stand point. The teacher is at the mercy of their sponsor. If they are on a business visa...well...what can the teacher do really? Quit or do a runnner and cut their losses perhaps? As long as people continue to go with these shady recruiters this problem will persist. If the sponsor does not give the teacher an igama after entering KSA, the teacher is being screwed over; best cut their losses and get the hell out sooner rather than later. If they do have an igama, and are not getting paid, will taking legal action against the sponsor be worth the time and trouble? I guess that is up to the teacher to decide.
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fledex



Joined: 05 Jun 2011
Posts: 301

PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One year in Najran, when Edex was cheating teachers out of part of their salary, a teacher went to the labor department and started complaining. A call from the department, and (I think) a prince getting involved, moved Edex to pay him and the other teachers all that was owed. He was on a visit visa, working illegally. That he was working illegally in itself was enough to get Edex moving. At KSU there are students from enough influential families that could start things rolling if a teacher has a good rapport with them.
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johnslat



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 12347
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear fledex,

While it's true that wasta rules, not too many teachers, especially new ones, have much, if any, of it.

And if a teacher has "good rapport" with a student that has wasta, the teacher had better remember that wasta never comes "free."

Regards,
John
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Linguist



Joined: 22 Feb 2006
Posts: 199

PostPosted: Thu May 17, 2012 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
And if a teacher has "good rapport" with a student that has wasta, the teacher had better remember that wasta never comes "free."


Laughing Laughing Laughing
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 12140
Location: Ultima Thule

PostPosted: Thu May 17, 2012 3:36 pm    Post subject: Tammany Hall Reply with quote

Remember two golden rules that I learned from Damon Runyon

1. There are no free lunches.

2. You can't fight City Hall

Both are valid in KSA
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Grendal



Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Posts: 795
Location: Lurking in the depths of the Faisaliah Tower underground parking.

PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2012 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cmp45 wrote:
fledex wrote:
People have been warned about KSU and their recruiters (ICEAT, EDEX, and BELL before them). It helps to have new information, though, to know that the recruiters and university haven't changed. By the way, why would KSU's failure to pay have any effect on the teachers? Aren't teachers who are recruited by these agencies working and contracted with these agencies? When I was with EDEX, I was on a fixed salary from them. If whatever university we worked for didn't pay them, that would have been EDEX's problem, not our problem. Maybe teachers should be checking in with the labor dept. in Riyadh to find out more.


Shouldn't the question be: Are these teachers working in KSA legally, meaning, do they have an igama? It's my understanding, if they are working in KSA on a business visa then there isn't much help available from a legal stand point. The teacher is at the mercy of their sponsor. If they are on a business visa...well...what can the teacher do really? Quit or do a runnner and cut their losses perhaps? As long as people continue to go with these shady recruiters this problem will persist. If the sponsor does not give the teacher an igama after entering KSA, the teacher is being screwed over; best cut their losses and get the hell out sooner rather than later. If they do have an igama, and are not getting paid, will taking legal action against the sponsor be worth the time and trouble? I guess that is up to the teacher to decide.


Oh wait. Don't forget some teachers have in issue with the point and not really concerned with the amount of money that is reputedly owed the teacher. On behalf of my-self I would like to appeal to these teachers and ask that if the amount is small please come to me first and maybe I can help instead of taking it to the labour board and suing because of one riyal being owed to the teacher and making life for us all here difficult because most of us are hoping our contractor will win the contract again this year and this whole silly matter of money being owed and suing happening to tarnish a contractors image before the final decision is made.

The monetary amount stated in this post is only fictitious and not the real amount but some small amount which I can compensate in order to secure my job here next year.

Grendal

ps sorry but the only way you can get your one riyal is if you formally launch a request to get it from me.
pps here on dave's esl cafe
ppps right now
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teacup05



Joined: 14 Aug 2011
Posts: 15
Location: International

PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2012 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Grendel,
over here at the women's campus, teachers are not complaining about 1 lousy riyal missing from their pay. They are complaining about getting stuck in Bahrain for a couple weeks because of ICEAT mishandling their visas and then not getting paid for the work they missed, even when it's not their fault. They are complaining about being abandoned after getting mugged while in a different city and their passport stolen, meaning they can't get back to Riyadh. They are complaining about having to hand in their passports to get a visa extension, though they were promised iqamas, and then not getting their passports for 5 months or more. We are still being promised iqamas -- but all the iqamas have been assigned to men only. We are complaining about how, because we don't have iqamas, we can't have bank accounts. After about 4 months ICEAT finally figured our how to help us transfer money so we could pay our overseas bills -- before that we had to rely on colleagues and taxi drivers who used their iqamas to transfer our money for us. We are complaining about how, if the bus doesn't show up, it's somehow our fault and we get yelled at for it. We're complaining about having been recruited with the promise we'd have a choice of accommodation, then being housed an hour from campus in a new city block with no stores on our side of a very busy and dangerous street, no restaurants where we can eat, and no place to walk. We're complaining about the ridiculous expectation that if we have flu, we still have to show up to work. Apparently it should be no problem if someone vomits on the bus.
Last (for now) and not least, but very problematic, is the dismissive attitude that ICEAT men take towards the teachers. Problem solving does not come out of disregard, but from respecting each other's perspective and seriously looking for positive alternatives.
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Grendal



Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Posts: 795
Location: Lurking in the depths of the Faisaliah Tower underground parking.

PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2012 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Teacup,

Holy cow!
...................

OK. I have to admit that my better half who works at PNU says the same thing about women's issues, and some of what you mentioned are about the same. Exept that Edex employees have a better deal it seems than the SBC ones. I believe they (Edex) have better holiday packages and salary adjustment/increments on contracts.

Other than this bit of bland information I have not too much else to say about your previously entered post than I am sorry to hear about the unfortunate series of events you've chronicled.

Regards.

Grendal
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fledex



Joined: 05 Jun 2011
Posts: 301

PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bill Frawley wrote:
Xxxxxxx
Edex isn't and better.
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